Pop's Leather

[kevinblack]

Hi,

Anyone have experince with these guys. They are based in Turkey with a US office. You can get a tailormade jacket for USD$245. The reviews I've read from a number of USAF/CAP forums are quite positive for service and quality. I sent them an e-mail and got a detailed reply (US office took the time to answer all of my questions and in some detail - so that was good)

I have read that one of this forum had them do some repair work and were quite satisfied with the outcome.

Anyone bought one of their A-2s or other leather jackets? If so, what was the outcome, would you buy from them again?

Cheers,
Kevin

 

[aswatland]

No experience of them but you are not going to get a quality A2 for $245. IMO it would be better to buy a second hand Eastman for $400 or new Good Wear!

 

[Rob]

No experience of them but you are not going to get a quality A2 for $245.

That's a rather broad and somewhat sweeping statement.

When you consider the international labour market and the low hourly rates of tailors in certain o/s locations, all you need to hit on is a skilled tailor with a good selection of hides and you can be onto a winner. Although I would agree that it's a hit and miss market out there, and one might have to sample several vendors before hitting pay dirt, to suggest it's impossible is... well, I would just say that I don't agree.

 

[aswatland]

That's a rather broad and somewhat sweeping statement.

When you consider the international labour market and the low hourly rates of tailors in certain o/s locations, all you need to hit on is a skilled tailor with a good selection of hides and you can be onto a winner. Although I would agree that it's a hit and miss market out there, and one might have to sample several vendors before hitting pay dirt, to suggest it's impossible is... well, I would just say that I don't agree.

Yes, it is a broad and sweeping statement and one which I believe to be true. I have bought many jackets in my time and never seen a quality repro A2 for $245. Even with cheap labour it will not compare with a high end repro in terms of construction or accuaracy.The most authentic A2s are made by Good Wear and there is no way John Chapman could make one for this price. If you wish to spend $245 on a Pop's A2 fine, but I would avoid them.

 

[PADDY]

...

All the guys who are currently making 'top end' vintage replica A-2s to WWII spec have been at it for years and some are only 'just now' getting it right in the cut (and some are still missing things in detail).
That's with years of experience, knowledge/enthusiasm, original jackets to work from and make templates from..etc. They cannot sell for the price you mention (if only!).

If you can get an A-2 made for just over $200 US, that matches the quality and detail of the likes of GoodWear; Aero; Eastman; Real McCoy..etc, then we'll all be joining the queue at a sprint Trust me!!

Good to have a new member here by the way!! WELCOME ABOARD!:eusa_clap

 

[Rob]

Even with cheap labour it will not compare with a high end repro in terms of construction or accuaracy.

Andrew (and Paddy, now that I've seen you post while I was writing this), I liken the situation to the car market. There reaches a price point where the lower-cost manufacturers, such as Korea and Malaysia, are turning out cars that are perfectly serviceable vehicles that many people are happy to own. Now, do they have the best motors? The best paint jobs? The "right" badge? No, no and no. Yet Joe Public is happy with them. Because Joe Public sees a fair price delivering, broadly, what he needs. So, bringing it back to jackets, sure, we can try and brow beat Joe Public into buying, say, an Aero jacket because it will "last forever" and have the right number of stitches down the left hand arm, or whatever detail genuine buffs want to obsess over this week, but does Joe Public want that? In many cases he won't. It may seem obvious, but perhaps in communities like this where many of us are the exception, rather than the rule, it needs to be pointed out that "near enough" is often "good enough" for people. Especially when off-set against a low price.

 

[aswatland]

When you get your Pops A2 perhaps you would like to post pics and a review on the forum? There may be other members who would like one as a daily wearer.

 

[Rob]

Indeed. Something to wear as a real "beater" as they say. Leaving any expensive jackets in the cupboard for special occasions, living history re-enactment, etc.

 

[Fletch]

Uh

Besides materials and workmanship, there also has to be a limit to how much they will work with you at this price point. I have a feeling you're gonna have to put up with shoulder droop and other well established traditions.

Pop's does a good business with aircrews, but most of them aren't all that hip to how a jacket should fit, either. They just want something comfy, practical, handsome, and within current regs.

 

[PADDY]

"The Beater..."

I agree, would be great to see photos of this 'Pop' if you decide to get it. "Horses for Courses.." there's something out there for everyone.

Talking about a 'beater' of a jacket. Strangely enough, I see my jackets as the "Sunday Best Syndrome." In Ireland we always had a "Sunday Best" suit that you only wore to church or funerals and weddings. So it never got much wear except on a Sunday!! I now see that as a waste of money if you are buying an expensive A-2, wear that baby into the ground!! As she will get better and better looking with all the dents and dings and scratches the world throws at her!! and enjoy the money for what you put into it.
I work on the car on the garden..etc in my A-2, get it nice and sweaty, greasy, smokey...just the way a man's jacket should be!!

Who needs 'hot water treatments' when good old fashioned honest sweat, dirt and tears can work its magic on characterising a repro A-2!!

 

[Rob]

Paddy, it would seem that you, Michaelson and myself are the last three people in the world who naturally age their jackets. Well, it sure seems that way, sometimes, with all the zany ageing techniques that get used! :eusa_doh:

 

[Fletch]

You can always apply the hot water when it gets sweaty greasy smokey.

Now that fall is here I shall wear my A-2s while rolling down grass banks and jumping into piles of leaves.

 

[aswatland]

Here's the description from the Pop's site. Clearly no competition for the high end repro makers. Reminds me of the sort of jackets made in the '80s by the likes of Shott, Avirex, LL Bean etc..!

HA-2 Flight Jacket

The classic and currently issued U.S. Air Force A-2 designed leather flight jacket is our most popular jacket. Styled with an oversized and comfortable fit and look. Features of a Pop's Leather A-2 flight jacket not found in the issued coat include higher quality knit cuffs and waist, more material for the underarm extentions, hidden outside side entry pockets, and a high quality silky polyester lining with your choice of an imprinted artistic U.S. map, plain brown, or plain black. The standard pocket configuration includes two interior zippered pockets, an open top interior leather pocket, and an interior pen pocket. All main zippers are genuine YKK brand zippers.

Options include name tag and command patch pile velcro (not the nametag, see the Nametag link on the left side of the screen), sewn in Blood Chit, a detachable genuine wool collar, a heavy duty large tooth steel zipper, snaps for shoulder epaulettes and an outside zippered cigarette-two pen sleeve pocket (not on the standard issue coats).

You can also get the optional eye and hook closure at the neck like the original A-2 design and replace the knit cuffs with adjustable leather cuffs.

Our standard pocket configuration may be modified by choosing a vertical "G-1" style pocket with snap closure instead of one of the horzontal zippered pockets for no additional charge or add the "G-1" style vertical pocket for an additional charge.

We highly recommend our 3M Thinsulate insulated liner option which adds extended seasonal wear. Available in zip out vest, zip out vest with arms, or permanently sewn into the coat lining. We also offer a zip out genuine wool liner.

A very popular option is our concealed handgun carry pockets. Please choose the link below for more information.

Issued A-2 jackets are made of goatskin, but most customers prefer our more supple and durable high quality calfskin coat (as shown). Available in Brown*, Black, Antique Light Brown, Antique Dark Brown, Antique Whiskey, Navy Blue Calfskin; Brown Nubuck, Dark Brown, Black Lambskin.
* Issued color.

 

[Rob]

Here's the description from the Pop's site. Clearly no competition for the high end repro makers.

But is that their competition? I wouldn't have thought it was. They seem to be an outfit that turns out stuff for airline staff to wear as workwear, etc, not obsessive A2 fans, as was noted earlier.

 

[PADDY]

You going to pull the trigger then Rob?

Think you might go and buy one then?

If you do, it'd be nice to get a full review with photos..etc. Although an A-2 on the East coast of Oz in Summer could be just a tad hot?

 

[Rob]

Nah, I've got my Wested Indy jacket to cover the need for a "short, brown leather jacket" in the cupboard. Heck, it's half an A2 to begin with And, yes, it does get a bit of use here... although not as much as it would in other climes around the world. So, no, my next purchase is either a Wested Das Boot jacket or something slightly longer... see my other thread! I need help!

 

[fishmeok]

I have to agree with both sides- I'm a jacket nerd now but I didn't start out that way. My first A-2 was a Cooper bought in 1988 and I just received my Goodwear Dubow last week. It's like any hobby, the more you get into it the more you realize how intricate the subject is. Back when I bought the Cooper I had no idea there were several different makers during WWII. Now I can I.D. most of them just by looking at the jacket.

There is a huge difference in how an original is built and fits compared to modern jackets. Most jackets now have been enlarged in odd areas to make up for the increased size of the populace. Instead of evenly up sizing a jacket they just enlarge specific areas (shoulders, waist) and knock the proportions off. From what I've seen of the POP's jackets they are a good deal on a new, modern, A-2 inspired jacket but they do not live up to the fit and design of the original. Just depends on what you want.

If you want something closer to an original A-2 on a budget an Avirex or Cooper might fit the bill. Certain Avirex jackets (they have a 1978 date on the label- but if there is a picture on the lining or any kind of "map lining" or side-entry pockets stay away) are reasonably close and the Cooper/Saddlery issue A-2 's are also a good deal. These can be found regularly on E-bay for $50- $130 depending.

Cheers
Mark

Avirex

Cooper

Goodwear Dubow

 

[kevinblack]

Here's the description from the Pop's site. Clearly no competition for the high end repro makers.

I have to agree, the high end repro makers are not the competition (or vice versa). As noted I'm looking for a comfortable, well made jacket for outerwear and flying. Again, as someone noted earlier, the USAF are into comfortable utility in the cockpit (isn't that where this all started many years ago). I subscribe to that view, ie comfort and utility. I'm a great believer in form follows function (I don't want a daggy jacket though) and most things evolve over time.

To the purists, good on yer, and as a novice I enjoy reading and learning and am a far more knowledgeable buyer now (just not a buyer of the 100% authentic variety A-2).

Cheers,
Kevin

 

[Raymundo]

Kevin,

About eight years ago I bought an A-2 from POPS. The calfskin leather was great but the workmanship was not. Sent it back for a G-1 hoping the first jacket was just a fluke. No such luck. Again, nice goatskin leather and bad workmanship ( one arm longer than the other). After paying the shipping and Customs fees, I would have been better off buying a flight jacket from Gibson and Barnes which is much better quality and workmanship. This is what happens when trying to save money on a jacket purchase. From my experience, I can not recommend POPS. If you decide to buy from them anyway, do not put your credit card number on their Internet site. Mine was stolen from there. Call their representitive instead.

Ray

 

[Fletch]

Nah, I've got my Wested Indy jacket to cover the need for a "short, brown leather jacket" in the cupboard. Heck, it's half an A2 to begin with

Wouldn't half an A-2 be an A-1?

Then there's this thing, which they had at French Connection (aka the store whose name is a misspelled cussword) this spring. Call this the A-11/2, I suppose.