Paddys; Japs; Yanks:? who uses these names and why?

[Marc Chevalier]

I've been to Japan and they think they are a superior race...to everyone else.

So do some Southerners ... and one of my ancestors was killed by one of theirs in the Civil War (or the War of Northern Aggression, or whatever). Should I call today's Southerners "d**m Rebs"? And plenty of Africans and their progeny were enslaved, raped, lynched and burned alive by Southerners for several hundred years. Should the descendants of those Africans have a grudge against the descendants of those slaveholders and lynchers? I don't think so.

Some Northerners think themselves superior ... and several of them axed some Southern men and women to death at Harper's Ferry. Should Southerners continue to call Northerners "d**m Yankees"?

At what point should we make peace with one another?

I'm angry at what the Japanese government (in the pocket of the Japanese military) and Japanese officers and soldiers did to Americans, Filipinos, Asian Pacific Islanders, Chinese, and Koreans. But I don't hold it against their children or grandchildren -- just as I don't hold anything against the children, grandchildren, and all descendants of pre-1865 slaveholders ... unless they continued to behave as their ancestors did.

Also: are the Japanese a race, or citizens of a country?

More to the point, what exactly is a "Jap"? Does the term include the women, children, the old and the sick who lived in Japan and its territories between 1941 and 1945? Are today's vets who fought on the Japanese side still considered "Japs"? Even those who may regret what they did?

Do Americans not think of themselves as "superior to everyone else"? When it comes to this point, we're living in a glass house.

Nothing personal, mind you.
(I know that Biltmore Bob won't take it personally anyway. In that regard, I hope others here will show the same wisdom as he.)

-- Marc (who probably should spit on every Brit he sees for the Boston Massacre of 1770.)

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Please, whoever is in charge around here, don't close down this thread just yet. A bit more dialogue might help us understand where we're coming from. At the very least, we might get to hear what is meant by the word "Jap". I really want to know. Let's get a more exact definition.

 

[The Captain]

Definition, please

Marc, when I was growing up during the war years, we used "JAPPED" as a verb, as in "He Japped me", meaning someone had covertly and with the intention of causing harm, had blindsided him. Get the picture?

 

[Marc Chevalier]

That makes sense. It's sort of like the British saying "Dutch courage" as a euphemism for cowardice. By the way, the Dutch say (in Dutch, of course) "British courage." You can guess what they mean by it! When I was a kid, we called a person who reneged on a deal an "Indian giver." Guess what inspired that! Not to mention "welshing" on a deal. Are the Welsh really so devious?

I understand what you mean by the verb. It's the noun "Jap" which is more difficult. I'm going to take a stab at it and guess that it means "A Japanese man or woman who wanted Japan to go to war against the United States, and win that war."

If you agree with my definition, you'll also agree that all other Japanese were not (and should not have been labeled as, and should not be labeled as) "Japs." Correct?

In short, does "Jap" = an enemy, or does Jap = a Japanese citizen, period?



By the way, Captain, I tip my hat to you for being willing to talk about these things. They need hashing out. Most folks just want to bury their heads under a heap of self-narcosis. "Don't talk about it!", they say. "We might get stressed!"

 

[Andykev]

I am at a loss, but understand.

To be honest, I am confused on this thread. Maybe some posts disappeared.
Nice post Root, but from what I see tonight, unless things have been deleted, I haven't seen any serious blunders.

When I talk about WWII, or that time period, I have used "Japs" and "Krauts" to describe the Japaneese or German people. Those names do not apply today, and those nations are our strong allies. But when I watch "Saving Private Ryan" , read one of my many 8TH Airforce books, "Band of Brothers", "Pearl Harbor", or the John Wayne period movies...ya, I call 'em Japs, Krauts.

War is hell. Americans fought and sacraficed. Horrible, unspeakable acts were done on BOTH sides (no, I don't know of any American who operated a Death Camp and threw Jews into the oven). Did we shoot unarmed Germans? Probably. Did the Japaneese torture captives? The Rape of Manchuria? The use of the Atomic Bomb, and fire bombing of civillians? Dresden?

Maybe war should be horror. Then we'd have less of it.

Today, we are at war. No one wants to admit it.

And this post is inappropriate for this section. However, Great Root, for singing praise for what the American Nation did so many years ago.

 

[MrBern]

Marc, when I was growing up during the war years, we used "JAPPED" as a verb, as in "He Japped me", meaning someone had covertly and with the intention of causing harm, had blindsided him. Get the picture?

Hey, when I was in HighSchool inthe`80s, surprise pop quizes were sometimes called 'jap' tests.
I totally understand where your coming from.
Hey, werent they called 'Nips' on McHalesNavy? We all grew up watching the same movies.

Its just that nowadays, I feel that sort of phrase is derogatory & rascist. It has a place in the vernacular of WWII.

 

[MK]

.

It is interesting that some people have all these definitions for "jap". My understanding is that is simply short for Japanese.....just like Brit is short for British. I will say that I have never heard of an English person being offended by being called a Brit.

The terms are of little importance. The substance of the issue are the opinions and perhaps the emotions. By trying to make the terms taboo little is accomplished....and in some cases it just adds one more problem to the heep.

Lately I have heard people use the word "Bogart" to imply stealing. Should we shame people for misuse of Humphrey's name and make it politically incorrect to say his family name?

I like Bogie a lot.....but I have better things to do.

People get way too caught up in finding things to get upset over.

 

[Hemingway Jones]

Lately I have heard people use the word "Bogart" to imply stealing. Should we shame people for misuse of Humphrey's name and make it politically incorrect to say his family name?

I like Bogie a lot.....but I have better things to do.

People get way too caught up in finding things to get upset over.

Which brings us right back to WWII, enemy planes known as "Bogies."

 

[Biltmore Bob]

A week or so ago I ruffled the feathers of some...

When I wrote the word 'Jap'. In that instance I was merely using it as a diminutive of the word 'Japanese'. Someone took offense and I don't even think they are Japanese. I'll try to find the post. It may be in the Observation Bar, from which I have been banned for various and sundry offenses, so I can't pull it up. Anyone else with full priviledges can find it for themselves.

For me a Jap or a Nip is an Imperial Japanese Serviceman of WWII. Really no big deal. We called the Somalis 'Skinnies', we call the Iraqis 'Rags'. We called the Viet Cong 'Charlie' or 'Gook'. Big deal they were the enemy. I have a Vietnamese friend that owns a grocery in Houston and I would not dream of calling him 'Gook'. I have an English friend that calls me 'Yank', I really don't like that one. One of my Black buddies from Lousiana calls me 'Uncle Cracker'.

Mark...I never said anything other than we must remember....I never said we needed to hate and not forgive. Just as we should remember the War of Northern Aggression (I prefer that term) and the atrocities that were committed on both sides. I don't believe in revisionist history. If it was bad, for crying out loud, we need to know. Slavery was wrong, that's why we don't practice it now, like they do in the Sudan.

I don't believe in reparations for ancient history either. I joke that I should get reparations from most everyone. I have a diverse mixture of Scotch, Irish, Cherokee Indian and Negro blood. Imagine that.

Now back on topic...the Marine I mentioned earlier that survived PH told me he slept in his clothes for years after the attack. He fought all that morning in his underwear.

 

[Hondo]

Hey, when I was in HighSchool inthe`80s, surprise pop quizes were sometimes called 'jap' tests.
I totally understand where your coming from.
Hey, werent they called 'Nips' on McHalesNavy? We all grew up watching the same movies.

Its just that nowadays, I feel that sort of phrase is derogatory & rascist. It has a place in the vernacular of WWII.

I understand what you?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢re saying, and being part Japanese, Dutch, English & Irish. I honestly don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t let it bother me, unless they said it to my face. I enjoy Japanese food, culture, its rich history same as I do with English, Italians, Russian, German and what else is out there.
WR started this thread as a tribute not as a race issue, should remain on topic but I?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢ve notice most of Bob?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s posts come off as angry, or resentment, maybe it was stress. I sure hope he isn?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t a wife, or child beater. He?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s got some personal issues and vents it here. All in all I think Bob?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s intelligent enough to know better, right from wrong, and he shouldn?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t take this as offensive. I do believe he said he isn?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t offended on the internet.
Anyway enjoy the holidays. (burp) I've said enough
MrBern, Shamus, WR, Andy and others, you guys are are amazing, enjoy your comments, in all honesty if any one doesn't agree on a post probably best to ignore the person, no sense beating a dead horse.

'Nips' on McHalesNavy?' yeah it was but you couldn't say japs on TV
Lets lighten up, Cheers and happy Holidays :cheers1:

 

[MrBern]

Steal? I thought it meant hogging a joint instead of passing it on?
Not that Bogart smoked joints.
But he did smoke a lot.
And of course, nowadays, people arent allowed to smoke wherever they want.
Times change, we know better now.