Restoring a Vintage Belstaff ?

[H.Johnson]

If I remember correctly (which I sometimes don't) this is the early 70s TM Professional lining.

This is in remarkably good condition and is quite valuable.

 

[muzz63]

If I remember correctly (which I sometimes don't) this is the early 70s TM Professional lining.

This is in remarkably good condition and is quite valuable.

Thanks again. Yes, the whole jacket is in perfect condition, other than a little road grime/wax at the bottom of the lining from riding with the matching pants. All components are in perfect order including belt, with no blemishes on the jacket at all. I bought it second hand in the UK in 1990 and wore it while riding in Europe until about 1995. Unfortunately the pants have disappeared - there is a pair of overmittens but these have a different lining and different label - probably bought at a different time.

I am about 20kg heavier now (!) and back in Australia and no longer riding so I don't wear it. It has been hanging in a cupboard since ~1996 and remains in excellent condition. There isn't much of a market in Australia but I see they can fetch a high price on ebay but this also seems a bit hit and miss, with a lot of variation. I'd be interested in it's value as I will be selling it to fund some new camera gear!

Thanks again for your help with this.

Cheers, Murray

 

[H.Johnson]

Murray,

Depending on the size, you would get at least 200GBP for it in the UK.

Coincidentally, there is a pair of near compatible trousers on eBay.co.uk at the moment.

It deserves a good home.

 

[muzz63]

Thanks once again! Yes, I hope it goes to a good home. I just tried it on and found it fits quite well - I used to wear it over a few layers so as I've expanded, it has become a little more snug but apparently still wearable, much to my surprise. I started to reminisce about all the miles I covered in it but soon got too hot - it's 25°C (77°F) at 12.40am here in Western Australia and I remember why I didn't wear it much when I returned home from the UK.

I'm sure practicality will win out and you may see it on ebay soon :cry: !

Cheers, Murray.

 

[A Harris]

H.Johnson, I've got another ID request. My latest buy with red Sammy Miller label, Lightning zip and moleskin collar:

Ideas as to age? I was guessing early 60's.

 

[H.Johnson]

This one had me foxed, so I consulted a few old (very old, now) work colleagues and they weren't really able to shed much light in the label.

The design of the label spanned the 60s and 70s, but we can't recall one being red. The lining is a 60s (blue) design but as stated before sometimes features lingered on as stock was used up. Knowing the make of the zip and press-studs (snaps) wouldn't be conclusive, but might help.

In your photo I can just see the top of one zip track and it seems to have a square stopper, rather than a 'C'-clip type. Is that so?
What does it say on the zip puller and the back of the press-studs? The visible one doesn't look like a Newey.

 

[A Harris]

Those were the sellers pictures, here are the other two:

I haven't recieved it yet but when I do I will take and post better pictures. It looks like a Lightning zip to me from the pics.

 

[H.Johnson]

I agree, the zip seesm to be a Lightning. Newey Patent 'nipple' press-studs would usually have been a good indicator of the 60s, and those are 'ring snaps' which were used in both periods.

Leaving aside the label (which we don't know about) based on the zip, lining and press-studs I would certainly go for the 1960s, but I'm uncertain about how early. Sorry, but dating Bestaff stuff form this period is confusing. When it arrives, perhaps you'd see if there are any other labels (there should be). What we are looking for is cleaning instructions, telephone number and post code (may say ST4 etc).

 

[stef142]

Hi, I'm looking for a Belstaff detachable lining to use with my '80s Tourmaster in size 40UK. Do you know where can I find it?
Thanks, Stefano

 

[Smudger]

I have two of these jackets, both from the early 1960s/late 1950s with Lightning zips (one straight zip which is earlier and one curved zip which is later I think...) and chequered flag labels.

I got the first one about two years ago and it still had the receipt for a motorbike dated 1961 in the pocket, it also had the matching chequered flag trousers and a 1960s helmet! It was in good shape but it had been in a shed for 20 years. I got the second one a few weeks ago, it had been in a garage for 20 years. Both jackets were in similar condition when I bought them, the zips worked, the linings were pretty clean and the oily mud that is often found around the lower area of the lining was very minimal, they were both a bit musty, a bit grimy on the outside and had covered in years of dust. As they were in very similar condition when I got them and I cleaned them in very different ways and I think the different experience and results might help inform this thread.

Jacket 1 Process
I sent the first jacket to Wax Jackets Cleaned in Derbyshire www.otters-reproofingservices.co.uk. They use a 'wet-cleaning' service (as opposed to dry-cleaning). A clue to this came in the form of a washing tag clipped into the lining of my jacket when it was returned to me. It looks exactly like the tag you get from a dry-cleaners so whatever the exact process WJC use it is certainly an industrial one. My guess is that they wash the jackets in water with some sort of detergent. Whether this manages to not strip the wax 'base' from the fabric I do not know for certain as they rewax the jackets after wet cleaning them. My guess is that WJC wash the jackets in a way that completely strips the cotton fabric of wax during the wet clean and they then reapply all the wax again from scratch.

Jacket 1 Results
The first jacket came back with a very clean liner which was good. However the cleaning made 5 small holes in the lining, not good. WJC also removed the perfect condition chequered flag patch and reapplied it, I can post a before and after but they did a pretty awful job. It is frayed around the edges from being unpicked and the thread used to reattach it is different. The chequered flag patch on the trousers had been removed by WJC and not even replaced. After emailing and phoning a few times and each time being promised a replacement, nothing ever arrived. The washing process cleaned the collar well but also washed out a lot of the colour in the corduroy. The cuffs were perfect when I sent the jacket off to WJC but they came back with a couple of little cracks and very small frays. The exterior of the jacket came back well waxed and looking good. It is certainly waterproof. It is blacker than before, a very uniform black and most of the patina has been lost. This last thing, the patina, is a subtle change but I think a really important one; without it you my as well buy a new jacket. You can see the difference in the patina if you compare before and after cleaning by WJC photos and if you compare jacket 1 and jacket 2 side by side. About a week after getting the jacket back one of the teeth in the zip fell out, I have no idea if this was due to the cleaning.

Jacket 2 Process
The second jacket I decided to work on myself. This second jacket is pretty special, it has an early 60 '59 Club' patch and some original TT patches with gold embroidery. The guy who owned it was a member of the 59 Club and raced at the TT; the jacket has the original 60s pins for Brands Hatch, the 64, 65, 66, 67 and 68 TT, and a '59 Club' pin too.
So I ran a cold bath and put the jacket in to soak for about 20 minutes. When I came back the water was brown. I drained the water, rinsed the coat down with cold water and filled the bath up again. I then wiped the outside with a soft washing up sponge resulting in more brown water. I drained the bath and refilled a third time. I turned the jacket inside out and used a VERY small amount of wool detergent and a cloth to wash the lining. I did this pretty quickly as I was trying to avoid contact between the waxed cotton and the detergent. I then rinsed the jacket inside and out with cold water and left it in a really warm place to dry. I dried it close to a radiator for about 4 hours, I even put it on the radiator for a while during the 4 hours. I Fabreezed the inside when it was dry. It looked great at this point so it was a bit of a dilemma whether to re-wax it. In the end I did, with Barbour wax thornproof dressing. It looks even better - I can post before and after re-wax images if anyone wants to see the difference.
Jacket 2 Results
The patina has certainly been preserved using this second method. The liner is not as clean looking as the WJC method but its not far off and the chequered flag label looks much better as it has not been removed and re-sewn. The musty smell is almost nonexistent in both jackets. I rubbed a bit of beeswax on the zip and it works perfectly. I would recommend this second method without hesitation. The jacket looks great, the original patches are intact, it is waterproof, and most importantly it is undamaged, unmolested and has kept its original 'look'.

My advice is if you want to restore a jacket like this do it yourself as I don't think you can damage it by following the second method. And if you try it and it is not 'new' enough you can still send it to Wax Jackets Cleaned but you have been warned. Finished Jacket 2 image attached.