Names, models and dating? - Disney & Stevie L Stetson !

[stephena310]

As I have said, I am very new to to "hats", however, when I get interested in something, I tend to want to research and get to know everything about it......
1. I am wondering if there are lists of the various models made by each company and the dates and amounts of their production? I would love to know the names of the models of hats that Disney or Stephen L. Stetson made and when or between what years they made them?

2. In the case of Disney, I have read on this forum that the company was owned, then sold to/or obsorbed by Hat Corp and then by Frank Lee - and was wondering if anyone has gone to these companies for their help in researching this company and their hats.......

Having collected guitars for a hobby over my lifetime, I have found that the manufacturers often have quite a bit of "raw data" and simply lack the time and inclination to put the facts and data together in order to make reasonable conclusions regarding "dating" their products.......Does anyone any any input on this???/

 

[facade]

The companies that made the hats we collect here all went out of business long ago. The surviving names have been subject to multiple mergers and sales and are kept alive solely for their potential name recognition value. I doubt the current owner (Hatco) of the trademarks has any greater knowledge of the companies and men whose names are applied to the hats then we here of the lounge. The only information I have ever seen has come from the research and purchases of lounge members. Since these companies all failed before the computer era, short of a miraculous find, there's no way to get complete data of the kind you are requesting.

 

[moehawk]

FL bartender Brad Bowers, aka The Hatted Professor, is in the midst of putting together a history of Hat Corporation of America owned hat brands, of which Disney was one. The work is far from done, so we must all be patient. No idea where, other than what discussion there is on this forum, you might find info on Stephen Stetson hats.

 

[stephena310]

The companies that made the hats we collect here all went out of business long ago. The surviving names have been subject to multiple mergers and sales and are kept alive solely for their potential name recognition value. I doubt the current owner (Hatco) of the trademarks has any greater knowledge of the companies and men whose names are applied to the hats then we here of the lounge. The only information I have ever seen has come from the research and purchases of lounge members. Since these companies all failed before the computer era, short of a miraculous find, there's no way to get complete data of the kind you are requesting.

You might be 100% correct.......But....Actually....it is because of these companies went out of business when they did, that, in my imagination, there might be a greater chance of the history and the records preserved or stored somewhere.........This might sound strange, but because they are all "east coast companies" , my confidence that the records may still exist, is quite "high".....If it were and West coast company, I would agree....They tend to throw everything out.......But then....Fender kept all their records.....I know that with "guitars", as soon as the manufacturers realized how this "collecting" and this "history/data" could be turned into "added value" to their products, that the companies "fell into line"........I have always found "accountants" to be very big on keeping records....! Do you know if anyone has ever asked Hatco?

 

[stephena310]

FL bartender Brad Bowers, aka The Hatted Professor, is in the midst of putting together a history of Hat Corporation of America owned hat brands, of which Disney was one. The work is far from done, so we must all be patient. No idea where, other than what discussion there is on this forum, you might find info on Stephen Stetson hats.

That sounds exciting.......Thanks for the heads up !

 

[moehawk]

No prob...you can go to his site, The Hatted Professor, and check out some of what he has so far. Lots of info on Dobbs, at least, may be more I haven't seen (or looked for) yet.

 

[facade]

You might be 100% correct.......But....Actually....it is because of these companies went out of business when they did, that, in my imagination, there might be a greater chance of the history and the records preserved or stored somewhere.........This might sound strange, but because they are all "east coast companies" , my confidence that the records may still exist, is quite "high".....If it were and West coast company, I would agree....They tend to throw everything out.......But then....Fender kept all their records.....I know that with "guitars", as soon as the manufacturers realized how this "collecting" and this "history/data" could be turned into "added value" to their products, that the companies "fell into line"........I have always found "accountants" to be very big on keeping records....! Do you know if anyone has ever asked Hatco?

While its is possible that Hatco has a treasure trove of old records long forgotten in a sub-basement, I think its unlikely. Below is a response from Hatco regarding a common term used by Stetson which illustrates the separation between Hatco and the companies whose names they still use.

Hello all,


Sorry for the long absence! I got so caught up in the lounge I let some of my work fall by the wayside! I had to catch up.

Well, I talked to a number of people about the clear designation.

First a little bit of background that I'm sure many of you are aware of but some may not.

Stetson as a hat manufacturing company disappeared decades ago. I'm writing this from home so I'm not sure of the exact year but I want to say 1970. Anyway Stevens Hats out of St Joseph Missouri bought out Stetson.

From what I understand they bought the name and equipment but not the factory in Philadelphia. I am unaware of anyone coming from Philadelphia to work in St Joseph.

In the 80's Hatco bought Stevens Hats and therefore Stetson. Regardless there is no one at Hatco from Philadelphia. So I went to the closest source I knew. The man who orchestrated the buyout of Stetson.

I will call him GR. I'm sure many of you know his name, but I didn't ask him if I could use it, so I will just use his initials. I showed GR the pictures of the logo. He had not been included when I originally got my first answer.

GR is a third generation hatter. He started working in a hat factory when he was 13 in the 1930s.

GR's interpretation of Clear Nutria was "100% true Nutria, not a blend"

He had the same feeling about Beaver.

As far as he remembers they never used that die at Stevens Hats or at Hatco. He's sure that we still have the die.

I know you guys are looking for 100% verifiable proof of what "clear nutria" and "clear beaver" mean. I know this isn't the end all be all answer that you were looking for but as you know Stetson has had a wide and varied history. Short of finding someone alive from the factory in Philadelphia or grinding up a hat to test the fibers (please don't do that) I think this mystery is still open.

HATCO, Sep 13, 2007

 

[Frunobulax]

Hi Stephen and welcome to the Lounge. What you are asking is one of the reasons this place exists. Someday, when I win the lottery, I'm going to hire a team of college interns to scour this site and make a Wiki for hats. The answers to many of your questions are buried in these pages and discussion groups. There are posted images of old ads, catalogues, atc. As previously mentioned, Mr. Bowers is working on a history of many of the non-Stetson brands. As Facade has illustrated, you will also find that much history has been lost. All indications are that, when the Stetson factory was torn down, all the records were lost, as well. Nobody knows what happened when many of the other companies were folded into larger ones, or simply went out of business.

The good news is, you have many months of combing through these pages to get many of your answers and satisfy your curiosity. Dating tips, quality designations, models - you just have to wade through it. Have fun and, again, welcome! We look forward to your input.

 

[hatsRme]

All of this is already well-covered in other threads, too. You have some perusing of pages to catch up, Stephen, but you will be most impressed with what you learn. It's an enjoyable process.

 

[stephena310]

Thanks...I am already finding myself combing through the various threads and finding interesting facts and tidbits that encourage me....Thanks......

Is there anyone who would be considered a Disney and Stephen Stetson expert that you can point me to???