Safari Express rifle pic thread

[jkingrph]

A plinker? Hardly, sir. The ultimate cartridge, the entry level dangerous game rifle. And CZ is a reliable and time-honored maker. You have a good eye.

Thanks, I like nice wood and pretty rifles. But for me, yes a plinker. I no longer hunt, but like shooting bigger calibers. That CZ is heavy enough that recoil is much less than my Featherweight Win Mod 70 in 30-06.

I also shoot a Ruger #1 in 375 and one in .458 Win Mag. The hardest recoiling rifle I have is a Marlin 1895 cowboy modl (45-70) if I put heavy load in it.

 

[Philip A.]

Working rifle, .375 H&H. No bells, no whistles, feeds and goes bang every time.

 

[Oldsarge]

Working rifle, .375 H&H. No bells, no whistles, feeds and goes bang every time.

And it feeds like a dream. Why? Because it's a .375! In the 30's and afterwards it was fashionable for American gun writers to cast aspersion on the H&H design because it wasn't "efficient". Fools! The .375 is a dangerous game rifle and in hunting dangerous game, as you well know, reliability is paramount. That long, tapered case will always feed. I believe it a grave error to make a dangerous game cartridge with a square shoulder and parallel sides.

 

[Doublegun]

Working rifle, .375 H&H. No bells, no whistles, feeds and goes bang every time.

This is the real deal. No question. How about some details - manufacturer, age and weight?

 

[Oldsarge]

Isn't that a CZ Safari grade? It has the double square bridges and the side safety.

 

[jkingrph]

What is that rear sight. I sure would like to find one like that for my CZ.

 

[Oldsarge]

It's a CZ 550 ghost ring. You can get one from Brownell's.

 

[Philip A.]

It's a CZ/Brno 602, bought it about 20 years ago in Europe. Installed the cross-bolts, modified the original "hogback" stock (Most of the stock after the pistol grip is actually a piece of local furniture timber...), smoothed and polished feeding ramp, did some Arkansas stone work on the trigger, glass-bedded the action.

The rear sight is made by Recknagel in Germany, very sturdy, drop-in for the Brno dovetail. I drilled the aperture out to 3mm, for fast work. Bought it from Brownells, since it was faster and cheaper than to get it from Germany... In the US, New England Custom Guns import them too.

Front sight is a homemade fiber optic post. All the ones I've tried are far too delicate for any serious work, as soon as they hit something they break. After I broke the third one, I purchased a Patridge sight, 2.5mm thick, cut it to height, drilled along the top ridge at 1mm, filed a flat notch in it, and slipped a piece of fiber optic rod in. So far it has held to rough bush life. Have to say that that red fluorescent dot at the front of the barrel is the fastest thing to acquire that I've ever seen (we're talking iron sights here). Works in all light conditions, stands out in dense bush or in the open, in the sun or in the shade, against light or dark skinnned animals, and can be seen late at dusk.

 

[Doublegun]

4-rounds in the box or 3? Hard to find an off the shelf rifle in 375 that will hold 4-rounds in the box and one in the chamber.

 

[Oldsarge]

Hmm, in .375 it ought to hold 4. Mine holds three rounds of .450 Rigby . . . plus one in the chamber for the final hundred yards of the stalk, of course.

 

[Philip A.]

5 rounds in the box. Fully 5 rounds, I mean, not squeezing one more by forcing the whole thing. You could almost - but not quite - stuff 6 rounds in there...

Which takes us to an annoying little shortcoming: in these CZ in .375, when you have an odd number of rounds in the magazine, 5 or 3, they rattle... Most of the time it doesn't matter since we usually cock-and-lock as soon as we leave the car (leaving 4 rounds in the magazine), on account of elephant and buff who do not watch Animal Planet and are consequently unaware that they ought to behave like so many Disneyland characters. But when walking in relatively safe country, where we don't bother loading the chamber, that slight rattle is niggling.

 

[Roving_Bohemian]

Working rifle, .375 H&H. No bells, no whistles, feeds and goes bang every time.

Looks like my kind of rifle! She's beautiful, simple, and hardy enough to get the job done!

I do have a question though... while I was at my grandfather's he took me to the range with his .30-06... it kicked much harder than he implied and I (in a rookie mistake) got hit in the head by the tail end of the scope. It was a pump action rifle and I was wondering if perhaps bolt action variants would have less (perceived or actual) recoil than a pump action? I want to get into shooting larger caliber rifles but am now slightly apprehensive to try... I handled the .30-30 lever-gun with no trouble, so I don't know if it was the grip or the caliber that made the difference... I know many people here shoot even up to the .700s so I know it CAN be managed... but do you usually shoot pump, lever, or bolt?

And do you use scopes or iron sights? I seem to shoot best with ghost rings, but he prefers a scope....

 

[Philip A.]

Recoil has much to do with stock design, weight of rifle, and proper grip. I suspect that in your 30-06 mishap you were holding the rifle much too lightly... If you try a .375 or .404 with someone who shows you how to hold the rifle and position yourself, you'll be surprised at how comfortable they are to shoot.

A heavy but relatively slow (2200-2400fps) bullet will give you a bigger shove, while a medium but fast bullet going 3000fps will give you a quick rap that can be more unsettling. Like being pushed by a heavy guy, or being knocked in the teeth by a wiry little guy.

I use scopes when hunting smaller animals or on longer shots, but ghost rings are the best sights for close fast work. I usually have scopes on small or medium calibers, and ghost rings on anything from .375 up. Mostly own bolt actions, got one lever gun and one side-by-side double.

 

[jkingrph]

Recoil has much to do with stock design, weight of rifle, and proper grip. I suspect that in your 30-06 mishap you were holding the rifle much too lightly... If you try a .375 or .404 with someone who shows you how to hold the rifle and position yourself, you'll be surprised at how comfortable they are to shoot.

A heavy but relatively slow (2200-2400fps) bullet will give you a bigger shove, while a medium but fast bullet going 3000fps will give you a quick rap that can be more unsettling. Like being pushed by a heavy guy, or being knocked in the teeth by a wiry little guy.

I use scopes when hunting smaller animals or on longer shots, but ghost rings are the best sights for close fast work. I usually have scopes on small or medium calibers, and ghost rings on anything from .375 up. Mostly own bolt actions, got one lever gun and one side-by-side double.

Good info, I have a couple of 30-06 rifles, Winchester Mod 70 featherweights that kick much harder than my CZ 375. On the other hand I have two Ruger #1 tropicals, one in 375 H&H and the other a .458Win mag. The 375 recoils much faster and at least the perceived recoil is much worse. My worst for hurt are some 45-70's, a Marlin guide gun, short and light, and a 1895 Cowboy, 26" barrel and still very light weight. A Winchester 1886 reproduction take down, 26"barrel, pistol grip stock, but crescent buttplate is fine standing but don't try it from a bench. It's heavy but that crescent buttplate will do a job on the shoulder.

Bottom line is small guns can hurt and big guns be a pleasure to shoot and vice versa. It all depends on the factors mentioned, and the person doing the shooting.

I have had folks at the range pass up the chance to shoot the .375 bucause of the size of the cartridge, while they were shooting their small caliber ultra high velocity rifles and having their shoulders bruised...

I would love a chance to shoot a good double rifle but where I live it will probably never happen.

 

[Renault]

I enjoy shooting my .375 more than I do my Holland and Holland Super 30! It's the stock, weight, and action difference. But I love then both as a mother her children!

Renault

 

[Oldsarge]

My .375 is certainly my go-to rifle. In fact, I just got in from a dry-firing session in the back yard. With snap caps, of course. I'm taking it to Wyoming this October. A bit much for mule deer, perhaps, but the absolute bee's knees for bison.

 

[Roving_Bohemian]

Thank you all for the info!

A heavy but relatively slow (2200-2400fps) bullet will give you a bigger shove, while a medium but fast bullet going 3000fps will give you a quick rap that can be more unsettling. Like being pushed by a heavy guy, or being knocked in the teeth by a wiry little guy.

- Phillip A.
That's why I said "real or perceived" recoil... I wondered if perhaps it hit harder with the hotter loads... and the weight of the bigger rifles probably off-sets some of that too, eh? I would imagine that a rifle of quality be it .243 or .505 Gibbs would ease the recoil better than a cheaper variant of the same caliber...

I wish I could schedule a "Fedora-Lounge" Range Day with everyone here.... I think I would learn more and enjoy it more at the same time! Maybe next year?

 

[Oldsarge]

It would certainly be great fun but trying to assemble the entire Lounge in one central location would be a challenge. On the up side, there is certainly more room for shooting in the Heartland than there is on the Urban coasts!

Now, on the subject of perceived recoil. When a heavy rifle is custom built by a knowledgeable smith, you will find that it has several features. As you pointed out, it will definitely weigh more. My .450 Rigby weighs 10 1/4 lbs, empty and I wouldn't want it an ounce less! The fashion for fly weight rifles in heavy calibers is a sad commentary on the physical fitness of the shooting public. Additionally, the butt stock will be a good two inches wide and heavily padded. The third factor, and one that may not be obvious to all, is that the length of pull should be at least as long as your favorite shotgun. Target shooters, especially international competitors, tend to go for very short LOP so that they can keep their arms as close to their bodies as possible. It's steadier. In a heavy caliber, however, that will get your thumb driven right into your nose, a very unpleasant sensation! I am having the .450 restocked this autumn and I have arranged for the LOP to be 18". Admittedly, I'm six feet tall and have very long arms but that isn't really the point. I want my thumb farther away from my face!

 

[Doublegun]

Excellent info gents. I really like the CZ for all of the reasons stated. I could hunt that rifle and not worry about scratches and dings. I had a custom 375 based on a pre-64 M70 action that had been built by a very respected custom rifle guy here in the states. I bought it because is was simply stunning and the price was right. Problem was the rifle was just too nice.

A 30-06 will give you a pretty good rap if you are not ready for it. I suspect the recoil you felt had more to do with the weight of the rifle than anything else. I have Pre-64 M70's in 30-06 and one in 300H&H and more than a box of ammo at the range and I have had enough. I just picked up a Remington 700 KS Mountain Rifle (used) and with scope it weights 7-lbs even. Even with the soft recoil pad I expect it to have pretty stiff recoil.

 

[Renault]

A 30-06 will give you a pretty good rap if you are not ready for it. .

Yep,and a 1903 has to be the kickinest dog-gone 06 out there! Marksmanship scores went way down back in the day when they went to the 03 sporting that 220 grain projectile and that straight and too dang short stock! All these new "mountain" rifles with composition stocks, etc., like you mention double, will and do let you know when they go off!!!

R