Liberating Women's Bodies

[Paisley]

Yup, it was the bra.

There was another movie that featured a strapless, backless bra designed on the cantilever principle. Can't remember which movie.

 

[Carlisle Blues]

Yup, it was the bra.

I just had one of those, "wish I thought of it" moments...:eusa_doh:

 

[Red Diabla]

I don't know what this person intended but IMHO women will never be truly free as long as foundation garments are expected to be worn.
I have said it a million times on FL and will continue to say I would personally harm the person who invented the brassiere.
fftopic: Though some women will not do without them I truly believe if any man had to wear a tight band around their chest all day long it would be gone by now. Especially in 100 or more degree weather. Loads of fun. :eusa_doh:
Banning the bra was the only Womens Lib idea I ever agreed on.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0895296640/ref=nosim/thelighthouseonl

I'm not uh, generously endowed, shall we say, but I definitely don't mind wearing a bra.

I also don't mind foundation garments for the right occasion. I wouldn't wear them every day, but for a night out it's easier to put on Spanx or something instead of starving myself for a week beforehand to get the silhouette I want.

fftopic:
It's funny to me how some women think they're so "free" now in that they don't have to wear girdles, but they're more than willing to go to a surgeon's office to get the fat sucked out of them or inject poison into their faces to be "beautiful". Makes me think that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

RD

 

[Foofoogal]

Liberating Women's Bodies

Makes me think that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

For sure.

 

[Lauren]

ftopic:
It's funny to me how some women think they're so "free" now in that they don't have to wear girdles, but they're more than willing to go to a surgeon's office to get the fat sucked out of them or inject poison into their faces to be "beautiful". Makes me think that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

RD

For realz.
I think a lot of people don't even know foundation garments still exist. They're just "magically" supposed to have a great figure. Fashion history proves that's impossible. lol Look at all the centuries of body manipulation. I think this is the only century over a span of 500 years where both men and women are not contorting their bodies... though as Red Diabla says, many still are...
Men padded, sucked in, plumped up, and swaggered just as much as women in the old days. And after working in theatre it's amazing what padding can do for certain men... in the chest and shoulders, I mean. lol Athough we often get codpieces, too...

 

[LizzieMaine]

fftopic:
It's funny to me how some women think they're so "free" now in that they don't have to wear girdles, but they're more than willing to go to a surgeon's office to get the fat sucked out of them or inject poison into their faces to be "beautiful". Makes me think that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

RD

Well said. We live in a generation with a remarkable gift for talking out of both sides of its mouth.

 

[Lady Day]

For realz.
I think a lot of people don't even know foundation garments still exist. They're just "magically" supposed to have a great figure.

lol
That is so true. I always found it funny how so many women are against foundation garments, but they will pour themselves into the tightest pair of jeans they can find and go on about their day.

As Lizzie said, both side

LD

 

[Foofoogal]

I will grow old comfortably. I have not tried the Spanx but hear it is comfortable. Have not worn a girdle in my life except when I was a young teen and experimenting.
I am being serious here when I ask this:
I wonder if I am like the Princess and the Pea story. Can one be hypersensitive to restrictive clothing? People have way different pain tolerances. Could this be somehow related?
I am not against plastic surgery if one thinks they have to do it but sure not for me.
Now I have worn tight jeans but definitely moving away from them lately also.
Wear skirts more than anyone I know.

 

[K.D. Lightner]

I have worn a bra for most of my life. During the early 70's, when Women's Liberation advocates were debating whether a woman should wear a bra or not, I followed Ann Lander's advice.

For those of you too young to remember, the Ann Landers Test, to decide whether or not you should wear a bra, was this:

Take a pencil and hold it up to your naked breast. Place it sideways under your breast, then let your breast down. If the pencil falls down, you can go without a bra; if the pencil stays up, you'd best wear a bra.

It was also somewhat painful if I did not wear a bra.

I also came from an era when wearing girdles was quite common, even if you did not need them. I think mostly they were worn to keep women from "flopping" and looking too sexy; the girdle smoothed out curves as well as flattened the tummy.

I rarely wore a girdle as I got an upset stomach from doing so. Made me nauseous.

karol

 

[Foofoogal]

I rarely wore a girdle as I got an upset stomach from doing so. Made me nauseous.

I seriously am like that if I wear a bra for too long. I cannot even think except I want this @$#% off. I get very agitated.

 

[reetpleat]

For realz.
I think a lot of people don't even know foundation garments still exist. They're just "magically" supposed to have a great figure. Fashion history proves that's impossible. lol Look at all the centuries of body manipulation. I think this is the only century over a span of 500 years where both men and women are not contorting their bodies... though as Red Diabla says, many still are...
Men padded, sucked in, plumped up, and swaggered just as much as women in the old days. And after working in theatre it's amazing what padding can do for certain men... in the chest and shoulders, I mean. lol Athough we often get codpieces, too...

While the general population in the world, and especially this country has declined in terms of fitness as far as tone, weight etc. there are a few classes that are in a whole other realm. what i mean is that if you look at athlets from back in the day, modern athletes are way more fit, muscular etc. Even body builders are woefully undermuscled compared to their contemporary counterparts. And most actors and actresses are much slimmer and toned than those in teh past.

My point being, that while men and women in the past, actors for example, could rely on girdles, and other foundation garments, they do not today. instead, they avail themselves of the free time to work out a lot, and the modern knowledge of fitness, diet, pilates, aerobics, etc, to maintain pretty slim fit bodies.

 

[Lauren]

Actually, the whole fitness thing isn't really a new phenomenon either. In the 1930s especially, there was a huge attention to diet and exercise. Maybe not to modern standards, but women and men were encouraged to eat better and exercise more to help with their figures, health, and beauty. I guess the strange thing about now to me is that you rely on physical fitness alone, and many people work forever towards a body type that may or may not be achievable. If you look in vintage beauty books from the 1930s they stress fitness and foundation garments, and a knowledge of what styles best fit your figure and height and face shape. Not that I'm advocating that that's the right way to go, there are blessings about the modern age for sure, as well as good things from back then. Victorians and before, however, were encouraged to be "plump" and then whittle their waists down with corsetry and other devices.

 

[Viola]

I find bras that fit more comfortable than not wearing a bra, most of the time.

On a purely personal level, I would contemplate plastic surgery. My only caveats are potential for things to go awry, and money. Oh, and my guy HATES the idea. I don't know why. On the other hand I don't know that wanting to do that many things to myself is all entirely a good idea anyway even if I could afford it. I dunno how much of me would be left.

 

[Paisley]

For those of you too young to remember, the Ann Landers Test, to decide whether or not you should wear a bra, was this:

Take a pencil and hold it up to your naked breast. Place it sideways under your breast, then let your breast down. If the pencil falls down, you can go without a bra; if the pencil stays up, you'd best wear a bra.

If you don't want visible raisins, you'd best wear a bra.

 

[C-dot]

As a former La Senza shift manager, I can say from experience that roughly 8 out of 10 women are wearing the wrong size bra. I've found 38C wearers unnecessarily stuffing themselves into 34B's. Ladies generally wear too large bands and too small cups - And they are always shocked to find out their real size.

Anyone who is wearing the right size will not mind - heck, even like - wearing a bra.

 

[Paisley]

I sometimes see--through their t-shirts--that women are wearing the wrong size bra. If you're bulging out the top, you're wearing the wrong size.

 

[Paisley]

lol
That is so true. I always found it funny how so many women are against foundation garments, but they will pour themselves into the tightest pair of jeans they can find and go on about their day.

As Lizzie said, both side

LD

That, and complain that dress clothes--pants or skirt and a jacket that shouldn't be either tight or loose--are soooo uncomfortable. [huh]

 

[reetpleat]

Actually, the whole fitness thing isn't really a new phenomenon either. In the 1930s especially, there was a huge attention to diet and exercise. Maybe not to modern standards, but women and men were encouraged to eat better and exercise more to help with their figures, health, and beauty. I guess the strange thing about now to me is that you rely on physical fitness alone, and many people work forever towards a body type that may or may not be achievable. If you look in vintage beauty books from the 1930s they stress fitness and foundation garments, and a knowledge of what styles best fit your figure and height and face shape. Not that I'm advocating that that's the right way to go, there are blessings about the modern age for sure, as well as good things from back then. Victorians and before, however, were encouraged to be "plump" and then whittle their waists down with corsetry and other devices.

I agree. Fitness culture has been around for some time. But I am talking about the physical tone of male and female actors. When John Wayne takes his shirt off, it is quite remarkable how undefined he is compared to any actor today, excepting jack Black, shown shirtless. It is just an expected given. Same with women. Today, most actresses are expected to be slim and tone, without relying on undergarments. Not saying it is good or bad. that is just the way it is these days. By modern standards, Marilyn would not be considered fat. But she certainly seems rather untoned and a little flabby by comparison. Were she an actress today, she would surely be doing pilates two days a week, weights one, and cardio the other three.

 

[LizzieMaine]

I agree. Fitness culture has been around for some time. But I am talking about the physical tone of male and female actors. When John Wayne takes his shirt off, it is quite remarkable how undefined he is compared to any actor today, excepting jack Black, shown shirtless. It is just an expected given. Same with women. Today, most actresses are expected to be slim and tone, without relying on undergarments. Not saying it is good or bad. that is just the way it is these days. By modern standards, Marilyn would not be considered fat. But she certainly seems rather untoned and a little flabby by comparison. Were she an actress today, she would surely be doing pilates two days a week, weights one, and cardio the other three.

It's an interesting evolution of cultural mores since the Era -- at one time it was considered the exclusive mark of a working-class person to be muscular: it indicated that you did hard physical labor for a living, and if you were a man you probably were a laborer, a farmer, or a factory hand. If you were a muscular woman, you were probably a scrubwoman, a housemaid, or a launderess. For women especially, being "untoned" was a sign that you didn't have to raise a hand in physical work, and were therefore of a higher social class. Nowadays, being "toned and muscular" is a sign that you can afford gyms and trainers, and have the free time to work out a lot.

 

[C-dot]

For women especially, being "untoned" was a sign that you didn't have to raise a hand in physical work, and were therefore of a higher social class. Nowadays, being "toned and muscular" is a sign that you can afford gyms and trainers, and have the free time to work out a lot.

You're right - In an English series made in 1957 called Men, Women and Fashion they discuss how women's high fashions were so unaccommodating, and early men's fashions too, because the more decorative you looked, the less you worked, and that meant you were nobility.
Nowadays also, unemployment is inherently frowned upon.