New Bill Kelso Half-Belt California Sportswear

[Seb Lucas]

In terms of the jacket being similar in front to others that's because that's a standard held-belt look. Two side pockets - a chest zip pocket for cigarettes and no storm flap.

 

[Dinerman]

Here's a side by side of one of the other Bill Kelso halfbelts and the original jacket it was based on

 

[Seb Lucas]

From Filmjackets.com

Here side by side are the back of Tony Nowak's Surrogates copy and an original 1940's Californian. You can see where the Nowak comes from.



And front




Original is on the left.

 

[tmitchell59]

Nice BK. I have a BK Duke I will be posting shortly. It is a nice jacket.

 

[pipvh]

What's the consensus of opinion about having one of these made with a mandarin collar, in imitation of this jacket posted by Dinerman on the Cafe Racer Ancestors thread?

 

[Seb Lucas]

What's the consensus of opinion about having one of these made with a mandarin collar, in imitation of this jacket posted by Dinerman on the Cafe Racer Ancestors thread?

View attachment 13568

Shouldn't this be on a different thread? Not sure how this relates to BK half-belts.

 

[Edward]

What's the consensus of opinion about having one of these made with a mandarin collar, in imitation of this jacket posted by Dinerman on the Cafe Racer Ancestors thread?

View attachment 13568

Wouldn't be my personal choice as I much prefer the regular shirt collar, but it was done back in thed day and I don't see why it wouldn't work, if that's what you like.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Hey hey! Posted by Baron Kurtz, I'll have you know. [EDIT ah, yes, I see that thread now] The mandarin was popular in Canada, it seems. My 1930s/40s jackets (this one included) with this collar config are all Canadian (bear Canadian Lightning zips and some have Canadian labels). The sunburst back of this one is fantastic.

tbh, I'm not seeing the Kelso jacket as anything really all that special. It's just a half-belt jacket, a very basic design indeed, produced by pretty much every leather manufacturer back in the day, and many companies offers some kind of version today. I'm sure it's a very nice, very well made jacket (if they keep the weight of the leather down), but not really unique.

What's the consensus of opinion about having one of these made with a mandarin collar, in imitation of this jacket posted by Dinerman on the Cafe Racer Ancestors thread?

View attachment 13568

 

[Seb Lucas]

Jeez guys, is this a manderin collar thread or one on cafe racers?

Baron, I agree. This is an essential half belt and reasonably unremarkable. But to my taste, this particular combination, with the yolk and the bi-swing back, (which are often missing from half-belts, as they are on the BK Westfall) and with the American cuffs, it's the best of the "unremarkable" half-belts. I'm not into, for instance the vulgar, showy back of the Sunburst style. Not that there's anything wrong with it. But people like different things. My preference is for really well executed conservative designs.

I agree with you about the weight. When will they learn?

 

[pipvh]

Damn - sorry, Baron!

But to my taste, this particular combination, with the yolk and the bi-swing back, (which are often missing from half-belts, as they are on the BK Westfall) plus the American cuffs, it's the best of the "unremarkable" half-belts.

I agree. The market is awash with this design at the moment but the BK stands out just enough. And might look good with one of those Canadian mandarins... Still, no excuse for a thread hijack, though!

 

[Seb Lucas]

That's cool pipvh. I'm a bit excited that there are now a range of good basic half-belts on offer. I understand Vanson is doing this one too for Logan's Closet. Over here you don't see half-belts. Ever. I always think of them as the quintessential leather civilian leather jacket. And much as I like the Aero and Alexander 1930's version, I really like this design. And yes, the BK version is particularly charismatic.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

The yoke of the Kelso jacket - is it straight, or scalloped? It looks a bit wavy in the picture, suggesting scallops, but that might be just the way it's laying down on the front of the jacket.

I'm not quite seeing how "action" pleats extending from the bottom of the yoke rather than from the shoulder would function.

 

[Seb Lucas]

The yoke of the Kelso jacket - is it straight, or scalloped? It looks a bit wavy in the picture, suggesting scallops, but that might be just the way it's laying down on the front of the jacket.

I'm not quite seeing how "action" pleats extending from the bottom of the yoke rather than from the shoulder would function.

No, the yolk is quite straight. Action pleats? Hey, what's the point of a d pocket? It's a leather jacket, man. I have this pattern and it works fine when you lift your arms to pick up something heavy. But I also like jackets with no pleats and no action back and I can still pick up something heavy. I get it, you don't like this one. As it happens I agree with your posts elsewhere about the way almost all leather jacket repos get it wrong with leather thickness and patterns.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

I never said I didn't like it, just that it's not exceptional.

My point was that the action pleats aren't just an aesthetic extra like a different style of pocket. They actually have a function in reducing strain on the armscye seams. With most of the tension (when reaching forward) being placed on the armhole from break to shoulder point - in this case the region approximately demarcated by the yoke - having the action pleats start under the yoke kinda defeats the purpose, from a design standpoint. I was just thinking out loud, I guess, about how I would introduce an action pleat to this model, which I agree is better than most. were I to find a vintage example, i would of course be glad to wear it!


What is the weight of the Kelso leathers, btw? This would be brilliant in a mid-weight grainy goatskin.

 

[Seb Lucas]

Sorry Baron, I'm a bit jumpy. You're right, it isn't exceptional. However my point is that there are many established jacket patterns out there. Some of them (like this one for me) are more noteworthy and desirable.

 

[ProteinNerd]

So the surrogates jacket is based on a 40's pattern? Is it as slim as a 30's or as boxy as a 50's half belt?

 

[Seb Lucas]

From what I've seen this Californian fits somewhere between the two.

 

[ProteinNerd]

I didn't have pleats put in mine but I miss them.

Hey Seb, what exactly do you miss about them? Functionality, Aesthetics?

 

[Seb Lucas]

I miss the look of them. This half-belt has the added bonus of a yolk an action back and pleats. Form over function, but I like the look.

 

[zhz]

Yes, from what I've been told, this jacket is not as slim as Westfall. But BK can customize it to a slim jacket. Or you can customize the back of Westfall like this one.