Sometimes I really hate ebay...

[Viper Man]

Damned if you do, Damned if you don't...

After cleaning the Cavanagh in question, removing the funky smelling liner, and applying a coat of Lexol to the sweat, I'm thinking obviously the seller didn't know that the "trademark" of Cavanagh was to feature the frayed ribbon on their hats. It's probably an innocent mistake, right? I suppose that it is possible that whomever owned the hat prior to this ebay seller (who obviously acquired it through an estate sale or some other fairly cheap method) could have cut the ribbon but this seems very unlikely to me. The hat is in near mint condition besides the dust and funk, so why would the original owner make this type of alteration to something they knew came as part of the original design of the hat?

OK, I am getting carried away here and I apologize, but this isn't the first time I've had this kind of crap happen as a buyer on ebay. I also completely realize that what Alphy says is true. Don't get me wrong, I have been very pleased with most of my ebay purchases and I know I shouldn't bitch but sometimes things go badly.

I took a stab at a Cavanagh about a month ago that was photographed poorly. There were two pictures, the first was a blurry black blob that sort of resembled a hat, and the second was a tight, focused, clean looking Cavanagh liner and sweatband. What would you do? It was a BIN for a semi-reasonable price and it was in my size so I went for it. After I paid, I had a gut feeling that something seemed wrong. I immediately e-mailed the seller and asked if it was possible to send me some additional photos before the hat was boxed and shipped because there weren't really any details visible in the first photograph. The response I received was, "What do you need to see? We've already shown you the inside and outside of the hat." At this point I became very suspicious and sort of suspected I that I had probably been screwed. When the hat arrived, it was a stingy brim "VELOUR" hat with a rope for a ribbon. It looked like an Oktoberfest type german hat from the 70's (?). It was NOT a fedora as advertised. I felt duped. Like a genuine sucker. I really didn't believe the seller was honest in their description and yet when I went back to re-read it, the description was just vague enough that I couldn't really dispute it (men's vintage Cavanagh hat, etc.). It was obvious I wasn't going to get my money back. I had paid IMMEDIATELY with PayPal so in my eyes I should have warranted positive feedback, I mean my end of the bargain was done, right? Yet, they hadn't left feedback and were obviously waiting to see what I would do first.

I don't know. I guess it seems unfair to me but unfortunately, ebay is really the only game in town for vintage hats unless you get out and beat the bricks. Damn you, EBAY! You are a Blessing & a Curse!

 

[alphy27]

OK, I am getting carried away here and I apologize, but this isn't the first time I've had this kind of crap happen as a buyer on ebay. I also completely realize that what Alphy says is true. Don't get me wrong, I have been very pleased with most of my ebay purchases and I know I shouldn't bitch but sometimes things go badly.

I don't know. I guess it seems unfair to me but unfortunately, ebay is really the only game in town for vintage hats unless you get out and beat the bricks. Damn you, EBAY! You are a Blessing & a Curse!

Most of us, no doubt, have had similar experiences to some degree with eBay. I don't think you have anything to apologize for. Nor do I think your getting carried away. Can't a guy vent to people willing to listen when something like this gets him steamed. I for one am glad to listen to some one who is in a situation I can relate to. It's good to know your not alone. So go ahead and get it off your chest.

 

[Tango Yankee]

Although I buy a lot more than I sell on ebay, I don't post post feedback to a buyer until after they leave feedback for me. I justify it by saying I want to make sure the buyer is completely satisfied before I consider the transaction complete. The reality is it's also buying protection from potentially troublesome buyers.

That's what most sellers say, Alan. The good ones mean it. Unfortunately, the reality is that most buyers seem to believe that since from their point of view their side of the transaction is done once they've paid witholding the feedback until the buyer has posted theirs is a form of extortion. They're afraid of retaliation, so even if there was a problem that wasn't resolved they won't leave honest feedback. As we see commented throughout this site most will not leave feedback at all.

I know it's frustrating for sellers when the first indication they have of an unhappy customer is a negative feedback. With that in mind, perhaps another step prior to feedback being posted might be in order--both seller and buyer have to acknowledge that the deal is completed satisfactorily, in which case a positive or neutral are all that can be left, or they indicate that there were issues that were not resolved, and then the negative option is opened.

Of course, that leaves open the "what if the seller simply refuses to respond" issue. In that case the buyer is authorized to leave feedback after a certain amount of time, while the seller is limited to positive. That would encourage sellers to not ignore attempts at resolution from the buyers, which is something that I've got happening to me now. One seller simply never sent the hat and never responded to my queries, and one sent an incomplete shipment.

At least eBay does give you some means of recourse and you can often get your money back. I've found out on Blujay.com that a seller can take you money and then simply ignore you and there's nothing you can do about it if you've paid by check or money order. Fortunately I was out only $9. I suppose I could try to get the USPS fraud folks involved, but I no longer have the money order receipt. I won't be buying from anyone on Blujay again, though.

With all it's flaws, eBay still has a lot of advantages over the other sites, especially for the buyers. Though a lot of buyers have left ebay to sell elsewhere I think that buyers aren't going to be happy with having all the risk without any protections against poor or fraudulent sellers that ebay has. "Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me twice, shame on me." Or however it goes. I won't be buying off of Blujay any time soon.

Cheers,
Tom

P.S. Of course, all this discussion of how things ought to be is moot, since eBay seems to be a company that makes a decision without looking at all angles, then refuses to change even if it gets a lot of valid negative response from it's customers.

 

[Spellflower]

Just one more reason to sell here in the classifieds.

 

[bolthead]

In a couple of months sellers will only be able to leave positive feedback for buyers. It's ebay's response to buyers complaining about this sort of situation. Many sellers won't leave feedback until after the buyer's left theirs. As a result a lot of buyers are afraid to leave accurate feedback. Personally, I think they should have made it so that feedback is hidden until both have posted feedback.

I don't know how tiny the box was that your hat came in, but I do know that after the postage changes last year my hats started coming in smaller boxes. Usually it's not that big a problem (if you'll pardon the pun) but sometimes they just need to go with a larger box. I think many are worried about the postage costs scaring away potential bidders, or they're just trying to help out their customers by sending it as inexpensively as possible.

One of my peeves is sellers who use already well-used and hence no longer structurally sound boxes to ship things in.

Cheers,
Tom

Hey TOM, How 'bout telling the about your little tragidy with DHL and the crushed box that arrived one day for you? :eusa_doh:

 

[Tango Yankee]

Hey TOM, How 'bout telling the about your little tragidy with DHL and the crushed box that arrived one day for you? :eusa_doh:

Oh, you just had to rip the scab off that old wound, didn't you? lol

For those unfamiliar with that story and for anyone just feeling a bit morbid here's the link to that thread. It could have been worse--the hat could have been the original one that came in the box!

In the case of that hat box, it was all on DHL. The seller was great about it! Of course, there's another delivery mentioned that didn't go so well thanks to the seller's choice of box.

Cheers,
Tom

 

[Vintage Betty]

Thank you. The seller is "n-fashion-styles." My Stacy Adams was squashed up when it arrived. I'd been wanting an inexpensive fur felt to see what the difference would be like so I questioned her about a dark green Scala they were listing. It all went downhill from there. They have a lot of positives and are a power seller so maybe they're good. In my opinion though, they're lousy packers and vindictive. She actually blocked me as a buyer for the Scala unless I retracted my neutral feedback.

huh...guess it's a sign I need to step it up a notch and buy more expensive hats.

You can still go back and "add a note" to your feedback by describing what the seller did. I always love to start my notes of this genre with this word: WARNING

So, your feedback will remain the same, but anyone who checks her feedback right now will see your comments.

Vintage Betty