Photos of hatters tools

[TheDane]

Polyurethane can withstand the heat and steam. I think it covers most contemporary blocks, if not all.

I second John on the sander. You should definitely use hand-held sandpaper, and without a sanding block. It takes really good skills to avoid flats, using a sander. You could use a motorized spinner and a piece of sandpaper in the hand, but I would absolutely not recommend a sander.

Have a look at one of Steve Delk's first blocks from the second page of this thread:

I read somewhere, he used Bondo on his very early blocks, but that he had new blocks made, when he went pro. I have used it on two bocks with okay results. Most of those epoxies get a little "rubbery" with heavy heating, but it doesn't disintegrate. I know nothing about what long-term effects the chemistry may have on the felt, but I guess the lacquer seals it to a certain degree.

I don't think that Bondo-patched blocks would be compatible with professional hatting. That calls for new blocks or vintage blocks in really good condition. For hobby work I see no reason why you shouldn't try to fill a cracked block and use it

 

[tonyb]

While I'd love to have new blocks and flanges, as I find nothing particularly magical about the old ones, I see no reason why an old block shouldn't do as good a job as a new one, even an old one with narrow splits and shallow dings. I have yet to see any of those imperfections in the blocks transfer to the outer (visible) side of a felt hat crown. Never once.

Some of the blocks I use most are probably the oldest on the shelves. I suspect that some are approaching a hundred years old now, and they look it. And they still work fine.

This doesn't apply to flanges, of course, as surface flaws may well transfer to the topside of the hat brim.

There's a woodworker/cabinetmaker fellow who has a sideline crafting new hatter's tools. He will, for a substantial price, repair blocks you might think beyond salvation to functionally good-as-new condition. This may well be worth the expense for particularly desirable straw-hat blocks (blocks in the shape of the creased, finished hat), which can be hard to find in general, and doubly hard to find in sizes we moderns tend to wear. (People are generally bigger these days than they were 60 and 70 and more years ago.) This craftsman will also fabricate tippers for those straw-hat blocks, which are often missing.

None of this is to dispute Ole's observation. In a hat factory you'd expect to see newer equipment, and I imagine the heavier use the equipment gets in such a setting diminishes its longevity. But I can think of no good reason for a professional custom hatter not to use a funky looking, or a home-repaired, old block, if it's the right block for the application, and if that block's imperfections will never show in the finished hat.

 

[bloc]

I have a question. Is this a hat creaser or what do you think it is? I have several hat creasers and this one is different. It is made out of wood. I got it in with a bunch of blocks that I bought.
View attachment 5306 View attachment 5307 View attachment 5308

Might it be a tipper? The piece that corresponds to the hat block shape and goes on top when blocking straw? Hard to tell the dimensions from the picture.

 

[Hatter4]

Might it be a tipper? The piece that corresponds to the hat block shape and goes on top when blocking straw? Hard to tell the dimensions from the picture.

The piece measures approx. 7 inches long by 3-1/2" high - it tapers on both ends - when it is upside down - it almost resembles a boat.

 

[TheDane]

Might it be a tipper?

No, it's not a tipper. A tipper's main shape is usually concave. I'm sure it's a block for some sort of a hat.

Tony: To a certain degree it probably depends on the hatter's personal way to perform his/her different processes. A few of years back I tried to iron a newly cleaned lightweight on a cracked block, and couldn't prevent creases from the cracks. I tried to fill them, and the block then worked flawlessly. That may very well have to do with my personal practices, though

Actually, when Langenberg/BB closed there were a number of old wooden blocks used with their fingerblockers, that were reinforced with an outer layer of fabric or straw - probably to prevent (further) cracking. To a point that contradicts my statement about compatibility, but personally I would still not use Bondo-filled blocks, if I were to produce hats for sale. But again, that's a strictly personal consideration.

Also Jim from JW-Hats repairs old blocks, just as he will modify your blocks to the rotating/spinner-system you use. I know of a couple of hatters, who can CNC new blocks for you (Jim is one) - but that will very soon become a substantial expence. New "classic" blocks become a lot more affordable with a connection to someone with a CNC-machine. Not least if you also have access to a 3D-scanner.

 

[John Galt]

Most of those epoxies get a little "rubbery" with heavy heating, but it doesn't disintegrate.

I have used "Bondo" brand wood filler in other applications with success. It worked well for items that don't see a lot of use, but it has softened with use & exposure to the elements. The patches to my front door either fell off or have worn down. I believe a good quality filler or making your own are your best options.

Actually, when Langenberg/BB closed there were a number of old wooden blocks used with their fingerblockers, that were reinforced with an outer layer of fabric or straw - probably to prevent (further) cracking.

I have several of these from Langenberg, and will post a photo. It looks like straw to me, probably from hat crowns, and appears to be epoxied in place. I also note that most if not all of my Langenberg blocks have a diagonal cut that has been filled with glue and/or filler. Photos to follow.




"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[John Galt]

The one above has two of the diagonals. Most have one, like this:

I imagine these are to strengthen the block by varying the grain. Also, as in welding, the glued bonds are actually stronger than the surrounding wood.

Here is the covering Ole mentioned. Looks like a pretty high quality "Panama" hat crown to me. Others actually have (slight) patterns in them, suggesting that they were actually hats or hat blanks.

The epoxy can be seen on the bottom and in the cove only, and very firmly attaches the material.


"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[John Galt]

Here's one with a pattern:

You can see that (other than the pattern) these are very tight weaved hat crowns. Not cheap Panamas, to be sure. I wish I had a few like these.

For Bloc, here is a photo of the groove on a flange:

Incidentally: Marc DeCou on Etsy is now making flanges, in addition to the other high quality hatters tool$ he sells.


"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[TheDane]

I believe a good quality filler or making your own are your best options.

Yes, if you can find a "good quality filler", that is. I haven't heard of better fillers for this purpose, and most of the ones on the market softens with heat.

To use glue with sawdust as filler is an ancient cabinetmaker tip, and it's great to match the colors of the filler and wood. I wouldn't use it for this purpose, though. I'm not sure what glue, you will suggest, but I think it's quite hard to find a suitable glue, that will hold up to heat and moisture. You can get glue to hold up against the special environtment in very thin layers between two pieces of wood - but it's a very different task to choose a bonding material for fillers. Sawdust doesn't have properties suitable to absorb the heat. Wood is absolutely not good at this either, but far better than sawdust.

 

[TheDane]

The so called "diagonals" are just the result of high prices for big pieces of poplar. The blocks are just made from smaller pieces, glued together to save materials/money. That's very often seen - especially on contemporary blocks

A parallel example can be found in guitars. In 1969 Martin could no longer get Brazillian Rosewood due to environmental protection rules. That was the reason for the creation of the special back on their then new D35-model:



The other models with two-part backs were made from East Indian Rosewood, but the rest of the smaller pieces of Brazillian were used this way

 

[bloc]

Might the covering on the blocks serve the purpose of increasing the size of the block? It's something I've done before.

 

[TheDane]

Might the covering on the blocks serve the purpose of increasing the size of the block? It's something I've done before.

That I don't think that was the reason - but definitely a side effect. I'm quite sure it was done to reinforce them

 

[John Galt]

Yes, if you can find a "good quality filler", that is. I haven't heard of better fillers for this purpose, and most of the ones on the market softens with heat.

I will defer to you Ole, no better ideas from me. I said "a good filler" generically because I could not think of one that I like.

As for glue, I use Titebond III for my projects, but have not used it on a block (except an ancient one that shattered in shipping and that I have not used since puzzle-piecing back together) and cannot say how it would hold up.

I have heard good things about Gorilla Glue, but if I remember right, Titebond III performed better in breakage testing by Mathias Wandel. (Fascinating web page at woodgears.com, incidentally).





"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[John Galt]

The so called "diagonals" are just the result of high prices for big pieces of poplar. The blocks are just made from smaller pieces, glued together to save materials/money. That's very often seen - especially on contemporary blocks

I should have thought of that, but it didn't even cross my mind. I had no contemporary blocks before obtaining these, and just assumed it was for a functional reason.


"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[John Galt]

Might the covering on the blocks serve the purpose of increasing the size of the block? It's something I've done before.

I have to second Ole here. They are actually quite thin, and this is what Langenberg and others (see Ermatinger's book) have done to achieve that goal. It is a doffer or duffer, if I remember correctly (help me hatters, I don't have it handy).

"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[John Galt]

Just lost this one - it went for $210+

Any of you folks get it?

"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[TheDane]

Nope, I saw it but weren't interested. A fun piece for the wall, but it needs quite a lot of restoring before I would use it for it's purpose. Substantial price!

 

[John Galt]

The good thing is that the pics were of good quality, and will help me in my task. I also just received the euro model I found on French eBay, which helps me better understand the cutter assembly.


"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[tonyb]

Part of me likes to think that that one sold for more than it should have. (It certainly sold for a whole lot more than I would pay for it.)

It appears to be in not quite usable condition. For that kind of scratch, I'd expect one ready to rock and roll. And it appears to take a blade that might be hard to find these days, so to make it usable will likely require either modifying the tool or tweaking a more readily available blade, such as an X-Acto blade. And that could be a pain in the rump, assuming a person would sooner work with his tools, rather than on them.

Another part of me likes to think that the price that tool sold for is a sign that my equipment is increasing in value. But I suspect it's likelier that it's an anomaly.

For a look at as nice a rounding jack as you'll likely come across, check out Mark Decou's offering. The basic design differs little from that old beater one pictured above, but it's considerably more substantial. Check out the video (made by my friend Tom Gomez), which shows some detail of the tool itself, and how it perfectly rounds a hat brim in a matter of seconds ... http://lumberjocks.com/projects/7047

 

[John Galt]

Tonyb,

You are probably right all the way around.

DeCou undoubtedly makes great equipment, but it is quite frankly cost prohibitive for many itinerant hatters and do-it-yourselfers. At the prices an entry-level rounding jack commands, though, it isn't too hard to see how someone (not me, obviously) might pay $210+ for an antique rounding jack, and that is particularly true for a collectors of such items. Hatter's irons are also quite expensive in certain circles.

And yes, your tools are surely rising in value, just like Whippets, Stratoliners, and Playboys, which could be found at reasonable prices not too very long ago, and which are now commonly listed at jaw-dropping prices.


"Faint hat never won fair lady."