The lost art of dressing for the occasion

[Deafjeff]

Just stumbled across this article and it rather perfectly sums up how I feel about the over-casualization of America. I don't really mind people wearing what they want on their time but in certain settings I feel certain dress rules should be observed as a sign of respect and this article details some disturbing developments regarding dressing appropriatly in the proper setting. http://mcslimjb.blogspot.com/2011/04/jackets-required-fine-dining-is-dying.html

 

[Shangas]

I find it interesting that you've started this thread.

Just a couple of days ago, I read an article on my local news-website that said that from now on, there would be a STRICT DRESSCODE in place at the Melbourne Cricket Ground (our local sports-stadium) for all men and women attending sporting events there.

Among things that were now, NOT ALLOWED were...

Flip-flops,
Sports shoes,
Tracksuit pants,
T-shirts with offensive material on it,
Jeans,
ANYTHING with rips, stains, missing buttons, etc. Even if it's "designer".
Shoes which are falling apart.
Caps.

And lots of other things I don't recall. Permissable dressing included proper trousers or slacks, proper shoes of the leather, dressier variety, a collared shirt with buttons, a suit, a sportjacket, a proper hat...

This is just for men, by the way. The article didn't specify the Dos & Don'ts for women.

I thought it was very interesting, and a step in the right direction. A day out, even if it's to watch the Football, should be an occasion to dress acceptably.

Also, the matches are often filmed live-to-air. I expect the cameramen were getting tired of filming schlobs sitting in the stands watching football or cricket. Bad form, old boy...

 

[Gin&Tonics]

This is exactly the sort of thing that finally made me say, "Enough is enough!" and start swimming against the stream and dressing "more formally" every day (almost every day, anyways). Of course I wouldn't be caught dead in anything Ed Hardy (known as 'douchebag attire' in many circles) and I don't own flipflops, but I was sick and tired of the overly casual ubiqitous jeans and tee shirt look.

One faint glimmer of hope at least is that several night clubs in Vancouver have a 'no douchebag attire' dress code, so at least they're willing to draw the line somewhere!

Anyways, as one lounger noted, these people make us look better by how poorly they dress, so I guess we can't complain too much!

 

[Shangas]

Anyways, as one lounger noted, these people make us look better by how poorly they dress, so I guess we can't complain too much!

There is a world of truth in that. And yet, one wonders at what cost we keep the Great Unwashed as they are to make us look better. Surely it would be better for them to rise to our level for the mutual benefit of mankind and pay homage to the great craftsman called the tailor.

 

[Uncle Les]

I find, as a rule of sorts, that many of these individuals have never considered bespoke tailoring since they are under the impression it costs a great deal of money. I have friends happy to spend £150 on a shirt simply because it has a branding of some once proud supplier of gentleman's attire. As an example, I recently took delivery from my tailor of a number of lightweight Egyptian cotton shirts, my usual customisation is an elasticated hidden collar button (so as not to be forced to undo when things get a little warmer), small cuff monograms and a custom scalloped collar. He was rather impressed and asked me for the price and where I had purchased said shirt. When I told him it was bespoke and made to my requirements he enquired as to the price, he was rather irritated that his rather ill fitting Ralph Lauren was five times the cost of my selection. We then spoke at length on the subjects of cost and quality and the obvious lower grade of most so called designer clothing.

There are generally two types of people that purchase expensive clothing, the ones that know a good cut and how to wear it and those that think that cost is proportional to quality without the understanding of style. I have to admit it is only in the past ten years I have really enjoyed the opportunity to buy more personalised clothing and I was equally one of those unfortunate victims of cost over substance and style. I agree most strongly with the statement that we should help those with a undeveloped appreciation or understanding of the sartorial delights. We have become accustomed to the enjoyment of a fine cigar, exquisite wine, breathtaking architecture or the enjoyment of slipping into an individually created ensemble. I know, many are beyond our reach and will never develop such interest but for those that have been swayed by marketing consultancies and would develop a similar enjoyment then assist we should. Actually, I know we have many antipodean members here and I was both surprised and amused that during trip to Sydney (I know its not Australia in the same way London is not England) and popped into a bar whilst meeting a lady friend of mine and was asked if I way gay, I replied not insofar as I know and enquired why they asked. The answer was that I was wearing a flower in my lapel and a non business suit. So, yes, I think some people may well be out of our reach

Uncle Les

 

[Captain Lex]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704013604576246911629008064.html


The thrust of that article (linked to by the original) sums it up pretty well. I dress up because it shows I'm making a choice. But the point made in the original article that tuxedos were once required instead of simple business attire really brings home the point to me about how arbitrary and relative those standards are. I don't begrudge any restaurant their right to exercise such restrictions, but I don't believe they contribute to much but nostalgia.


While I understand the idea of dressing appropriately, I don't think it signals a lack of respect. When a person shows up to court in a t-shirt, I think it tells us more about how they feel about t-shirts than court. And if you mandate that respect be shown, then of what value is that respect? It has not been earned.

I like the signature of some Lounger around here..."I would never belong to a club in which I had to wear a hat, or in which I could not wear a hat."

 

[LizzieMaine]

While I understand the idea of dressing appropriately, I don't think it signals a lack of respect. When a person shows up to court in a t-shirt, I think it tells us more about how they feel about t-shirts than court. And if you mandate that respect be shown, then of what value is that respect? It has not been earned.

I think in the case of courts, military salutes, and such as that it's not so much a matter of showing respect as it is an acknowledgement of legally-constituted authority. The judge on the bench might be a corrupt grafting fool, but he still represents the legal authority of the state -- and whether one likes it or not, the citizen is subject to, and is required to acknowledge that authority. If one chooses to ignore that authority, one must expect to take the penalty. I've seen judges throw newspaper reporters out of their courtrooms for daring to show up in a t-shirt, and the next time those reporters showed up, you can bet they were dressed properly.

 

[Captain Lex]

It's certainly true that the judge may impose any restrictions they wish--they could even bar dressing nicely if they chose. But if there are no such restrictions--and certainly some judges don't have them--then I don't think it's necessarily disrespectful to dress in any particular way. I think it's more related to the way clothing is perceived these days. Which isn't to say that a person who wishes to show respect would be misguided to dress up--that would send an unmistakable message. But just because someone doesn't dress up doesn't necessarily mean they disrespect the court or refuse to recognize its authority. They simply (and quite reasonably) don't associate legal authority with suits and ties.

 

[olive bleu]

Personally,I'm tired of going to the symphony and feeling overdressed. Is there no such thing as a special occasion anymore? I'm not implying that only the elite deserve to be entertained, but certainly we all have something in our closets that we consider " our best". It can be a shirt & tie from walmart, but please don't wear sweatpants. And pretty please, don't text while I'm listening to Mahler.

 

[Feraud]

ANYTHING with rips, stains, missing buttons, etc. Even if it's "designer".

I love this one! lol

 

[Angus Forbes]

A year or two ago I attended the symphony in Raleigh, NC (USA) for the first time in years, and was so surprised at how the patrons were dressed. I'm talking about people old enough to know better and rich enough to afford box seats in some cases. Big, fat, dopey looking men in kids clothing ; women in full-uniform slobwear. Not everyone, but more than half. Phooey!

 

[Jim Brown]

another one of these threads I see.... let the bashing begin....

 

[Deafjeff]

another one of these threads I see.... let the bashing begin....

The purpose of this thread is not to bash anyone. I simply found it interesting and a little bit disheartening to see that classical establishments were lowring thier dress standards. Not out of snobbery or some sense of being better than the average guy out there but because I love history and the past and the clothing styles of the past just like mosgt everyone on this site. And the classical resturants once visited by past presidents and movie stars from Old Hollywood appeal to me and my sense of history and I feel it is sad to see that old sense of dressing right for a special occasion such as going out has apparently evaporated. No bashing, just nostalgia for the past and wondering what happened to being able to dress for the proper occasion.

 

[Jim Brown]

The purpose of this thread is not to bash anyone. I simply found it interesting and a little bit disheartening to see that classical establishments were lowring thier dress standards. Not out of snobbery or some sense of being better than the average guy out there but because I love history and the past and the clothing styles of the past just like mosgt everyone on this site. And the classical resturants once visited by past presidents and movie stars from Old Hollywood appeal to me and my sense of history and I feel it is sad to see that old sense of dressing right for a special occasion such as going out has apparently evaporated. No bashing, just nostalgia for the past and wondering what happened to being able to dress for the proper occasion.

Still seems like just another thread bashing on today's dress.

But since you're so much into history.. why not do the entire 1940's experience in dinning...

 

[John in Covina]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704013604576246911629008064.html


The thrust of that article (linked to by the original) sums it up pretty well. I dress up because it shows I'm making a choice. But the point made in the original article that tuxedos were once required instead of simple business attire really brings home the point to me about how arbitrary and relative those standards are. I don't begrudge any restaurant their right to exercise such restrictions, but I don't believe they contribute to much but nostalgia.


While I understand the idea of dressing appropriately, I don't think it signals a lack of respect. When a person shows up to court in a t-shirt, I think it tells us more about how they feel about t-shirts than court. And if you mandate that respect be shown, then of what value is that respect? It has not been earned.

Next time in court go inside the actual court area and tell the judge he hasn't earned your respect. Courtesy and respect go hand in hand if you elect to not show respect to someone that hasn't earned your respect because you don't know them could come off as predjudicial and rather impolite. Compulsion often creates a backlash but politeness and courtesy rarely fail.

 

[reetpleat]

The purpose of this thread is not to bash anyone. I simply found it interesting and a little bit disheartening to see that classical establishments were lowring thier dress standards. Not out of snobbery or some sense of being better than the average guy out there but because I love history and the past and the clothing styles of the past just like mosgt everyone on this site. And the classical resturants once visited by past presidents and movie stars from Old Hollywood appeal to me and my sense of history and I feel it is sad to see that old sense of dressing right for a special occasion such as going out has apparently evaporated. No bashing, just nostalgia for the past and wondering what happened to being able to dress for the proper occasion.

Well, I am a lover of vintage suits and other attire. Love it. But I could not care less about modern formal or informal dress. Most suits look cheap and tacky to me these days. I can apprecite a well dressed gent in a well cut suit, but not that big a deal to me.

Back in San Francisco in the 90s, I would be a little annoyed if too many people were not dressed vintage at a swing show. It ruined my illusion. So, I suppose I might prefer just barely, to have a dining room full of well dressed people versus t shirts. But not much. If they are not dressed in vintage suits and dresses, it does very little for the atmosphere as far as I am concerned.

But of course, others here love something different than I do, which is a world in which people dress well. I can appreciate that, but not much.

As I haev said beforee, I am just here for the vintage suits and a bit of conversation.

 

[AtomicEraTom]

I know there is complaint and contempt toward modern attire here, but what's really wrong with that? Shouldn't people have a place to go and talk with other people about things they like and don't like?

It reminds me of something my dad always says. Well, there's nothing you can do about it, so what can you do? Piss and moan.

I think it's somewhat therapeutic to get together with folks and discuss common interests and/or disinterests. To each their own, I suppose.

 

[John in Covina]

It's kind of the idea of where do you draw the line and do you acknowledge there is a slide.

If I were getting married and my guests showed up in pajamas and bathrobes I'd be miffed. Sports jersey and shorts. Jeans and a t-shirt Come in clean jeans wearing a shirt with a collar - I am not miffed. Shirt tie better.

The concept that I can show up anywheres for anything to see anyone wearing flipflops and a Depends under a bathrobe is narcissistic. To focus is on self and what i want and the disregard is on anything, anyone and anywheres else. Now it is that matter of degree. If all of humanity decides it is OK, I know that i don't want to join in and will be disappointed.

 

[AtomicEraTom]

I was just on the phone with a friend of mine about 20 minutes ago. He was telling me about his wedding, which is coming up soon. He told me he's getting 'all dressed up' which consists of a black dress shirt and khaki pants. I was just kinda surprised that that's proper attire for a groom these days. I didn't say anything, because it's not my wedding. I would have been offended if people came to my wedding dressed like that.

If I were getting married and my guests showed up in pajamas and bathrobes I'd be miffed. Sports jersey and shorts. Jeans and a t-shirt Come in clean jeans wearing a shirt with a collar - I am not miffed. Shirt tie better.

 

[John in Covina]

Well, I am a lover of vintage suits and other attire. Love it. But I could not care less about modern formal or informal dress. Most suits look cheap and tacky to me these days. I can apprecite a well dressed gent in a well cut suit, but not that big a deal to me.

Back in San Francisco in the 90s, I would be a little annoyed if too many people were not dressed vintage at a swing show. It ruined my illusion. So, I suppose I might prefer just barely, to have a dining room full of well dressed people versus t shirts. But not much. If they are not dressed in vintage suits and dresses, it does very little for the atmosphere as far as I am concerned.

But of course, others here love something different than I do, which is a world in which people dress well. I can appreciate that, but not much.

As I haev said beforee, I am just here for the vintage suits and a bit of conversation.

It is a rare treat to go to some type of event and have full participation in vintage. Down this way at the Cicada Club it can get pretty close, some of the Fedora lounge events get close and i understand the Art Deco society nails it now and then.