Necktie Knots

[Feraud]

IMO, it is much more difficult to tie an aesthetically pleasing FIH than any other type of knot; the others basically tie themselves whereas the FIH requires practice and skill to pull off effectively. The FIH's pictured above are pitiful, IMO.

Aren't Four In Hands inherently asymmetrical therefore not as (generally speaking) aesthetically pleasing as other knots?
I cannot see a major aesthetic difference in the knot you show compared to the prior pics.
They all look good in that slightly off kilter Four In Hand way. [huh]

 

[tonyb]

My 17" neck, and taste for 30s-40s (always short!) ties and barred collars, mean I use the four almost exclusively.

I have a real preference for vintage ties as well (it's the sort of thing a person can collect without spending a great deal of dough or taking up much space), but I've found that even with the FIH some the ties are still a tad short on me, even by the conventions of their era. So I wear 'em with a vest, usually, or with a quite-short tail.

Thing is, I'm right at six feet, which was tall by the standards of that less-well-nourished era, but not dramatically so. And my collar size (a 16 1/2 fits pretty well; a 17 will do, usually; and I can get into a 16 but it can feel like I'm dressing for my own execution) is just a skosh smaller than yours.

 

[carouselvic]

I used the four in hand alot in the 80's and 90's when wearing knit ties.

This tie belonged to my dad. I know he had it in the 50's for sure and it might be older. Made by Hollyvogue California Ties of crocheted rayon.

 

[Macheath]

IMO, it is much more difficult to tie an aesthetically pleasing FIH than any other type of knot; the others basically tie themselves whereas the FIH requires practice and skill to pull off effectively.

I think you're right that other knots basically tie themselves. Full and half windsors could almost never be too tight, because they still look right somehow due to their inherent fullness. An overly tight FIH on the other hand, looks more like an unflattering growth than a neck accessory.

A properly tied FIH has the right fullness, and a tubular shape that goes with almost any collar, but it does have to be done with a tie of the right cut and shape.

I suppose Bogie's knot that I posted above is overly tight, but I'm partial, and I think he looks good in almost anything. I can't say I dislike Cagney's, though.

I'll post some pics of me own knots once I get my camera working.

 

[Lefty]

Aren't Four In Hands inherently asymmetrical therefore not as (generally speaking) aesthetically pleasing as other knots?
I cannot see a major aesthetic difference in the knot you show compared to the prior pics.
They all look good in that slightly off kilter Four In Hand way. [huh]

I disagree and think it's based on the wideness and weight of the tie. The older, thin and light ties just hang like dead fish when in a FIH. As the tie comes out of the knot, it doesn't take on a new shape, it just plumps into a tube, and the little dimple put into the ties in both photos looks forced. It's not the asymmetry, which is probably my favorite feature of the FIH, it's the lack of life.

 

[Talbot]

The Four in Hand

Time for a confession: I wear ties every day to work and I always tie the windsor knot because I don't know any other way.[huh]

This is tricky with vintage ties which tend to be a bit shorter than modern.

Where can I go to learn different knots?

All advice appreciated

Talbot

 

[Dinerman]

Time for a confession: I wear ties every day to work and I always tie the windsor knot because I don't know any other way.[huh]

This is tricky with vintage ties which tend to be a bit shorter than modern.

Where can I go to learn different knots?

All advice appreciated

Talbot

Tie Knot Tutorial by Brooks Brothers

 

[carouselvic]

If you google it you will find several site that will show you.

Dinerman you are too fast.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

It's not the asymmetry, which is probably my favorite feature of the FIH, it's the lack of life.

Which is one (and maybe the main) reason why FIHs were worn so often with collar pins. The pin pushed the knot up and out, giving "life" to it.

.

 

[flat-top]

Several years ago, a co-worker asked me how I got my "Danny Tanner" (Bob Saget from Full House) tie knots! I wear vintage ties, always and only done with a four-in-hand, and my co-worker wore modern Windsor knotted ties.

 

[J.J. Gittes]

I've always used the FIH, but now I've been trying out the Half Windsor, I like it much more. Its not so plain, In my opinion. On a random note My friend calls the Full Windsor the "Pompous F&%* knot" [huh]

 

[Macheath]

Which is one (and maybe the main) reason why FIHs were worn so often with collar pins. The pin pushed the knot up and out, giving "life" to it.

Yep, an FIH is pretty much necessary if you're going to wear a collar bar. I've tried it with half and full windsors, and it just ends up looking like you're smuggling a baklava around your neck.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Yep, an FIH is pretty much necessary if you're going to wear a collar bar. I've tried it with half and full windsors, and it just ends up looking like you're smuggling a baklava around your neck.

Witty analogy of the day! :eusa_clap

.

 

["Skeet" McD]

Count me in, as well....

I cannot see a major aesthetic difference in the knot you show compared to the prior pics.
They all look good in that slightly off kilter Four In Hand way. [huh]

Well, I'm another large-necked fellow who always wears a FiH...and have all my life. In the time-honored way, my father showed me; I was wearing ties everyday by my young teens, and....just always felt that the bulk of the Windsor knots didn't suit. Perhaps it would be different without such a round face.

At any rate, I see quite a difference in the ties shown: if I had to guess, i would say that the issue is where the dimple is appearing. I always strive to get it straight down the center, as in the "model" photo...on the vintage pics, it's anywhere but. I feel their pain. As another lounger has commented....not every tie will allow itself to be sculpted as desired...some will just NOT take the set you want them to; i expect the lining is largely the culprit.

 

["Skeet" McD]

http://gallery.me.com/finiancircle#100014/DSCF1926[/URL]

 

[Macheath]

[QUOTE="Skeet" McD]The tie I wore to the Easter Vigil tonight is one of the ones that ties "just right." Here's a picture; this is the best I can do--and, as I said above...it's mostly the tie's doing:
http://gallery.me.com/finiancircle#100014/DSCF1926[/QUOTE]

While I usually go out of my way to make a dimple symmetrical, I think there's nothing wrong with a dimple that's slightly off-center. If anything, I makes it appear more organic.

I suppose with the FIH, though, since it's already an asymmetrical knot, it does benefit from a centered. Knot.

That's a good looking tie there, "Skeet" McD. I like your pairing with the tab collar, too. They do for ties with collar bars do, but without so much flash, which I like.

 

[KILO NOVEMBER]

Where can I go to learn different knots?

All advice appreciated

Talbot

http://www.lordwhimsy.com/trifles/tutorials.html

There are 16 different knots illustrated here, and pocket square folds as well. They range from the quotidian to the recherche. The line drawing illustrations are very good. I thought the Brooks Brothers photographs were dark and lacking good contrast, which made them hard to use.

 

[repeatclicks]

Which knot to use on 40s ties?

Yeah, pretty much as the subject line says, I need to know which is the best knot to use with a 1940s tie to give it that nice short look. Im using a double windsor at the moment.

Thanks!

 

[billyspew]

I would imagine it would depend also on what style of collar you're intending to use with it?

 

[Feraud]

If you have a vintage 40s tie the total length is much shorter than today's ties.
Any knot will produce a short look. Is a Windsor not working?