The Denim Thread: Questions & Answers, Pics & Fits

[majormajor]

Here's a couple of shots of a pair of 1937 Lee Rider 101Bs. Cinch back, but no braces/suspender buttons. Lovely shaped pockets and hair-on-hide branded Lee patch. Double selvedge.

Close fitting at the top, but roomy in the thigh and below. Bought as dry deadstock from Aero, and worn for around a year, and washed regularly....

The ONLY issue I have with these jeans seems to go for EVERY decent jean that comes out of Japan. As soon as they hit on a classic design, they stop making the bloody things. There are currently NO deadstock 1930's 101s on Lee Japan's site. If the Japanese do ONE thing this year, committing to REGULAR production would be a great start.....

Here, for good measure is the rare (well, hard to source in the UK) zip-collar Lee shirt I happen to be wearing today!

 

[GriffDeLaGriff]

I have to agree, and disagree again.

I have "washed" my raw Iron Hearts twice prior any use. First wear period on both pairs was 4 weeks I think, in rotation with other jeans. I wear jeans 1 week air them properly and rotate with 2 or three pairs. After about 3 weeks use (see not continious wear) I toss them in to the washer. That gets them personal for me.

Here's sanforized 634S 21oz. They have been used as I described and have abot 6 mo or a bit more actual wear.



and to me, it's not about the fading, these are just so good in every aspect. IMHO

Yeah, but it looks like your jeans get alot more action then mine. This works well with the fact that your jeans getting smellier then mine in a shorter period of time. I agree that what you have there is perfect and I wouldnt push it if I had that in sucha short time......but I dont.

The fact is that you get more contrast fadings if you dont wash. The reason is that the creses stay in the same place and continues to get rubs/distress. When washing they can get creases in new places so the fading become less. This is fact to a point, some creses will develop in the same place, some will not.

I have used my 634s for more then a year before first wash and mine doesnt have the same amount of fadings as yours.

So......it is different for diferent people. How you use them, where, how hard and so on.

 

[eClairvaux]

I own three pairs of Iron Hearts and wash them all the time, simply because I can't get away with more than 5 days or wearing them straight. I also don't mind, I don't buy that whole non-washing thing. That was what brought Europe the plague, remember people

I am still quite happy with how they develop and really like the weight and (eventual) comfort of 21oz. That said, the thickness of the fabric is putting a serious strain on the seams, so I had some sewing done on my 634S. The DC4001's which are the best IH's I have seen/owned yet, with lots of clever improvements didn't need any mending so far. Finally the IH808 double knee logger seems impossible to kill, or even making them loose some color at all. Very good for traveling and wet weather!

IH-808:

IH634S with some damage on them:

DC4001's when new:

For reference, I am 1,81 cm or just under 6", 85kg or 187lbs. The sizing is 33W (DC4001, IH808) or 34W (IH634).

 

[Fanch]

Everything that I have seen in this thread is reminiscent of the 1940's and early 1950's look.

 

[majormajor]

Everything that I have seen in this thread is reminiscent of the 1940's and early 1950's look.

Pretty much par for the course on FL. That's why we are here

 

[injunjack]

634S pocket opening is a bitch...too small, so that's what happens I'd say every pair.

And Griff, I have NOT noticed any movement of "combs" due washing. after 3-4 weeks wear they are pretty much settled.

Too pronounced fading looks like sandblasted to me, predistressed....

but as you said, what rocks my boat doesn't necessarily rock yours...

 

[Dav]

Here's my pair of sanforized 25oz Iron Heart 634XHS's, had them for over a year now and must say they are the most comfortable pair of jeans I own, so long as the weather isn't to hot that is.

 

[Graemsay]

I've not been entirely struck by the Levis / LVC reproduction jeans. Prices in Europe went up sometime in the last year, and I don't think that they offer good value for money these days. Something like a pair of Ironheart jeans wouldn't be significantly more.

I mentioned Tender in the other thread. They use 16 or 17 oz denim, which is a bit heavier than the likes of Levi.

They do three cuts: 129 (skinny), 130 (slim), 132 (loose), and tend to fit true to size. This is a photo of the 132s stolen from Superdenim.

Tender use unsanforised denim, but much of what they produce is hand dyed using woad, weld, logwood or other vegetable dyes, which shrinks them down. If you get a raw pair then expect to lose a couple of inches off the waist.

Aero have the 132 at a very good price, but my favourites are the "Submariner" 130s that Tenue de Nimes sell. These have matching (stealthed) stitching, which makes them look very clean, but they'll come out when they fade. No pictures, as they shrank too much to fit comfortably - I need to go on a diet.

If you want something a bit more twenty-first century, then check outDenham. The top-end, Japanese denim jeans are much nicer than LVC's, though at a similar price point.

Their Garment Library is really interesting. They have a really cool 30s or 40s wool and leather Ike jacket in it. Not for sale, unfortunately.

 

[Cooperson]

Here's sanforized 634S 21oz. They have been used as I described and have abot 6 mo or a bit more actual wear.

and to me, it's not about the fading, these are just so good in every aspect. IMHO

Great looking jeans but can you actually get your hands in the front pockets? They look quite high and tight.

 

[majormajor]

I've not been entirely struck by the Levis / LVC reproduction jeans. Prices in Europe went up sometime in the last year, and I don't think that they offer good value for money these days. Something like a pair of Ironheart jeans wouldn't be significantly more.

???

To say Iron Hearts "wouldn't be significantly more" in price is a little misleading

Those 634XHSs posted by Dav are a beautiful pair of jeans. But they cost almost TWICE the price of LEE Japan stuff

And whilst they are good - they are not TWICE as good

With regards to Tender - no doubt excellent, lovingly produced jeans - with (IMHO) the most boring unwieldy back pocket design ever.....:eeek:

 

[Graemsay]

The LVC reproduction 501s are selling for £215, whereas most Ironhearts sell for $400, or £250.

I appreciate the Lees are significantly cheaper, but I haven't tried them myself. Though I did have a couple of pairs of 101s a few years back that were nice.

Incidentally, I find the Tender back pockets work fine. And I don't mind the lack of arcs.

 

[Graemsay]

If you're into heavy denim there's a two year abuse your jeans competition starting in April. Details have been posted at Superfuture, Indigo Roots and Ironheart.

Rivet and Hide are offering the Steel Feather 21 oz unsanforised jeans for a discount (use code HWDC2) to competitors, and Ironheart have a contest specific pair of 25 oz Beatle Busters. Unfortunately neither look like they'll work for me.

 

[Ishmael]

Just wanted to say thanks for all the great reviews on here! Think we all can agree that there are a bewildering number of great jeans to choose from today. Great to see the different first hand accounts and views.

I've been really wanting a pair of IH's for a long time. I think the 634s are one the best denim and cuts out there. I just can't get past the arcs. It's silly, I know, but I wish they were symmetrical.

These are my favorite arcs. Jeans are from MOTOR, a new branch of MOTO Leather & Silver, one of the top Japanese makers of fine leather goods and shoes. If you're ever in Tokyo, definitely check these guys out. They only do a couple of jeans, but they have wonderful wallets, shoes, etc.

http://www.motostyle.jp/motor/motor-top.html
http://www.motostyle.jp/leather-silver/moto-top.html
http://www.styleforum.net/t/299228/leather-arts-crafts-moto-aoyama-tokyo-japan-appreciation-thread

 

[majormajor]

Hi Graemsay

The 634XHSs I mentioned are $495 - that's £312...

LEE Japan 1930s stuff from Aero in £150....Less than half the price - for jeans (IMHO) just as good.

Looked at the "competition" blogs - gotta say, that is bizarre.

Here's a thing. Take a brand new pair of dry deadstock jeans. Soak them in warm water for five minutes. Put them on and sit down in them. Take some very fine grade sandpaper, and lightly rub wherever there are creases in the denim, along with the fronts down to your knees. Bottom of the back pockets, too. Take them off.Put 'em in a hot wash. Hey presto! The "Iron Heart" "I wore 'em for 12 months and then washed them" look....

It takes about two hours tops - and these guys are having a frigging competition?? Ah well. Takes all sorts

 

[Graemsay]

Yeah, the 634 XHS are really expensive. But they're relatively cheap compared to some brands...

As for the contest, I might be tempted for a giggle. But given my approach to denim care is to chuck it into the washing machine every few weeks and not get fixated by soaks, fancy shampoos, vinegar or only bathing them in the sea during high tide on a full moon, I almost certainly won't win.

Ishmael, Aero have a pair of half price Iron Heart 1955S with non-standard symmetrical arcs. But they're in size 30 (will stretch an inch or two) so might not be your size.

 

[Ishmael]

I could be down for some high moon denim sea bathing. Think I'll need something a little stronger than vinegar though.

Those Aero x IH look nice. But I can't fit into a 30. Selfedge has (or had) some IH with arcs more to my liking, but I refuse to pay an arm and a leg of markups to bring the jeans back to Japan!

 

[injunjack]

As I said, 634S poskets are very tight. They'll stretch a bit eventually. I don't carry much in my frontpockets, just some coins and a Zippo. If there is a flaw in 634S, it's how the front pockets are designed. Luckily there are other styles to choose...inside IH brand.

BTW, those Lee/Japan jeans Aero is carrying aren't heavy weight denim, they're around 13oz. Once you have had heavier jeans there is no turning back. Normal 13-14oz feels just flimsy, and I have Sugar Canes, Lee's (also the limited '66 101 "beatles" cut) etc. They just don't get worn much anymore.

Also check out Pike Brothers offerings....nice stuff.

and Ishmael, theres a reason why IH arcs are what they are. Levi's is very strict about copyright....

 

[Ishmael]

Just saw those Pike Brothers on Silvetto. Look very nice. And, damn, Silvetto has an awesome selection. Looks like a fine shop.

I think you are referring to the fact that Levi's had IH change their arcs at some point due to alleged infringement or something of that nature, right? Still they could go symmetrical, no? Anyway, I'm not complaining. I know many people like their arcs. And I don't find them all that bad. But, to me at least, their standard arcs unfortunately turn a classic jean into something just a little too contemporary. Same with Flathead. I'm sure it won't stop me from buying at least one pair though.

I think the MOTOR denim I posted above are a damn good example of paying homage to Levis, but at the same time making a new mark!

 

[injunjack]

Ishmael, you can always take the arcs off, 5 min. job...And I agree on FH arcs. IH arcs have grown on me...

and I think I have seen similar arcs to MOTOR denim....on some very el cheapo low-end jeans, can't dig those, and further from Levi, the better, IMHO

 

[GriffDeLaGriff]

Here's a thing. Take a brand new pair of dry deadstock jeans. Soak them in warm water for five minutes. Put them on and sit down in them. Take some very fine grade sandpaper, and lightly rub wherever there are creases in the denim, along with the fronts down to your knees. Bottom of the back pockets, too. Take them off.Put 'em in a hot wash. Hey presto! The "Iron Heart" "I wore 'em for 12 months and then washed them" look....

It takes about two hours tops - and these guys are having a frigging competition?? Ah well. Takes all sorts

I tried that years ago, it doesnt produce the same result.
Sandpaper also cuts the fibers (even if its fine sandpaper) so you most likely will get holes in some places.
Yes you can get holes the normal way too, but it just doesnt look the same.