The general decline in standards today

[vitanola]

I've long thought the same thing. If I were ever in a position of power to effect such a change it would be the very first thing I'd do.

Were most of the changes that took place in the 1980's rolled back we as a nation would be much the better for it.

 

[Stearmen]

[video=youtube;aVSORyNwNeU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVSORyNwNeU[/video]

 

[LuvMyMan]

The comptroller of Dixon, a small northern Illinois town whose prior claim to fame was as the home town of Ronald Reagan, was arrested for embezzling 53 million over something like 22 years.

"A million here and a million there and pretty soon you're talking real money."

When ever we hear or read about someone that has taken this much money it really sort of gets us "miffed".....mostly as they did not bother to send at least ONE of those million dollars OUR way! LOL

There is a lot of "theft" by doctors also that file bogus medical claims to insurance companies. That really bugs me very much....makes good doctors get a black eye over it.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Were most of the changes that took place in the 1980's rolled back we as a nation would be much the better for it.

If ever there was a point where what was left of the Era was tossed over the cliff, the 1980s were it. If the '60s were the '30s with worse music, the '80s were the '50s with twice the mendacity.

 

[Matt Crunk]

What about the doctor's that prescribe these things?

The doctor (and pharmacists in the sense of filling prescriptions) should be a gatekeeper. I don't buy the excuse that people "beg" and "harass" their doctors until they get a drug and the poor doctor has no choice but prescribe it.

A doctor is a person who went to school for 8 years, followed by at least 3 years of residency (in the U.S.), and then often additional training- I believe you can estimate within a reasonable degree if a person needs narcotics.

The flip side of this is that a lot of doctors are reluctant to prescribe pain medication, even when it's clear that the patient has a legitimate medical need for it.

In my case, I have a very bad foot (collapsed arch and bone misalignment) stemming from a mis-diagnosed fracture that occurred a few years ago. Only expensive reconstructive surgery will correct the problem, and currently I can afford neither the surgery itself nor the six to eight weeks off my feet that it is required afterward. My only choice in the meantime has been to walk as little as possible and deal with the pain as best I can. The pain is not constant, but it can at times get very severe. My old doctor in the town where I used to live prescribed me Hydrocodone in the form of Lortab 10, which I always took very responsibly and a lot less often than directed - usually limiting myself to two or three pills per week rather than the "every six to eight hours, as needed" directed by the label. Therefore a one month supply would usually last me up to six months or more. It is obvious I do not abuse the drug.

Well, no matter. The doctor in the small town where I now live will not prescribe a narcotic, period. I have to travel back to my old doctor, more than a two hour round trip, in order to get the only pain medication I have found to work for me. Then I have to deal with the pharmacist looking at me funny for bringing in one prescription from one doctor and everything else from another. Worst of all it makes me feel almost like a criminal just for asking for the medication I need.

It's never a good thing when responsible people in a society are penalized for the actions of the irresponsible.

 

[LizzieMaine]

What strikes me as odd is that the FDA has been quite aggressive in regulating non-narcotic pain medications like Vioxx -- which was taken off the market ten years ago because it could cause heart problems. Opiate-based medications like the codones and the cocets have left a trail of abuse, addiction and death in their wake over the last twenty years or so, and are banned for any use in much of Europe. And yet too many American doctors continue to hand them out like aspirin. Follow the money.

I'm not unsympathetic to people who suffer with chronic pain. I've had to deal with debilitating migraines since I was ten years old, and also deal with recurring sciatica, which leaves me unable to sit comfortably in a chair for three or four months at a time. But I was given morphine in the hospital for two days once, and that's as much of a narcotic experience as I ever want to have, no matter how bad the pain gets. I'd rather deal with it with Excedrin and ice bags.

 

[HudsonHawk]

I've been battling a bout of shingles over the last 10 days. My doctor gave me a prescription for hydrocodone for the pain. It helped a little, I guess, but probably not as much, certainly not any more, than a couple of ibuprofen. So I only took one or two of the hydrocodone. For me, it didn't give me that warm fuzzy feeling like morphine or that that "stoned out of your gourd so you don't care if someone's driving a railroad spike through your eye socket" feeling of codeine. So it's hard for me to see how one could become addicted to it. But I know everyone is different.

 

[Matt Crunk]

I've been battling a bout of shingles over the last 10 days. My doctor gave me a prescription for hydrocodone for the pain. . . . For me, it didn't give me that warm fuzzy feeling like morphine. . . . So it's hard for me to see how one could become addicted to it. But I know everyone is different.

It probably greatly depends on the dosage. Lortab 5 does nothing for me. They don't even really seem to dull the pain. But Lortab 10 works very well, while giving me just a touch of that "warm, fuzzy" feeling. Don't know what it would do in larger doses as, like I said, I don't abuse them. Ever.
. . . and, like you said, everyone is different.

 

[HudsonHawk]

It probably greatly depends on the dosage. Lortab 5 does nothing for me. They don't even really seem to dull the pain. But Lortab 10 works very well, while giving me just a touch of that "warm, fuzzy" feeling. Don't know what it would do in larger doses as, like I said, I don't abuse them. Ever.
. . . and, like you said, everyone is different.

Yeah, I don't know much about dosages, but I'm sure that greatly affects everything. I know one thing...codeine did a number on me though.

 

[LuvMyMan]

Some of the real heavy weight pain pills are not around any more. Too much danger with them. However, some folks get hooked on any type of pain pills. I think we have a shoe box filled with all sorts of codeine 3 and a few others, and some morphine. But we have not used them, I should say Daniel has not used them. Now that I think of it, I should flush them all. Hydrocodone did not do anything for Daniel's pain and almost all these pain meds will make you have issues with....well...no polite way to say it...they BIND you up...badly. Then it is laxative time then something to BIND you up as you took a ton of laxatives and finally they all worked at the same time....lol! That is why Daniel decided to just stop using any pain meds at all.

 

[LuvMyMan]

What strikes me as odd is that the FDA has been quite aggressive in regulating non-narcotic pain medications like Vioxx -- which was taken off the market ten years ago because it could cause heart problems. Opiate-based medications like the codones and the cocets have left a trail of abuse, addiction and death in their wake over the last twenty years or so, and are banned for any use in much of Europe. And yet too many American doctors continue to hand them out like aspirin. Follow the money.

I'm not unsympathetic to people who suffer with chronic pain. I've had to deal with debilitating migraines since I was ten years old, and also deal with recurring sciatica, which leaves me unable to sit comfortably in a chair for three or four months at a time. But I was given morphine in the hospital for two days once, and that's as much of a narcotic experience as I ever want to have, no matter how bad the pain gets. I'd rather deal with it with Excedrin and ice bags.

When you listen to some medications that are being advertised on television and you listen to the 20 things the person says really fast about side effects it is really making me think, the FDA is not so good. How can they approve a medication for depression but..one of the side effects are suicide...heart failure, liver failure, blindness, congestion, dizzy spells, memory loss, decrease in "sex drive"...(no more Varoom there)....and a dozen other potential bad news side effects BUT the FDA approved the medication! Now I cannot say about anyone else, but, I would think the depression is much safer to deal with if you did not take the medication that can have all these side effects. I am sure however, even if a arm or leg falling off was a side effect, some people would still buy and use the stuff.

 

[LizzieMaine]

A bit of an update on our Prominent Local Embezzler -- a bank audit revealed that he got away with more than $3.8 million dollars since December of 2001, simply by endorsing donor checks and depositing them in a personal account. He wasn't even a brilliant master criminal -- but the people supervising him were even less brilliant.

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

When you listen to some medications that are being advertised on television and you listen to the 20 things the person says really fast about side effects it is really making me think, the FDA is not so good. How can they approve a medication for depression but..one of the side effects are suicide...heart failure, liver failure, blindness, congestion, dizzy spells, memory loss, decrease in "sex drive"...(no more Varoom there)....and a dozen other potential bad news side effects BUT the FDA approved the medication! Now I cannot say about anyone else, but, I would think the depression is much safer to deal with if you did not take the medication that can have all these side effects. I am sure however, even if a arm or leg falling off was a side effect, some people would still buy and use the stuff.

If you're talking about Prozac, I agree. It's nasty stuff and should be banned. I've said it before that even though I consider Scientology to be horses**t, I do agree with them on one thing: that psychiatry is dangerous mind control that only screws people up even more so.

 

[nick123]

Ah, psychiatry. My one beef with it is that doctors are so quick to prescribe medication, when there are other things that mimic illness, such as stress or hormones, that may go away in due course. My advice to anyone considering starting that stuff, is to really do their homework and be sure they really need it.
It's not an excedrin. It's really intense, expensive, hard to get off of, and potentially dangerous stuff.
Obviously there are people who are in dire need of anything to possibly get them better, but for the "Jimmy's having a bad day at school" scenario proceed with caution! Can't fault the doctor though. In my experience diagnostics isn't an exact science and most truly take an interest in their patients. It wouldn't surprise me to find corruption within the pharmaceutical companies though.
I've been taking the stuff for years (OCD-same medication used to treat bipolar disorder) and that's my two cents.

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

And it seems that many of the mass shootings that have occurred in the last thirty years or so were perpetrated by people who were on some sort of anti-depression medication. How does one go from not being able to get out of bed in the morning to overwhelming violent urges to kill random, innocent people??? :doh:

 

[LizzieMaine]

A lot of that stuff can be triggered by abruptly going off an anti-psychotic medication, or even reducing the dosage too quickly. I've seen, up close, what can happen in these cases, and it's absolutely terrifying.

These medications can save lives when used properly -- but the patient has to be closely and carefully supervised to ensure compliance. They aren't cure-alls, and they aren't candy.

 

[Foxer55]

LizzieMaine,

A bit of an update on our Prominent Local Embezzler -- a bank audit revealed that he got away with more than $3.8 million dollars since December of 2001, simply by endorsing donor checks and depositing them in a personal account. He wasn't even a brilliant master criminal -- but the people supervising him were even less brilliant.

Get this... I own a home in Pennsylvania, in a prominent county outside of Philadelphia. About ten years ago, as it turns out, our tax collector was discovered to have absconded with $8 Million dollars of tax funds. He was drunkenly gambling it away at the big, high rent Jersey shore joints, even had cops spiriting the money down there by helicopter to him. It was actually in the local paper that he would call and send cops to his office to draw money from his safe and fly it to New Jersey. Judge gave him probation but the locals (including me) screamed bloody murder about it so he got "some" jail time but there was pity on him for his claim to alcohol made me do it. $8 Million bucks!

The guy lived in one of the most lavish developments in the township, owned a sailboat, he and his wife both drove MBs or BMWs, whatever. On top of that, it turns out, his claim to a degree and graduate degree were both also found to be fabrications. I just don't understand how people get away with it.

 

[LuvMyMan]

LizzieMaine,



Get this... I own a home in Pennsylvania, in a prominent county outside of Philadelphia. About ten years ago, as it turns out, our tax collector was discovered to have absconded with $8 Million dollars of tax funds. He was drunkenly gambling it away at the big, high rent Jersey shore joints, even had cops spiriting the money down there by helicopter to him. It was actually in the local paper that he would call and send cops to his office to draw money from his safe and fly it to New Jersey. Judge gave him probation but the locals (including me) screamed bloody murder about it so he got "some" jail time but there was pity on him for his claim to alcohol made me do it. $8 Million bucks!

The guy lived in one of the most lavish developments in the township, owned a sailboat, he and his wife both drove MBs or BMWs, whatever. On top of that, it turns out, his claim to a degree and graduate degree were both also found to be fabrications. I just don't understand how people get away with it.

That is a shame. You know if you or I did that, we'd swing at the end of a rope at the gallows. Sad even that not a penny of all those millions made it to my purse! LOL! Someone just was not watching what happened until it was too late. It does happen more than what ever makes the news. Greed. People steal a lot. Some are "elected" and in REALLY high positions and steal like crazy.

 

[LuvMyMan]

If you're talking about Prozac, I agree. It's nasty stuff and should be banned. I've said it before that even though I consider Scientology to be horses**t, I do agree with them on one thing: that psychiatry is dangerous mind control that only screws people up even more so.

That is one of them...I think there are a few other medications similar. The FDA should take a new name....Future Drug Addict.

 

[nick123]

A lot of that stuff can be triggered by abruptly going off an anti-psychotic medication, or even reducing the dosage too quickly. I've seen, up close, what can happen in these cases, and it's absolutely terrifying.

These medications can save lives when used properly -- but the patient has to be closely and carefully supervised to ensure compliance. They aren't cure-alls, and they aren't candy.

Really true. You have to be so careful when you get off of them. It's a very slow process, to minimize the chances of complication. People that stop taking them without weening off really aren't doing themselves any favors.