Need help finding the "right" B-3 jacket

[John Lever]

Zep, now that you have your VLJ acct, be sure to check out the 'Review' section. It'll have detailed critiques of all jackets over a several year period most with multiple photos.

Sadly a great many reviews were lost a year or so ago during a forum crash.

 

[Zepticon]

I got some meassurements taken today, they are the following:
Chest - 104cm
Waist - 90cm
Shoulder to shoulder - 46cm
Arm length - 66cm (shoulder to the midle of my wrist)

I am 183cm high, and 86kg, with an atheltic body.

I sent a mail to Eastman, and they are suggesting a size 44 for me, while i was thinking it would be a 42 judging from my chest size alone. Does anyone have input on this? I hate conflicting information

Another "problem" is that the Irvin style jacket keeps growing on me... Just to make the desicion even harder.

 

[Stand By]

My chest is 100cm and my ELC Irvin and B-3 are size 42 - and they're perfect for me. But I'm 173cm tall ....
You don't want these things too snug ... So a 44 sounds like sound advice to me.

 

[Edward]

The LW is damn near bullet proof. Very thick and heavy. Best for long hours outdoors. HH on arms barely creased after all these years.

That's been my experience of the LW B3 too. How do you find the Aero and the Eastman compare in terms of toughness of the shearling? I was very surprised at how much lighter my ELC Irvin was when it arrived (though I've had no problems with it, and it's as warm as the B3). I'm tempted by a redskin B3. I don't really need one, but....

 

[Plumbline]

I'm 170cm and 88kg, 109cm Chest, 90cm waist and the Eastman 44" Irvin is "just" long enough ... at 183cm I'd suggest it'd be a little short in both the body and the arm. The Eastman 44" fits like an Aero 42". The B-3 is similarly cut to the Irvin and I'd go with a 44" LONG for your height.

Sold my Eastman B-3 and Irvin last year ... I NEED pockets ... 42" Aero and a 44" Eastman ANJ-4 are a great fit IMHO on me ..... so you'd probably be similar in a 42" Long (Aero) and a 44" (Long) Eastman ... you'd need to check your arm measurement (pit-cuff and shoulder-cuff)

 

[archbury918]

That's been my experience of the LW B3 too. How do you find the Aero and the Eastman compare in terms of toughness of the shearling?

The LW is by far the heaviest. Surprisingly the Aero is heavier than either ELC. I don't remember the weights off hand, but believe the Aero was just over 7lbs (sorry, dumb American here...don't know the metric conversion! ).
As for shearling durability, the Aero is a thick but fine shearling. Reminiscent of a cotton ball. I've had no problems at neck or sleeve although I said I typically wear a scarf to minimize oil and wear. I also have B-6 and D-1 from Aero, where it's a slightly different issue, but of course its a shorter fleece length.

I would love a redskin B-3. I have an Aero D-1 redskin that is a favored jacket for me. The fleece is like melted French Vanilla ice cream in color. With the seal facings on the mahogany like body is absolutely gorgeous. The OD stitching is subtle but striking. It draws many an admiring look from women...a definite plus! Since the cut and fleece length permits more versatile wear, it is why I opted for the D-1 over a B-3. Edward...give in to the temptation!! :cool2:

 

[Bunyip]

I love the B3, just too warm to wear too often in Australia. Seriously tempted by a d1 though...I wonder how much warmer the b3 is compared to the d1. I really like the Eastman designs for these jackets, but also love the aero ANJ.?..good luck with your search...too many choices!

 

[rocketeer]

Aviation Leather craft have this: http://www.flying-jacket.com/product-details.aspx?id=12
Nice price, but no images

I did request an image of this jacket, but like their Irvin, it is not really a good representation of a WWII replica so deleted the pics.
Best description I can think of is probably, 'A well made sheepskin jacket with leather reinforcements to the elbows, a single pocket on the front. Maybe thats why they dont post pics on their webpages.

 

[Zepticon]

I'm 170cm and 88kg, 109cm Chest, 90cm waist and the Eastman 44" Irvin is "just" long enough ... at 183cm I'd suggest it'd be a little short in both the body and the arm. The Eastman 44" fits like an Aero 42". The B-3 is similarly cut to the Irvin and I'd go with a 44" LONG for your height.

Sold my Eastman B-3 and Irvin last year ... I NEED pockets ... 42" Aero and a 44" Eastman ANJ-4 are a great fit IMHO on me ..... so you'd probably be similar in a 42" Long (Aero) and a 44" (Long) Eastman ... you'd need to check your arm measurement (pit-cuff and shoulder-cuff)

I will try and get the meassurements tonight, but where should the cuff be on those meassurements? on the middle of my wrist?

I am not a bit confused also, when you say 44" Long, is that a different size than 44?
Again i must apolgize for my lack of knowledge, but i have never bought a jacket that rely on body meassurements, and have allways had the fortune of beeing able to test fit them.

 

[Edward]

I did request an image of this jacket, but like their Irvin, it is not really a good representation of a WWII replica so deleted the pics.
Best description I can think of is probably, 'A well made sheepskin jacket with leather reinforcements to the elbows, a single pocket on the front. Maybe thats why they dont post pics on their webpages.

Mn, though you'd think it would only backfire in having to deal with returns et cetera from folks who were disappointed... Always seemed a shame to me they didn't try to produce more accurate jackets, especially with them being the only ones who have the right to use the Irvin mark. Still, they obviously know their market, and what sells... [huh]

 

[Stand By]

Edward, it was the Irvin patent that was the main factor for me buying my Irvin from them back in '88 (ye olde pre-internet research days).
My brother loved mine so much, he bought one for himself 18 months later ...
And when I got my ELC Irvin in 2006, I showed it to him - and he was wowed by its tailoring and materials etc. And I asked him if he now thought he'd get himself an upgrade too...?
And he just said"Nah" ... he likes what he still has and doesn't care enough to spend the little extra money on what it could get him.
And that's the difference between people who do care for history and authenticity and have an eye for details and appreciate them (like a single malt) - and those who don't (and have a glass of Bell's). Horses for courses.

 

[Zepticon]

I got some meassurements taken today, they are the following:
Chest - 104cm
Waist - 90cm
Shoulder to shoulder - 46cm
Arm length - 66cm (shoulder to the midle of my wrist)

I am 183cm high, and 86kg, with an atheltic body.

I sent a mail to Eastman, and they are suggesting a size 44 for me, while i was thinking it would be a 42 judging from my chest size alone. Does anyone have input on this? I hate conflicting information

Another "problem" is that the Irvin style jacket keeps growing on me... Just to make the desicion even harder.

Does anyone else have any input on this?
Foster has a very nice B-3 for sale in size 44, and it is the perfect look for what i wanted.
But as i have said in the posts earlier, and also when talking to Foster, i have never needed to use meassurements to buy clothing, and also never even thought about spending that much on a jacket.
And i really dont want to end up with a jacket that does not fit. But then again, i guess since it is such a quality product, it is possible to sell it if its not a perfect fit

 

[Bunyip]

I found a nice Avirex b3 called the general Patton. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? It has the slash side pockets, so not too accurate. It does look great. I'm led to believe the quality of Avirex is ok?

 

[archbury918]

Does anyone else have any input on this?
Foster has a very nice B-3 for sale in size 44, and it is the perfect look for what i wanted.

I think that's an almost ideal purchase for you. It's a way to get your 'feet wet', and as you stated, it can be resold if it's not quite perfect for you.

 

[rocketeer]

Mn, though you'd think it would only backfire in having to deal with returns et cetera from folks who were disappointed... Always seemed a shame to me they didn't try to produce more accurate jackets, especially with them being the only ones who have the right to use the Irvin mark. Still, they obviously know their market, and what sells... [huh]

Their market is the generic sports car driver rather than aviation enthusiasts. I would think the authentic historically correct jacket makers make a good profit but where profit is concerned but Aviation Leathercraft make so much more simply because the collector market is probably a much smaller concern than the open sports car types. And of course those that just want a 'flying jacket' because they are warm.

 

[Edward]

Their market is the generic sports car driver rather than aviation enthusiasts. I would think the authentic historically correct jacket makers make a good profit but where profit is concerned but Aviation Leathercraft make so much more simply because the collector market is probably a much smaller concern than the open sports car types. And of course those that just want a 'flying jacket' because they are warm.

Yes, that's true. It was always the car mags I saw ALC advertised in when I was a kid. Ironically, for all they hold the rights to the Irvin name, it was their marketing that actually put me off the Irvin style for years because I hated the look of their jackets. I even thought I hated Irvins until I saw a jacket that actually looked like the real thing, even if they can't call it one...

I saw a similar company - not sure of it was Cirrus, I don't think so but can't remember the name, at Goodwood Revival this year. Surprises me that more of the repro sorts don't head there, tbh. Soldier of Fortune had a nice stall (with an actually quite nice looking Thai B10 repro they've recently started doing. Not in the Buzz or ELC class, of course, but for GBP125, a lot closer than I'd have expected in terms of getting the general look right, even if it was probably off in some minor details and the mouton was likely faux...). With the number of folks I see running around there in repro gear, and knowing how depe are the pockets of many of the attendees, chances are the likes of ELC or Aero could do quite nicely (course, they probably both have very full order books already, so maybe no need!).

 

[Sloan1874]

I've always thought there was something curiously feminine about ALC's jackets - perhaps it's the uber-plush shearling. I'm sure it's way warm, though.

 

[Zepticon]

I think that's an almost ideal purchase for you. It's a way to get your 'feet wet', and as you stated, it can be resold if it's not quite perfect for you.

Yes, it was But i think my post here making alot of attention towards the B-3 made someone suddently get some interest in it, or just get down from the fence. Someone PMed foster and said they wanted it, and since i am not 100% sure about sizes yet i told him to go ahead and sell it to the other guy. But yes, it would have been a pretty nice "beginners" jacket for me, and if the sale falls through i will see if we cant make a deal.

My old winter jacket is still keeping me warm, and i am in no hurry to buy anything. Actually i didnt even think about getting one this side of christmas untill you people told me about all the used jackets that are sold here and on the forums, that go for quite a lot less than the new ones. And that way i can even afford one of the more authentic ones

 

[rocketeer]

Yes, that's true. It was always the car mags I saw ALC advertised in when I was a kid. Ironically, for all they hold the rights to the Irvin name, it was their marketing that actually put me off the Irvin style for years because I hated the look of their jackets. I even thought I hated Irvins until I saw a jacket that actually looked like the real thing, even if they can't call it one...

I saw a similar company - not sure of it was Cirrus, I don't think so but can't remember the name, at Goodwood Revival this year. Surprises me that more of the repro sorts don't head there, tbh. Soldier of Fortune had a nice stall (with an actually quite nice looking Thai B10 repro they've recently started doing. Not in the Buzz or ELC class, of course, but for GBP125, a lot closer than I'd have expected in terms of getting the general look right, even if it was probably off in some minor details and the mouton was likely faux...). With the number of folks I see running around there in repro gear, and knowing how depe are the pockets of many of the attendees, chances are the likes of ELC or Aero could do quite nicely (course, they probably both have very full order books already, so maybe no need!).

Some years back Eastman had a stall at the Beaulieu International Autojumble, Gary had jackets for sale but I was only one of, lets say very few(probably less than ten) who ordered a jacket. Aero had a stall at the War & Peace Show, again about 10 years ago, dont know how they did but I never saw them there again.
Maybe these shows just dont generate a decent return for the outlay here, though Gary had a regular stall at War & Peace so may have done better.

 

[archbury918]

Maybe these shows just dont generate a decent return for the outlay here,

I can't speak for how venues charge for vender space in the UK, but the for the EAA in Oshkosh, they increased the space fee four fold. Now a 5' x 8' space is nearly $1500 USD. For sellers, that means generating a lot of counter sales to be profitable.
I can say for the Re-enactors events, it's essential to 'touch and hold' an item before buying. In fact it usually seals the deal.
If Aero or ELC could hold a booth here, it would be a definite sell on impulse alone. I guess it's a Boardroom decision on whether or not to do so.
Certainly it makes the contact possible for ordering one...