Longtime Loungers...do you think the Lounge has changed a great deal?

[reetpleat]

I suppose it is good to discuss what the lounge is, and how it might be changing, what people want and expect from it and how we can welcome new membes and help it grow in the right direction.

While it is probably too long for anyone new to want to read and jump in, I hope new and old alike feel free to chime in with what they would like to see here, and that the leadership listens, then uses their leadership and wisdom to move it in positive directions.

 

[Lincsong]

It's the same as when I came. There are the thin skinned who frown around all day, taking everything seriously and are one phone call away from having a lawsuit because they are "offended" by off color remarks, or some politically incorrect phrase and are just ready to unfurl the banners and lead the masses against the big bad oppressors. There's not one poster I've come across here where I've pm'd a bartender to complain. I just don't understand the immaturity of some folks though. But, that is why there is an ignore option.

 

[Senator Jack]

There are the thin skinned who frown around all day, taking everything seriously and are one phone call away from having a lawsuit because they are "offended" by off color remarks, or some politically incorrect phrase and are just ready to unfurl the banners and lead the masses against the big bad oppressors.

Stop opressing me with your guns, Linc.

 

[Foofoogal]

Gee Lincsong, I would ask you to marry me if I wasn't already married.

Interesting statement . I really wonder why people are so different but don't want to get off topic here. fftopic:
My large family has passionate discussions and I have found along the way some people come into this and find us almost fighting when we are not. It almost scares them.
I have French and Scottish and Indian in me so wonder if the difference is in our genes. Passionate people speak differently than others.
French people speak all at once with their hands but don't seem to miss a thing. Just wondering.

 

[Ada Veen]

I don't know, people often think of us english as avoiding emotion, but I've often got in trouble with the boyfriend's best friend (half french/half italian) for speaking my mind or being what he sees as 'confrontational' when I just see it as discussing things we disagree on.

I suppose it's a lot to do with your family, and I like the sound of your family, foofoogal! Never a dull moment

 

[Twitch]

In partial answer to Surely, I may be lame but I haven't noticed many drastic changes due to growing membership since I've been around. As ALL website go as new members arrive the older ones get perterbed that they bring up topics that the old bubbas have thoroughly discussed a year earlier.

Some boards' old members do searches complaining to new members "we already discussed this!" That's a great way to create a chasm huh? But I don't feel or sense in any way that the influx of members has deteriorated the site at all. I was oblivious to the 6,000+ now 7,000 number anyhow.

I personally don't care what topics are created or ressurected simply because if one holds no interest to me I don't read it or become involved by carping about it. As I've said, some people have seemed compelled to comment about dislike of certain topics. I sincerely don't understand that.

But as mentioned in Bartenders or members attempting to read the true meaning of some statements I look up to Jake Finks' last post and the use of the sad emoticon and I would say he is serious in his remarks. It is impossible to tell. If he'd put a I'd figure it was a tongue in cheek deal, but....[huh] This is how problems can start.

If we were all together in a brick and mortar lounge we'd all drift into groups where the others in the group share our major interests. We do the same thing here. So what is the big deal? In the brick and mortar lounge we wouldn't go about butting into conversations and negatively verbalizing the participants would we?

We have to take the responsibility for our own moderation here and mostly we do. Most discussions could go on without the need for moderation because most of the folks here have manners and sense. They mostly don't need Bartenders. People simply are not shooting zingers at one another here 90% of the time.

I have left for good more sites than I can count because the whole of the forums would degenerate into thinly veiled name calling and personal attacks. That hasn't happened here not only because of the moderators but because of the attitude of the participants which is not full of hidden agendas and mean-spirited crapola.

I read Lincsong's last comment...
"It's the same as when I came. There are the thin skinned who frown around all day, taking everything seriously and are one phone call away from having a lawsuit because they are "offended" by off color remarks, or some politically incorrect phrase and are just ready to unfurl the banners and lead the masses against the big bad oppressors. There's not one poster I've come across here where I've pm'd a bartender to complain. I just don't understand the immaturity of some folks though. But, that is why there is an ignore option."

...and agree 100% except for the ignore option. For me no one is that obnoxious.

I don't take all the deep clothing topics with interest since I have little interest in owning period clothing beyond a fedora and a few timeless-style casual jackets that go with my 1950 Packard when I can get out to vintage auto events. But I don't complain that there are too many dull topics of old clothes.

More people means more topics to read. Since I've been mostly stuck in the house with medical problems for the past 6 months I have enjoyed reading a lot of it.

There ARE too many people with thin skins around here at times. This is a virtual world folks. It is a time-passing entity, based on computer law- garbage in, garbage out. If you fill it with garbage and attempt to cruise just below the surface of acceptable behavior to shoot barbs, hijack threads on purpose, make surly comments, and generally use web troll tactics you aren't welcome.

The Lounge is not your life and simply because you've been around a while doesn't mean you should take it all so seriously. No one cares how smart you are and it is not necessary to enter duels with others to continually prove you know everything. This is a place where people with similar outside interests exchange information, ideas and points of view. Like a real lounge it's also a place to loosen up and relax and to joke and have some fun.

When we cannot keep that in perspective and the same people get drunk and cause problems each night, as it were, then we have a problem. Just like the real world we don't agree with everyone else's viewpoints but just be careful in choosing the words that show you respectfully disagree.

To members new and old- just think a second before you start typing. Leave the rest of the web's hateful anonymity outside with the webtroll tactics.

 

[jake_fink]

But as mentioned in Bartenders or members attempting to read the true meaning of some statements I look up to Jake Finks' last post and the use of the sad emoticon and I would say he is serious in his remarks. It is impossible to tell. If he'd put a I'd figure it was a tongue in cheek deal, but....[huh] This is how problems can start.

.

I do drink more than I should, but I am otherwise almost never serious.

I use emoticons because they seem light and cartoony to me, so a truly sad or important point would be undermined - to me - by an emoticon.

No problem though, at least you didn't ignore me.

 

[Bebop]

Gee Lincsong, I would ask you to marry me if I wasn't already married.

Interesting statement . I really wonder why people are so different but don't want to get off topic here. fftopic:
My large family has passionate discussions and I have found along the way some people come into this and find us almost fighting when we are not. It almost scares them.
I have French and Scottish and Indian in me so wonder if the difference is in our genes. Passionate people speak differently than others.
French people speak all at once with their hands but don't seem to miss a thing. Just wondering.

You are so right. As far as the Observation Bar goes, it can be frustrating to have to quell your thoughts for fear of having the bartenders "guess" where a conversation is going to go. Heated discussions don't necessarily mean there is fighting or hatred of anyone going on. My suggestion would be to let a thread go until it has nowhere else to go or people have legitimate complaints. Having a "feeling" or "guessing" how people are going to react seems silly. We used to have civil discussions about any and all topics. The worse that would happen is, "I am offended at that", "I apologize", and most would move on. [huh] Those that didn't move on were dealt with. Now, it seems you can't start a thread that may, in some convoluted way, cause some to react in a negative way. [huh]

In other ways, information has flourished and you can soak up some valuable information about vintage items and attitudes. There are more professionals now that are willing to share expertise on everything from cars to fashion to movies with even some plumbing and carpentry thrown in.

 

[Nathan Flowers]

You are so right. As far as the Observation Bar goes, it can be frustrating to have to quell your thoughts for fear of having the bartenders "guess" where a conversation is going to go. Heated discussions don't necessarily mean there is fighting or hatred of anyone going on. My suggestion would be to let a thread go until it has nowhere else to go or people have legitimate complaints. Having a "feeling" or "guessing" how people are going to react seems silly. We used to have civil discussions about any and all topics. The worse that would happen is, "I am offended at that", "I apologize", and most would move on. [huh] Those that didn't move on were dealt with. Now, it seems you can't start a thread that may, in some convoluted way, cause some to react in a negative way. [huh]

Unfortunately, the Lounge wasn't that way in the past, and still isn't that way today. I can however, understand why you think it was.

Since this iteration of the Lounge opened in 2003 (and I have been moderating the Observation Bar since then), we've been deleting stuff that does indeed go off the reservation. Full on flaming, trolling, ad hominem attacks...we see it all, and for the most part delete it before it sees the light of day for long. Out of the more than 465,000 posts that have been made to the Lounge, over 3,000 of them have had to been deleted because of this. We firmly believe that doing so has kept the joint healthy, and definitely more welcoming to all members in the long term. You, and the rest of the readership can't see the vast majority of these edits, which is why I suspect you think that everybody was so incredibly civil way back when.

As has been said time and time again, there are plenty of Internet fora where you can discuss the "N" word*, or S&M*, or how all civil servants are parasites*, or how goatee wearers are "fools"*, or how men who wear pink shirts deserve an ass kicking*. The Lounge will never allow such topics, and we volunteer Bartenders who spend our own time to clean up the vitriol and mess that some folks spew will make these edits for the good of the community at all times. We make no apologies for this, and the fact that we have so many members proves that MK was indeed wise in setting higher standards in the first place.


If you really wish to start up your thread about the "N" word again, find another forum to do it on.

(* denotes just a few of our deleted topics over the years.)

 

[pigeon toe]

In regards to how the "old timers" treat the newbies, I'd have to say I've found the Lounge to be a very welcoming place. Being as I'm still a relative newbie, and am quite young (20) and have only been seriously collecting for a year, I have at times, felt a little intimidated. But, honestly, I think it's all in my head! I've only been treated kindly here, even when I've committed a faux pas.

When I went to the QM this year, I was totally nervous, and expected some of the more well-known members of the board to be, perhaps, a bit exclusive. However, I had the loveliest time talking to Miss Neecerie and Matt Deckard, among others.

This board is by far one of the most entertaining and friendly boards out there. Though there obviously are some issues that have been raised by others, I personally think the bartenders and other members who have made this place the way it is now deserve a pat on the back!

 

[Nashoba]

For what it's worth

I've watched this thread since it's begining and I certainly must commend all who have posted for their poise, clarity and even levity at some points.

I came here because I had insomnia one night and was randomly searching for vintage hairstyles and for some clarification on an ettiquette issue. I stayed because the people were kind, the information plentiful, and the company pleasant.

I have been personally attacked here, been defended by bartenders and loungers alike, been educated and corrected. I have been validated, complimented, had my own work and collections critiqued and improved, and have learned more than I ever could have on my own in the great expanse of the web. Heck, I've even killed a few threads myself.

I have made friends here whom I am grateful for, and whom I one day look forward to sharing a drink and a meal with in person. I have met Loungers in person that I now share wonderful friendships that I know will be life long that I would not have save it were for the lounge.

This incredible community of knowledge and whimsy has been a refuge to me on lonely insomnia and worry filled nights. It has seen me through at least one deployment, and I know it will be there for me through future ones. There are people here that I am quite proud to be able to associate with. And quite a few that I am grateful to call friend.

Anything in life will always be able to be improved. Change is inevitable with growth. All of these things have been said before. As for me, I'm simply grateful that there is a place I can go to where I can learn, find comfort, and maybe even impart a small piece of knowledge that some person in some future time will find useful.

Happy Holidays to everyone. I'm looking forward to a quiet one with my husband, a cup of cocoa, and a few hours spent here in the lounge.

 

[reetpleat]

While I agree that some people are too thin skinned, and I think that some people with strong feelings about certian things should reserve them for their full time local friends or real time bar discussions. I also think some people just like conflict and will make or find it wherever they can.

That said, there is a certain trait common to all people I guess, to assume that your attitude, especially if it is the commonly held one, is the right one and that anyone that disagrees with it is out of line, or off base. I am talking about the posts that sometimes come on assuming a point of view, and treating a dissenter as being too sensitive or pc or whatever.

Especially since we are a multicultural, multinational forum, we should all do well to remember that our views or the world is no more valid than others.

 

[Lincsong]

Stop opressing me with your guns, Linc.

Jack, if you make it to Vegas next month, you and I will go and fire some FULLY AUTOMATIC WEAPONS at a shooting range.

 

[Rooster]

Jack, if you make it to Vegas next month, you and I will go and fire some FULLY AUTOMATIC WEAPONS at a shooting range.

The Senator will be forever digging guns from that point on.lol

 

[Senator Jack]

Throw in the bikini girls and you got yerself a deal.

 

[Rooster]

No more Senator Jack. His new name will be Machinegun Jack.lol

 

[Twitch]

Welcome home Nashoba's husband!!

At the risk of sounding too Rodney King, can't we all #%$#^*@ get along? Quit getting offended if 4-5 people are having a very crisp give and take about the vitues of 9mm versus .45 caliber vintage pistols and you are uncontrolably compelled to add something relavent and not snotty please do not whine that the big boys are tough.

There are a lot of serious discussions that are NOT out of the Lounge's rules.

Yeah if you get a thread going making fun of van Dyke beard wearers as gay be prepared to be closed. But if you approach facial hair topics with some sensibly explorable alternatives like "do bear wearers really look smarter?" or "Women- beard or no beard?"

All any of us needs to do is peruse the internet and we can find places where we can bash politicians and other forum particpants with 4 letter words and spew hate and misery. Many sights allow wiseacre posts, smirky replies and bait-filled topics designed to cause arguements for the sake of turmoil.

Do not mistake strong or negative opinions for purposful undermining of topics, threads and goading people into fights. Most of us recognize poiniant language expressly used to incite others so take it elsewhere, please.

 

[Senator Jack]

Quit getting offended if 4-5 people are having a very crisp give and take about the vitues of 9mm versus .45 caliber vintage pistols and you are uncontrolably compelled to add something relavent and not snotty please do not whine that the big boys are tough.

Twitch, since I joined the lounge, I had always thought you were a well-educated and reasonable man, so I mention it with all due respect that the above is in itself a shot. It reads 'if you don't tote a gun, you're not a big boy.' Okay, not a life-shattering insult, but a bit of an insult nonetheless.

There was one of those threads I did butt in on, but I was being didactic more than contrary. I, myself, was a bit tired of posting new threads with the warning 'This isn't for everyone,' (I have one up now, in fact) only to have two or three of the same Loungers pipe in with 'I hate that look,' or some other sly comment that was supposed to pass for sarcasm. I just couldn't understand why some threads were considered off limits to opposing viewpoints and others weren't.

From my previous exchanges with Lincsong and Rooster in this thread, you can see we have a sort of friendly rivalry on the matter. This is because I consider these two gentlemen my friends and not my rivals, despite a slight difference of opinion on yet another matter that, in the end, doesn't amount to a hill of beans in this world. My last word on the gun issue? My avoidance of them most like stems from the fact that if I had one in the house I probably would have blown my brains out years ago. I suppose that's not possible with a fully automatic, is it? (unless one rigs up a crazy Rube Golberg prodcution) so perhaps someday I will take Linc up on that offer.

Regards,

Senator Jack

 

[PrettySquareGal]

I've watched this thread since it's begining and I certainly must commend all who have posted for their poise, clarity and even levity at some points.

I came here because I had insomnia one night and was randomly searching for vintage hairstyles and for some clarification on an ettiquette issue. I stayed because the people were kind, the information plentiful, and the company pleasant.

I have been personally attacked here, been defended by bartenders and loungers alike, been educated and corrected. I have been validated, complimented, had my own work and collections critiqued and improved, and have learned more than I ever could have on my own in the great expanse of the web. Heck, I've even killed a few threads myself.

I have made friends here whom I am grateful for, and whom I one day look forward to sharing a drink and a meal with in person. I have met Loungers in person that I now share wonderful friendships that I know will be life long that I would not have save it were for the lounge.

This incredible community of knowledge and whimsy has been a refuge to me on lonely insomnia and worry filled nights. It has seen me through at least one deployment, and I know it will be there for me through future ones. There are people here that I am quite proud to be able to associate with. And quite a few that I am grateful to call friend.

Anything in life will always be able to be improved. Change is inevitable with growth. All of these things have been said before. As for me, I'm simply grateful that there is a place I can go to where I can learn, find comfort, and maybe even impart a small piece of knowledge that some person in some future time will find useful.

Happy Holidays to everyone. I'm looking forward to a quiet one with my husband, a cup of cocoa, and a few hours spent here in the lounge.

fftopic: Can someone please ban Nashoba for being too gracious, level-headed, strong, witty, etc etc? She makes the rest of us look not as nice.

Girl, I am so happy that your Marine is home! Happy holidays!!!

 

[Andykev]

It is still the best, civil site

The fact is, even since I've been here, this place resembles a dynamic, intellectual society - a Lounge of sorts - of which I enjoy being a part. Sometimes I'm able to contribute, most times I'm not. I'm grateful for the respect I've received over these few months, and I only hope I can show the same to future members.

As a "senior" member of a board out there, I understand the camaraderie between other "veterans" as opposed to the flood-gates-have-opened numbers of new persons that come in everyday.

From my personal experience with other boards, I look at the FL like a bar:

* If you've been there since the doors opened, you're a favorite customer, no matter how many times you post.
* If you've been here a while, and you've gotten to know some people, and you have a good idea how the show runs, you're a regular and for the most part the "In Crowd".
* If you just got here within the last year, you're still new, you don't know all the ropes, you can't simply budge your way into everything. You can't drop a few names and expect to get a free drink.
*Just because you come in everyday doesn't mean we like you, it means you're a drunk.

Eh, I don't know. It's like anything else - it takes time. If you want to be one of the hallowed members, if there even is such a thing, it takes time.

I enjoy this place for what it is, not for what I think it should be. [huh]

Wow I couldn't have summed it up better.lol


Has the Lounge changed. You bet. And I think for the better. For me personally, I have tired of the "Nice Hat" threads. I just won this on ebay. Well good suggestion above: wear it, test it, then post your comments or experiences. The experience you have is what matters and what I enjoy reading about.

My most favorite posts now are personal ones where a member takes a camera and gives us a "tour" of his town, the historic spots, the vintage such and such nearby. The Lounge events where pictures of groups in New York, Boston, or S.F. show scenery and fun places. A picture of that '36 Plymouth you just found in a barn somewhere.

I think the best post/topic recently was "Where in the world is Paddy"....oh my what an adventure! Plus I got lucky and got to meet the wonderful chap.

The Lounge is every bit as good as our wonderful members.