Edward
Bartender
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- 25,081
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- London, UK
I always rather liked the Lada. I'd have had one at a time, but the UK stopped importing them - if memory serves, it was to do with emissions regs.
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RIP Land Rover Defender
- Thread starter Tiki Tom
- Start date
I always rather liked the Lada. I'd have had one at a time, but the UK stopped importing them - if memory serves, it was to do with emissions regs.
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- 12,970
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- Germany
If the old Lada-production-plant in Togliatti would manufacture with western quality-standards and an accurate quality-control at the end of the line, then, their cars would be a interesting choice!
The former Lada Samara from Valmet-Automotive Finland were good cars, but our 90's Lada Samara from Russia was real crap. Not again.
I think, the Landy Defender was more reliable and robust made. But I still know the thing with their corroding bodys (crossbeams, legroom, and so on...) and that the bodies were more bad from decade to decade. So, this would be not just a car, but rather a real hobby.
But the Defender got that special charme, no question!
The former Lada Samara from Valmet-Automotive Finland were good cars, but our 90's Lada Samara from Russia was real crap. Not again.
I think, the Landy Defender was more reliable and robust made. But I still know the thing with their corroding bodys (crossbeams, legroom, and so on...) and that the bodies were more bad from decade to decade. So, this would be not just a car, but rather a real hobby.
But the Defender got that special charme, no question!
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- 12,970
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- Germany
Tiki Tom
My Mail is Forwarded Here
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- 3,398
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HRH popping down to the corner store to get a quart of milk.
Lean'n'mean
I'll Lock Up
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- Cloud-cuckoo-land
By the look on her Majesty's face, she looks more intent on hitting the photographer, if it's Prince Philip's Landy, a few more blood stains will hardly be noticed.
MikeKardec
One Too Many
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I still know the thing with their corroding bodys (crossbeams, legroom, and so on...) and that the bodies were more bad from decade to decade. So, this would be not just a car, but rather a real hobby.
But the Defender got that special charme, no question!
They are a hobby, you are totally right! As many complaints as I have I'll also offer this alternate argument which, on a good day, I sometimes believe: The metal held up pretty well for it's lack of preparation. An example would be that LR didn't bother to paint the side metal up under the galvanized capping. Over the years those "hobbyists" have found dozens of tricks to put them back together right. Once that is done they hold up pretty well
It's still odd that Defender passengers have to sit so close to the doors and that the controls are also set so far outboard. Jeep never had this issue even with a slightly smaller vehicle and neither did Land Cruiser. In right hand drive countries the driver's footwell is considerably bigger. My Aussie Defender was definitely more comfortable than my current NAS (North American standard) LR. But the seats, which don't look like anything to write home about are remarkably comfortable and, possibly because they don't turn tight, Defenders seem more immune to "Death Wobble" the bane of many aging 4x4s. Many of the positives and negatives come from the fact that the Series Rovers and the Defenders were designed for the Empire. A utilitarian vehicle that could be shipped, disassembled, and fairly easily bolted and riveted together in the destination country. That made them VERY modular and easy to swap parts and such. It was a great idea. In the end they had an excellent turbo diesel that was a balance of simplicity and decent power and economy. Simplicity is the thing that is lacking from most diesels with any performance at all. They kept making that engine for 3d world clients and NGOs for many years. It's a better performer but my second favorite after the great Mercedes 5 cylinder of the '70s and '80s.
kaiser
A-List Customer
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- 402
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- Germany, NRW, HSK
There were some earlier vehicles out there that were on paar with the Defender, one being the International Harvester Scout. I had one back in the early 80's, tough as nails.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Harvester_Scout
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Harvester_Scout
GHT
I'll Lock Up
- Messages
- 9,793
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- New Forest
You might be disappointed, I did hear that there was a stretched version in the offing:
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MisterCairo
I'll Lock Up
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Hilarious!
Tiki Tom
My Mail is Forwarded Here
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It's baaaack!
Not sure how I feel about this.
I suppose I should fight the urge to be automatically skeptical about this reboot. Maybe it will be okay.
http://www.autonews.com/article/201...oduct-offensive?AID=/20170814/OEM04/170819961
Not sure how I feel about this.
I suppose I should fight the urge to be automatically skeptical about this reboot. Maybe it will be okay.
From the article: "The next generation is the most anticipated vehicle in Land Rover history. The original Defender, born as the Series 1 in 1948, became a global icon and remained true to its original design and mission through the end of production in early 2016. ...(The new reboot) will come in several body styles and it will be instantly recognizable as a Defender, but without appearing retro, says Land Rover design chief Gerry McGovern. ...The Defender is likely to be built in JLR's new Nitra, Slovakia, plant, which is being set up to build aluminum-intensive vehicles. ...it is possible that JLR will show a concept version of the next-generation Defender in 2018 ahead of its 2019 calendar year debut."
http://www.autonews.com/article/201...oduct-offensive?AID=/20170814/OEM04/170819961
Oldsarge
One Too Many
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- 1,440
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- On the banks of the Wilamette
Damn, if they import them into the US, I may get one!
I won't. It wouldn't be the same. But the thing is, I once owned a Land-Rover in the late 1960s and early 1970s. It was a 1965 short wheelbase station wagon (estate car). I also had two Rover sedans, too, but this isn't about cars.
The Land-Rovers of the day had some good features but also some shortcomings, compared with the competition. For one thing, it was neither fast nor powerful. The heater was inadequate in really cold weather. You had to learn to double-clutch, too. The gas mileage wasn't so great but nobody worried about that back then. Aside from those points, it was just about perfect. I knew two other guys in college who also owned Land-Rovers. Theirs were both long wheelbase station wagons. I have since seen one with a V-8, which I was told was either made or imported for just one year. There was a straight six, too, but neither of those looked any different.
I don't think it was originally intended solely as a farm vehicle, although the list of options, as long as your arm, included some farm implements. But some Jeep models were also advertised with farming equipment, too, though I don't think it caught on in that respect. Jeeps, of course, aren't what they used to be, either (what is?), and are a long ways from the simple vehicles of the 40s and 50s. But Land-Rovers were used for all sorts of conversions, like for ambulances and fire fighting equipment, something not done as much with Jeeps.
Land-Rover had a lot of competition. In addition to the Jeep, there was the I-H Scout. There were some Nissan Patrol models sold here, too, I believe, though I don't recall noticing any. But the one to beat was the Toyota Land Cruiser. It even had a six-cylinder engine, I believe, and there was a long version. Jeep also had some station wagons and panel trucks, too. And of course, pickup trucks are more popular in the states than anywhere else.
And there is the Unimog. It's different.
The Land-Rovers of the day had some good features but also some shortcomings, compared with the competition. For one thing, it was neither fast nor powerful. The heater was inadequate in really cold weather. You had to learn to double-clutch, too. The gas mileage wasn't so great but nobody worried about that back then. Aside from those points, it was just about perfect. I knew two other guys in college who also owned Land-Rovers. Theirs were both long wheelbase station wagons. I have since seen one with a V-8, which I was told was either made or imported for just one year. There was a straight six, too, but neither of those looked any different.
I don't think it was originally intended solely as a farm vehicle, although the list of options, as long as your arm, included some farm implements. But some Jeep models were also advertised with farming equipment, too, though I don't think it caught on in that respect. Jeeps, of course, aren't what they used to be, either (what is?), and are a long ways from the simple vehicles of the 40s and 50s. But Land-Rovers were used for all sorts of conversions, like for ambulances and fire fighting equipment, something not done as much with Jeeps.
Land-Rover had a lot of competition. In addition to the Jeep, there was the I-H Scout. There were some Nissan Patrol models sold here, too, I believe, though I don't recall noticing any. But the one to beat was the Toyota Land Cruiser. It even had a six-cylinder engine, I believe, and there was a long version. Jeep also had some station wagons and panel trucks, too. And of course, pickup trucks are more popular in the states than anywhere else.
And there is the Unimog. It's different.
Oldsarge
One Too Many
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- 1,440
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- On the banks of the Wilamette
Yeah, I remember the original Land Cruisers. They were somethin' else! Then the bureaucrats got involved and the bean counters and so they went away. I encountered a more modern version in Africa, in diesel! Those are great. But not for sale here, either.
As to the Unimog? It's a diesel elephant, the ideal safari vehicle. I love 'em.
As to the Unimog? It's a diesel elephant, the ideal safari vehicle. I love 'em.
I had been trying to remember another 4x4 vehicle from 40 some years ago. Quite rare but I actually saw one. The Steyr-Puch (at the time) Haflinger was a small and not very fast 4x4 vehicle that was probably too small, too slow and much too basic to ever expect much in the way of sales. But it had a charm of it's own, if you like things like that. It's no longer manufactured, replaced by another 4x4 that was longer, higher and wider and probably faster.
Oldsarge
One Too Many
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- On the banks of the Wilamette
I very vaguely recall seeing it mentioned in the media but doubt that I ever saw one in the metal.
Sort of a German Quadrunner for farm work and the military, if I recall. I believe it's successor was the Pinzgauer.
Sort of a German Quadrunner for farm work and the military, if I recall. I believe it's successor was the Pinzgauer.
You are correct, although it was Austrian. I even managed to get a sales brochure, which I might still have. Don't remember what it cost, though, or who sold them. You might get more use out of a dune buggy, if anyone remembers them.
In some ways, they were a little bit like the US Army "Mule," a flatbed 4x4 used by airborne units, officially designated the M274. It had no cab or doors and only one seat. Never saw one that I recall when I was in the army, although they were used for years afterwards. I think they were eventually replaced by John Deere utility vehicles, probably with zero army development input.
In some ways, they were a little bit like the US Army "Mule," a flatbed 4x4 used by airborne units, officially designated the M274. It had no cab or doors and only one seat. Never saw one that I recall when I was in the army, although they were used for years afterwards. I think they were eventually replaced by John Deere utility vehicles, probably with zero army development input.
I was just thinking about the times I've seen Land-Rovers in movies and on TV. Not that many times, actually.
There is or was a British TV amateur detective drama about two middle-aged women who are gardeners, one of whom drives an old Land-Rover. When her partner suggests getting a new one, she says they have too much rubbish. In the series Doc Martin, the constable drives one--a new one.
The best two instances of Land-Rovers appearing in movies are Born Free and a sort of science fiction film "Crack in the world," made in 1965, so it has real Land-Rovers, just like I had. In fact, there are several in the movie. In the adventure movie about mercenaries in Africa (where else?) called Dark of the Sun (1968) in which a Toyota Land-Cruiser is featured. Well, I guess it's featured. Jeeps appear all the time. Not worth mentioning.
There is or was a British TV amateur detective drama about two middle-aged women who are gardeners, one of whom drives an old Land-Rover. When her partner suggests getting a new one, she says they have too much rubbish. In the series Doc Martin, the constable drives one--a new one.
The best two instances of Land-Rovers appearing in movies are Born Free and a sort of science fiction film "Crack in the world," made in 1965, so it has real Land-Rovers, just like I had. In fact, there are several in the movie. In the adventure movie about mercenaries in Africa (where else?) called Dark of the Sun (1968) in which a Toyota Land-Cruiser is featured. Well, I guess it's featured. Jeeps appear all the time. Not worth mentioning.
MisterCairo
I'll Lock Up
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- 7,005
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- Gads Hill, Ontario
If it's not built in England, it's not a real Land Rover. I get modern industrial reality, but I don't have to buy into it!