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Stitch Awl Tutorial - Sweatband Installation

scottyrocks

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Isle of Langerhan, NY
Potentially stupid question re the stitch awl:

I bought a package that contains 70/9 Singer sewing machine needles. They are too small for the Tandy Leather stitich awl I bought. The chuck wont tighten down enough to keep it in place. Wrong needle? Wrong stitch awl? Something else?
 

Brad Bowers

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4,187
I haven't seen the Tandy awl, but I would say it's the difference in the awls. You might have to find a way to bulk up the needle for the chuck, like wrapping duct tape around it, or a similar method. As long as the needle won't move on you.

Brad
 

Bob Smalser

One of the Regulars
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139
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Hood Canal, Washington
scottyrocks said:
The chuck wont tighten down enough to keep it in place.

Just look for needles with fat shanks and a groove and eye sufficiently large for button or upholstery thread.

These Pfaff #130 denim needles work fine with upholstery thread.

361634989.jpg


And if you wax your thread first with a candle stub or piece of beeswax, it's easier to keep the stitches tight. All these harness stitchers were intended for use with waxed thread.
 

scottyrocks

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Isle of Langerhan, NY
Okay, thanks, guys.

Im using the large needle that came with my awl.

I have to say, at this point, that this is an exasperating process. Im getting the hang of what Im doing, but how many ways can you put a piece of thread through a loop?

Ill tell you. Quite a few different ways, apparently, because half the time when I pull the awl out, the needle is in the middle of the stitich instead of on the end of it and I either have to unthread the needle, put it through the loop on the outside and rethread, or I have to take the stitch out completely and redo it. I dont get what Im doing wrong. Theres only one loop in there when you put the needle in.

Anyway, I'm about a 1/4 the way around, and its going well, if slowly. Ive been taking pictures along the way, and I guess Ill post the whole thing when (or if I ever get) finished.
 

Brad Bowers

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That's what I meant when I said you have to be careful which loop you put the thread through.

Oh, yeah, it's slow going through the learning process, and just using a needle and thread is faster until you get the hang of the stitch awl. I guess I should only recommend the stitch awl if you're going to be doing quite a few hats. One or two, it's probably not worth the trouble to learn.

Keep going, you'll get there.

Brad
 

Bob Smalser

One of the Regulars
Messages
139
Location
Hood Canal, Washington
scottyrocks said:
... because half the time when I pull the awl out, the needle is in the middle of the stitich instead of on the end of it and I either have to unthread the needle, put it through the loop on the outside and rethread, or I have to take the stitch out completely and redo it....

It's simple, it just takes some practice. Even with fixing your mistakes, the stitch awl is a heckuva lot easier than making all those lock stitches using traditional needle and sewing palm.

The needle has a grooved side and a smooth side.

Always insert the needle so the grooved side has a consistent orientation.

Always insure the loop you form to insert the backing thread into is on the smooth side of the needle.
 

scottyrocks

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Okay, now Ive got the hang of it. And I also figured out that if the needle winds up in the middle of the stitch, I can pass the awl through the loop on the outside, and itll be in the right place.

Moving along smartly, now. Im psyched!
 

scottyrocks

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Isle of Langerhan, NY
I was on such a roll last night after my 'passing the awl through the loop' discovery that I stayed up until you-dont-wanna-know-when, and finished the hat completely - sewed up the back stitching, put the ribbon back on, and fitted the liner. I will post pics at some point after I get home.

I had also discovered that attaching a sewing needle to the end of the inside piece of thread made it tremendously easier to place the thread through the inside loop under the sweat.
 

scottyrocks

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Location
Isle of Langerhan, NY
Okay, here we go.

Here's the hat before work began. Notice the ragged sweat, to the point of that wire sticking out of it (terminology, please?) and plastic liner at the top of the crown.

0416091017.jpg


0416091017a.jpg


0416091018.jpg


0416091018a.jpg



Here's the hat with the old sweat removed. Seam rippers rock.

0417091344.jpg



Old sweat / new sweat:

0417091648.jpg



Completely stripped down:

0417091649.jpg


0417091649a.jpg



I used another Dobbs of mine to give me an idea of just where the bottom of the sweat is supposed to sit:

0419091622a.jpg



I tried basting the sweat in, but it was impossible. So I did this instead. Worked great:

0419092051.jpg
 

scottyrocks

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Location
Isle of Langerhan, NY
I used Brad's photo as a guide as to what the stitching should look like. here's mine. They were pulled tight before tieing off. I tried a letter opener but had better success with the shank of the stitch aw's needle:

0419092127.jpg



All tied off. omg, did I go through a learning curve here:

0419092128.jpg



Ribbon put back:

0420090039.jpg



I carefully tore the ragged plastic out of the liner and reinserted it with double sided tape:

0420090040a.jpg



It's by no means perfect, but I think it's quite good for a first attempt. The next one, in almost as bad condition, should go a bit quicker.
 

ScottF

Call Me a Cab
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2,755
Excellent tutorial. I have three stripped hats that I need to add sweatbands to. I would like to use leather, but one of them has been stretched as far as possible and I can only get away with grosgrain. Anyone have details on how to sew these ribbons in as sweatbands?

Regarding leather sweatbands, I could only find these at Leko (Hatsupply.com) - can anyone recommend additional sources?
 

scottyrocks

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Isle of Langerhan, NY
Seeing how grosgrain is not normally used for sweats in fedoras, I see no reason not to sew it in the same way and just leave the stitches expose on the inside of the hat. Once they are pulled tight, they should look fine, and not cut into your head. Just stitch in a nice straight line, and it should be fine.

If you buy a sewn-and-folded over fabric sweat, you may have the same size-&-fit issues as if you had used traditional leather, so a single layer of grosgrain may be the way to go.

Does anyone know how grosgrain feels against the head?
 

ScottF

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2,755
scottyrocks said:
Seeing how grosgrain is not normally used for sweats in fedoras, I see no reason not to sew it in the same way and just leave the stitches expose on the inside of the hat. Once they are pulled tight, they should look fine, and not cut into your head. Just stitch in a nice straight line, and it should be fine.

If you buy a sewn-and-folded over fabric sweat, you may have the same size-&-fit issues as if you had used traditional leather, so a single layer of grosgrain may be the way to go.

Does anyone know how grosgrain feels against the head?

Thanks, I'll sew one in today and post the results. I was at the hat shop yesterday and they showed me straws with grosgrain sweats. They also said that the grosgrain doesn't do much to protect the straw from sweat.
 

steveforse

New in Town
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20
Location
Riverside, CA
This is a great tutorial for the do-it-yourselfer. Couldn't we have a section in the forums for this kind of stuff and then sticky a few of these more useful threads in there?
 

Mario

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4,664
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Little Istanbul, Berlin, Germany
Hmm...please forgive me my ignorance but are you not supposed to stitch only halfway through the felt when attaching a sweat? I wouldn't know how to do that in the first place but I always thought that this was the technique you use on felt hats. [huh]

The reason I'm askingg is because my nice taupe colored Dobbs 20 just turned into a beater... :eusa_doh:

Ever since I got it there was a little spot at the front top of the crown where the felt looked slightly pinched. Today I found out that it's actually a hole that goes all the way through the felt. The sweat was brittle and flakey anyway, but when I was examining the hole today it just fell apart. Now I have a hat to try my hands on. I'm scared... :eek:

The original sweat was unreeded and so I'd like to use a new unreeded sweatband which I got for cheap from a local manufacturer.

The pinch as seen from the outside... :(

dobbs_spot.jpg


There's a light at the end of the tunnel... :mad:

dobbs_hole.jpg


Stripped down...with the new unreeded sweat... :eek:

dobbs_stripped.jpg
 

ScottF

Call Me a Cab
Messages
2,755
Mario said:
Hmm...please forgive me my ignorance but are you not supposed to stitch only halfway through the felt when attaching a sweat? I wouldn't know how to do that in the first place but I always thought that this was the technique you use on felt hats. [huh]

The reason I'm askingg is because my nice taupe colored Dobbs 20 just turned into a beater... :eusa_doh:

Ever since I got it there was a little spot at the front top of the crown where the felt looked slightly pinched. Today I found out that it's actually a hole that goes all the way through the felt. The sweat was brittle and flakey anyway, but when I was examining the hole today it just fell apart. Now I have a hat to try my hands on. I'm scared... :eek:

The original sweat was unreeded and so I'd like to use a new unreeded sweatband which I got for cheap from a local manufacturer.

You found someone who makes unreeded sweatbands? Unless you're quite the seamstress, that's going to take some work.

The vintage unreeded sweatband hats I have are all sewn part-way through the felt, as you noted. The reeded ones are now done like the example Brad gave; however, I do have a 1920-30 western with a reeded sweatband, that is in fact sewn only partially through the felt - it's an anomaly as far as I can tell, and I would never attempt to do that myself.
 

Falcon Park

New in Town
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26
Location
Chicago, Illinois
Tutorial

Brad-- I just found this thread a couple of weeks ago, and I am now indebted to you for life! Sewing in sweatbands has been the bane of my existence until this. I hated it so much that I was ready to blow a bunch of money that I don't have on a vintage Singer! Thanks so very much for your generosity in sharing this tutorial!!
 

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