Doctor Damage
I'll Lock Up
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Nomex Flyer jacket
- Thread starter calderoni
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Doctor Damage
I'll Lock Up
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- 4,324
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- Ontario
Just shoot me a message via the forum here and provide a gmail or hotmail address or whatever you use. BN1966 can attest I'm not some nutter, so you don't need to worry about being flooded with neo nazi propaganda or whatnot. My "manual" isn't done but I'll send what I've got once I give it a once-over on the weekend and clean up some of the bad english. There's more than enough to get you interested and looking around for jackets.
I got into nomex because the vintage nylon at low prices was drying up, but nomex was cheap, and I like the small but usable collar (I hate the knit collars on MA-1). There is a danger of getting hooked on nomex, esp if you develop a taste for ones with velcro receivers all over them (which were haphazardly sewn on at the unit level). I had opened up one at the office and our president at the time saw it and instantly wanted one (he used to be Cdn Forces). I once had a 19 year old hottie chat me up in a coffee shop asking about my 36P jacket and why does it have velcro patches, etc. Your mileage may vary.
@Doctor Damage, thanks very much indeed!
Yes, a quick look on eBay tells me that prices are still reasonable at this time, but yes, if I wait 10 years or so before developing a real hankering for one, I'll be asking about 'the best repro' I imagine.
So, while I'm about it, I want to get a 36 and a 45.
My mileage? Ha! I am on a very short leash indeed.
Yes, a quick look on eBay tells me that prices are still reasonable at this time, but yes, if I wait 10 years or so before developing a real hankering for one, I'll be asking about 'the best repro' I imagine.
So, while I'm about it, I want to get a 36 and a 45.
My mileage? Ha! I am on a very short leash indeed.
Doctor Damage
I'll Lock Up
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- 4,324
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Wore my 36 out to a cherry blossom viewing party last night. Just the thing for a spring evening over a t-shirt.
Looked at it today and realized that it was filthy with grime (didn't notice before I wore it).
Looked at both of my 45s. Also really grimy.
Put all jackets in some laundry bags and washed them in the washing machine with detergent on a short cold cycle. Came out nice and clean, no problems.
Thanks to Doctor Damage!
Looked at it today and realized that it was filthy with grime (didn't notice before I wore it).
Looked at both of my 45s. Also really grimy.
Put all jackets in some laundry bags and washed them in the washing machine with detergent on a short cold cycle. Came out nice and clean, no problems.
Thanks to Doctor Damage!
Doctor Damage
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Delighted you managed to get them clean using the machine wash method! Dry cleaning does absolutely nothing!
Nomex jackets are great, esp the 36P which works well in a wide range of temperatures.
Flightengineer
Practically Family
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I completely agree. My old 36 is very comfortable.
Chris_B
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I am also looking into getting a Nomex CWU and would really like to have one of those with the matte fabric.
Is there any way to identify them definetely? The pictures on eBay can be very misleading.
Judging by the pictures on the Valley Apparel website I also have the impression, that the newer versions are not as blousy as before. Is that correct?
Many thanks in advance!
Doctor Damage
I'll Lock Up
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I'm not sure how to discern the new matte finish since I have not been looking at these for a while, but I think they will not reflect camera flashes and will look matte in clear photos. The two older styles always have a sheen in photos. Check the tag: if it's Valley and the date is the last couple years then you're probalby safe. But see the post made in this thread by two of our members who are serving (posts #147 and #148): they said the new matte ones are not as nice looking as the older ones. I suggest getting one from the 1990s or 2000s which will be relatively cheap used and have a lovely sheen to them. It's that sheen that makes these jackets look so nice. If you want something matte and bland-looking then nylon or nomex might not be for you.
As for fit, go by the tag size (I've posted the official measurements in this thread somewhere) basically the official sizing is fine, i.e. M = 38-40, L = 42-44, etc. Don't rely on photos for fit or blousy or anything, these jackets look different on everyone. Don't overthink these jackets, they're made to fit a wide range of body shapes, etc, and are intended as practical 'working' jackets with appearance a low priority. If you want a perfect fitting jacket then maybe these aren't for you.
As for fit, go by the tag size (I've posted the official measurements in this thread somewhere) basically the official sizing is fine, i.e. M = 38-40, L = 42-44, etc. Don't rely on photos for fit or blousy or anything, these jackets look different on everyone. Don't overthink these jackets, they're made to fit a wide range of body shapes, etc, and are intended as practical 'working' jackets with appearance a low priority. If you want a perfect fitting jacket then maybe these aren't for you.
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My CWU45. Issue date was c.1982. Size 38 but still fits like a champ. We wore these to fly in much more than the G-1s, warmer and more practical. Plus, nobody wanted to hog up their G-1 by flying in it!
Flightengineer
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I've got an early CWU 45 with Bi swing action back, lovely soft textiles
I also noticed that earlier jackets has softer fabric.
My old CWU-36 differ from the modern for the better.
Doctor Damage
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CWU 36/P nomex for Top Gun sequel.
Flightengineer
Practically Family
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ooo.... no....and bikes again
Doctor Damage
I'll Lock Up
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Lots of 36P jackets on display here...
Doctor Damage
I'll Lock Up
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Here's a rundown on nylon civilian 45P jackets which I put together for one of our members. It may by of some use for people digging around on e-bay etc. Nylon versions of these jackets have advantages the nomex doesn't have. These are my opinions. Your mileage may vary.
-----
You'll probably get bored of nomex pretty quickly, mainly because other than the bi-swing or no-bi-swing they are all the same. But there have been a lot of nylon civilian versions which are fun to hunt for. 99% of nylon civilian CWU jackets are insulated "45/P" jackets.
Alpha makes excellent nylon versions of these, basically identical to the military ones except nylon and polyfill instead of nomex/aramid. Same fit. The current version has a big "A" stamped onto the velcro, which annoys me, but if you're patient you can probably find an older Alpha USA-made one or an early post-USA-made one which doesn't have the stamped A on the velcro. However, if you like using your own leather or cloth nametag on the velcro then it hides the A and I guess you're fine. I have one of the USA-made nylon ones and it's great, arguably more wearable on a daily basis than nomex, plus it's identical in every detail. Alpha did have for a year or two a jacket called the Mcguire which was supposed to be a nylon emulation of nomex, but it looked like crap and made a rustling sound at the slightest tough. Alpha's regular nylon version is far better.
I also came across and bought a Levi's 45/P jacket... yes, that's right, it was made by Levi's the jeans company, and extremely rare. I really like it. I've only seen one of those and that's the one I bought, lol
Schott did a version which shows up often on e-bay, but the nylon cloth they used frays easily (weird) and they're matador jacket, i.e. barely long enough to reach your belly button. BN1966 has had problems with the Schott version, so avoid. These are basically women's jackets, they should never have sold them to men.
Cockpit used to do a nylon version, but why pay their prices?
Rothco has one, but their stuff always look cheap and flimsy. You can buy them for pennies, though. They fit big (I have their official measurements here somewhere, if you like) and have a bi-swing back.
Helikon, which I think is from Poland, used to have a bi-swing version with a removable fur collar. Not sure if those are still in production.
If you're in Japan, a brand name called Houston (uniquely) offered a nylon 36/P version which looked convincing in photos. Not sure if those are still available.
G&B did some hybrid ones, all the details of a 45/P but without insulation. Bi-swing. I had a couple of those but they fit small (opposite of G&B's leather jackets, which fit like tents). Very well made but hard to find. Sometimes with Flight Suits or Wild Blue Yonder tags.
Avirex did some nylon ones. I think I've only seen one or two for sale, lol
Brandit is another european brand, look like same quality as Rothco, i.e. low quality.
I've seen one Lancer, which although nylon was identical to a bi-swing mil-spec jacket in every other way, including a military tag. Very odd jacket. Isratex, which had a military contract for a while, also did a nylon CWU which was identical to military jackets. Only seen one of those.
Buzz did one in black black black (but not a Gibson). Charles from HPC said these were great quality and I believe him based on photos. But rare as hen's teeth (one season only, I think) and definitely not available in big sizes. EDIT: Looking at Japan yahoo and rakuten, it appears they did a Gibson version which on the outside looks right but on the inside has incorrectly quilted interior plus two interior pockets a-la the MA-1 which the real CWU jackets to do not. But no doubt quality is superb like all Buzz products.
Spiewak did a 45/P under their Golden Fleece label, some were sold under Harley Davidson label too! I've only seen photos of one, but it looked great and had perfect bi-swing era detailing. The shell was a matte look, almost a heavy cotton.
Valley Apparel LLC did have some nylon ones on their website a few years back, not sure how you can actually buy them though. They had the recent contract to the military and they jackets in photos looked identical except made in nylon.
-----
You'll probably get bored of nomex pretty quickly, mainly because other than the bi-swing or no-bi-swing they are all the same. But there have been a lot of nylon civilian versions which are fun to hunt for. 99% of nylon civilian CWU jackets are insulated "45/P" jackets.
Alpha makes excellent nylon versions of these, basically identical to the military ones except nylon and polyfill instead of nomex/aramid. Same fit. The current version has a big "A" stamped onto the velcro, which annoys me, but if you're patient you can probably find an older Alpha USA-made one or an early post-USA-made one which doesn't have the stamped A on the velcro. However, if you like using your own leather or cloth nametag on the velcro then it hides the A and I guess you're fine. I have one of the USA-made nylon ones and it's great, arguably more wearable on a daily basis than nomex, plus it's identical in every detail. Alpha did have for a year or two a jacket called the Mcguire which was supposed to be a nylon emulation of nomex, but it looked like crap and made a rustling sound at the slightest tough. Alpha's regular nylon version is far better.
I also came across and bought a Levi's 45/P jacket... yes, that's right, it was made by Levi's the jeans company, and extremely rare. I really like it. I've only seen one of those and that's the one I bought, lol
Schott did a version which shows up often on e-bay, but the nylon cloth they used frays easily (weird) and they're matador jacket, i.e. barely long enough to reach your belly button. BN1966 has had problems with the Schott version, so avoid. These are basically women's jackets, they should never have sold them to men.
Cockpit used to do a nylon version, but why pay their prices?
Rothco has one, but their stuff always look cheap and flimsy. You can buy them for pennies, though. They fit big (I have their official measurements here somewhere, if you like) and have a bi-swing back.
Helikon, which I think is from Poland, used to have a bi-swing version with a removable fur collar. Not sure if those are still in production.
If you're in Japan, a brand name called Houston (uniquely) offered a nylon 36/P version which looked convincing in photos. Not sure if those are still available.
G&B did some hybrid ones, all the details of a 45/P but without insulation. Bi-swing. I had a couple of those but they fit small (opposite of G&B's leather jackets, which fit like tents). Very well made but hard to find. Sometimes with Flight Suits or Wild Blue Yonder tags.
Avirex did some nylon ones. I think I've only seen one or two for sale, lol
Brandit is another european brand, look like same quality as Rothco, i.e. low quality.
I've seen one Lancer, which although nylon was identical to a bi-swing mil-spec jacket in every other way, including a military tag. Very odd jacket. Isratex, which had a military contract for a while, also did a nylon CWU which was identical to military jackets. Only seen one of those.
Buzz did one in black black black (but not a Gibson). Charles from HPC said these were great quality and I believe him based on photos. But rare as hen's teeth (one season only, I think) and definitely not available in big sizes. EDIT: Looking at Japan yahoo and rakuten, it appears they did a Gibson version which on the outside looks right but on the inside has incorrectly quilted interior plus two interior pockets a-la the MA-1 which the real CWU jackets to do not. But no doubt quality is superb like all Buzz products.
Spiewak did a 45/P under their Golden Fleece label, some were sold under Harley Davidson label too! I've only seen photos of one, but it looked great and had perfect bi-swing era detailing. The shell was a matte look, almost a heavy cotton.
Valley Apparel LLC did have some nylon ones on their website a few years back, not sure how you can actually buy them though. They had the recent contract to the military and they jackets in photos looked identical except made in nylon.
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Thanks to Doctor D for putting all that together
I've recently aquired another Alpha CWU 45P in nylon (made in USA version) previous one was stolen... they are a great jacket IMHO and make for a great daily wearer..very practical..especially for driving..light, articulated and warm.
The only nomex that I own now is a very early 45P with a bi-swing back as the Doc sayes..nomex can get boring..I had quite a few & realised I only needed one
I've recently aquired another Alpha CWU 45P in nylon (made in USA version) previous one was stolen... they are a great jacket IMHO and make for a great daily wearer..very practical..especially for driving..light, articulated and warm.
The only nomex that I own now is a very early 45P with a bi-swing back as the Doc sayes..nomex can get boring..I had quite a few & realised I only needed one
Whoah! Did someone say nomex is boring?!? OMG!
LOLZ
I bought a 45 and a 36 last year and love the trim fit from the bi-swing backs.
Than I thought about how relatively rare they are, so I bought a more modern 45 without it.
Then I saw that Maverick will wear one in the new Top Gun movie, so I bought another modern 45 and 36 because when that movie hits the cinemas I think there will be a rush on the real thing pushing up used prices stupidly. And the malls will be full of cheap simulacra, making the real thing kinda 'cheesy' for s couple of years, so I'm wearing the hell out of mine now.
LOLZ
I bought a 45 and a 36 last year and love the trim fit from the bi-swing backs.
Than I thought about how relatively rare they are, so I bought a more modern 45 without it.
Then I saw that Maverick will wear one in the new Top Gun movie, so I bought another modern 45 and 36 because when that movie hits the cinemas I think there will be a rush on the real thing pushing up used prices stupidly. And the malls will be full of cheap simulacra, making the real thing kinda 'cheesy' for s couple of years, so I'm wearing the hell out of mine now.
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