Langlitz: Why not horsehide?

[northseastar]

Hi forum folks... I'm still really enjoying the wealth of information you all have to offer - alas I don't feel I have much expertise to contribute in return. What I do have is a fascination with quality, particularly regarding garments.

Anyway, I am wondering if anyone here has any experience with Langlitz Leathers in Portland OR. What I mean to say is, I ordered a motorcycle jacket (which is their main product) from them over the summer, and it is a phenomenal piece. They are not necessarily a vintage-themed outfit, but they have apparently not changed their two motorcycle jacket patterns in the several decades they've been in business. In fact, argument exists that their "Columbia" jacket was possibly the first "modern" motorcycle jacket. What is certainly true is that their jackets are superlative premium motorcycle gear - that are equally beautiful and functional. They are basically bespoke outfitters, who will take a number of measurements in their store (in Portland), or apply your measurements through mail order (which is what I did). The jacket I received, about a month after ordering (which is supposedly a relatively short wait for them), is incredibly stalwart: much heavier and thicker than my previous functional motorcycle jacket, which itself once saved my skin in a nasty fall off a motorcycle; with robust brass talon zippers, and a real detatchable mouton, which is one of the options I ordered. Langlitz is apparently (I keep using such terms because I have not actually met them in person) a second generation family-run production that involves a handful of people, working with old machinery and tools, and building only six jackets a day.

So, having made my recommendation (to any interested in such jackets), a couple of disparate questions... Can anyone venture a guess as to why Langlitz does not offer horsehide? (They do now offer goat, in addition to their very high quality cowhide.) This is perhaps a rather silly question, as I have not asked the folks at Langlitz themselves. My second question is, would horsehide be better than it is, if it was in fact taken from young horses (in other words, if the horses were slaughtered for it). I imagine that the laws against the practice are there to honor this noble beast. What I wonder is if, presumably, 'natural death' often means old age, wouldn't this effect the quality of the leather? Human skin is much, much stronger and more resilient in youth than old age; would this not also be true of horses? And if so, would this not be an issue with regard to American skins? -Sorry that this is not really a single cohesive thread subject...

 

[Brutus]

Wow...Nobody on here has heard of Langlitz? I can tell you I've owned many brands over the years and nothing comes close to Langlitz in terms of quality, service, and function. Northseastar, you made a great choice.

 

[scotrace]

Now you've got me thinking

Thant's an interesting thought, northeaster. That hide from older horses might not be as resilient as that from a younger animal. I hope you get some opinions.


Does that leather shop have a website?

Welcome to the Lounge!

 

[HAMMER]

Langlitz is one of the most famous MC jacket labels of all time. Glad to hear their stuff is still top notch!

 

[MudInYerEye]

Langlitz DOES offers jackets in horsehide upon special request, although it is apparently not their favorite material to work with. The Japanese often have their Langlitz jackets made in horse. They've even made a jacket out of salmon skin!
A friend of mine recently flew out to Oregon for a fitting and was given the grand tour of the Langlitz building and archives. He said it was an amazing experience.

 

[BladeRunner]

Some Langlitz Details...

Hi all. I'm new to this forum, and this is my first posting. I hope that it is helpful.

Langlitz has a long history making leathers, specializing in motorcyling apparel. Ross Langlitz began the company in 1947, and was the first to utilize some of the most practical elements of design that have since become standard for biker wear, included an extended rear panel (as you reach for the handlebars, the jacket naturally rides up in the back), zippered sleave wrists, and a front zipper windflap, among others.

The company, still in the same factory building in Portland Oregon, now employs a third generation of family members. They continue to build jackets in the original designs (some customizing is possible, but they will only take this so far). To maintain quailty control, production is limited to about 8 jackets per day, and each one uses hides which are hand-sewn by a single seamstress. They are, is a sentance, the premiere manufacturer of leather motorcycle jackets. Portland's police department (and many others) issues Langlitz as standard protection for their motorcycle patrol officers.

As for horsehide, they do now offer it as an option -- for an additional fee of $1,200. Why so expensive? Because truly fine horsehide is difficult to come by, especially since Langlitz uses singular hides to assure that each jacket panel matches all others. This means, of course, that they need very large hides, free of imperfections. I was the first US customer in a decade to convince Dave Hanson to build a horsehide jacket. (Dave is married to Ross' daughter, and manages production). It took two years to find a suitable tannery to supply consistent hides.

Horsehide itself is only handled by a very few tanneries. It is expensive for them to buy the raw hides, is not easy to work with, and aside from extremely high-end shoes, there is very little request for horse. The largest tannery is in Chicago, where Aero Leather Company from Scotland buys its hides. I can assure you that quality varies greatly, as I spent time on the tanning floor of the factory sifting through hides for my jacket. In the end, Langlitz was able to get the best horsehide from the same source from which they buy their goat skins.

One last point regarding earlier posts on "natural death" horsehide: this law no longer exists. Still, most of the raw horsehide used in US tanneries are brought over from France. Horse is by far the most resilient of hides, and its ability to mould to the human body is unmatched. But... be forwarned that it takes much longer to "break in" than cow or goat.

I know all of this because I am a writer, and did a story about Langlitz for the Robb Report magazine in 2002. (Anyone interested may read the article at the following link: http://www.robbreportcollection.com/Articles/Wheels/Motorcycles/Motorcycles-Legend-of-Leather.asp

I should also say that I have had Langlitz build me four jackets, of varying design. Two in cowhide, one in goat, and the most recent in horse. You can probably guess which one is my favorite.

Sorry for the length of this post, but anything worth sharing should be both honest and complete.

 

[BladeRunner]

A quick other note: One of the reasons that horsehide fell out of favor is that we no longer support a cavalry. Those horses, as they died, supplied most of the US hides, and their demise cut supplies and increased cost.

 

[Doctor Strange]

It wasn't just about cavalry horses. At the time that the A-2 was spec'ed as horsehide - 1930 - there were still vast numbers of horses in use throughout the country for farming, pulling wagons, and personal transportation. And with sales of cars, trucks, and tractors on the rise, there were plenty of out-of-work horses too. Horsehide was cheap and easily available - quite different from now!

 

[scotrace]

Link

Langlitz Leathers

 

[Havana]

Dr. Strange is right about horses being a lot more common in every facet of life prior to WWII. My grandfather once told me that a horse was always a good investment (in the old days) because even when the animal got too old to ride or work, you could get a premium price from the slaughter agents who bought them for glue, dog food and the hides. Now, he says an old horse is just like an old person. They're just a burden because all they do is take up space, eat, and xxxx (poop). This was said by a 92 year old man. Back on topic, I've always found horsehide to be too stiff for my liking. I once had a horsehide jacket that, when zipped, would rise up and hit my chin when I sat down. It felt like flexible cardboard. This was after about 4 years of frequent wear. There are many different grades, as with all hides, but that one experience left me wary. I think my old jacket was a 3 oz hide.

 

[Rundquist]

I’ve always felt that horsehide was over rated. BladeRunner states above that the quality of the hides varies greatly. I personally believe that the same could be said of any hide. The only hide that I’ve seen that still makes a good leather jacket even when the hide (and or tanning method) is sub par is goatskin. I take kangaroo hide out of the equation because I’ve never dealt with it. I know that it’s supposed to be the toughest leather out there. I know it’s a lot more supple than horsehide that’s for sure.

In my younger days I used to go after horsehide jackets because they were harder to come by and I knew that’s what was used in the past. Later I realized that I didn’t really care for it. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve seen some really nice horsehide on some of my friend’s jackets recently. But I’m still gonna have to say that the virtues of horsehide have really been hyped up over the years. Cheers

 

[MudInYerEye]

Horsehide rules.

 

[scotrace]

Horsehide rules.

Like buttah.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I was going to post my opinion of Langlitz...but BladeRunner said it all. Great post!
I do understand the reluctance to tackle a new heavy horsehide jacket,and the idea that HH may be hyped up to a certain extent. However,hvy HH and sometimes hvy steer can develope it's own certain beauty the more it's worn and not babied.
I have leather jackets in various types of steer,goat,buffalo,and HH. If I had to sell them all but one. I would surely keep my hvy FQHH antique brown apalaca lined Aero Highwayman. This six year old Hwymn has developed a certain unique charactor,that I feel confident in suggesting,only this certain type hide seems to obtain. I did work with it when new to "help" break it in...but since wearing it continually,it has marbled, grained and softened like a well used baseball glove. I have had several lighterweight vintage HH MC jackets that just fell short of that look. A used HH Langlitz being one of them...but unfortunately too short in the sleeves for me.
I can't really say which hide is most durable,IMO. HH,goat,or kangeroo. I've owned all three. Perhaps goat is more scrape resistant and wet weatherproof...Kangeroo strong,lightweight and comfortable,but HH is also tuffstuff. If it's tanned and finished right,can become the most beautiful leather of all. At least to my eye.
HD

 

[hpalapdog]

A quick other note: One of the reasons that horsehide fell out of favor is that we no longer support a cavalry. Those horses, as they died, supplied most of the US hides, and their demise cut supplies and increased cost.

Er..no.
Horsemeat for human consumption is common in some European countries and the supply of hides good from Italy and eastern Europe.
A supple medium weight horsehide used for example in A2 jackets doesn't cost much more than cowhide.
Front quarter horsehide is more expensive.

adam

 

[Kt Templar]

Hemm, time for some up to date pics of your horsehide. Must be showing some signs of wear by now!:deadhorse

 

[gimmesomeshelte]

Five year old oil-pull horsehide.

http://new.photos.yahoo.com/gimmesomeshelter/album/576460762321532066/photo/294928803233903167/2

Six year old FQHH.

http://new.photos.yahoo.com/gimmesomeshelter/album/576460762321684692/photo/294928803237527987/1

http://new.photos.yahoo.com/gimmesomeshelter/album/576460762321684692/photo/294928803237536967/0

Paul

 

[panhead49]

Langlitz:Why not horsehide?

Just happened by this post and was surprised I am not the only Langlitz fan that wanted one made in Horsehide. I jumped through all the hoops a few years ago to get Langlitz to make me a horsehide jacket and am really surprised to hear they offer horsehide now as an option for 1200.00 . Thats really a good deal if you want one bad enough because I went through several thousand dollars worth of horsehides before I found the quality of hides Langlitz would agree to use. Just like Bladerunner I bought hides from A to V but was rejected. Don't blame Langlitz, most of the Horsehide I've seen is full of flaws and stiff like cardboard. After paying big dollars to LW for 4oz.+ Horsehide I was sure I had the quality. I walked into the Langlitz shop confident I had scored. NO--it wasn't quality enough --now I was starting to panic but was on a mission to get that horsehide Langlitz so after a long phone call, convinced LW to exchange the hides for some hand picked perfect specimens.LW horsehides are beautiful,very pliable,thick and smell wonderful! Took the new hides to Langlitz with even more confidence only to be turned down again! This time the quality was very good but too thick,some 6oz+ and would have trouble sewing through the doubled or tripled seams. Well the air was out of my sails by then and on the verge of quitting with a bunch of unreturnable Horsehides on hand. One lady at Langlitz (can't remember her name)came up to me and said if you can get a small quantity of 3-3.5oz. horsehide of same quality to be used where needed, she could build the jacket. Awesome-and Dave agreed to it. Was all the trouble and time worth it? One word-Yes. Like I said earlier, if you can get a horsehide Langlitz now by paying 1200.00 extra its a bargain and alot less stressful than going out and trying to find the horsehides. By the way-there is no jacket out there that fits and feels and looks like a Langlitz and Horsehide makes it legendary!

 

[BluBariSax]

Question for BladeRunner

BladeRunner, I had just placed an order for a second Langlitz, in heavy cowhide, when I found this fourm. I'm now feeling inspired to have Dave build my new jacket in Horsehide too. A couple of questions. Once you found the hide, how long did it take them to make the jacket? Is the jacket stiff like cardboard and is it breaking in OK? I know that they take a long time to break in. Thanks for the help in advance.

 

[cookie]

Just happened by this post and was surprised I am not the only Langlitz fan that wanted one made in Horsehide. I jumped through all the hoops a few years ago to get Langlitz to make me a horsehide jacket and am really surprised to hear they offer horsehide now as an option for 1200.00 . Thats really a good deal if you want one bad enough because I went through several thousand dollars worth of horsehides before I found the quality of hides Langlitz would agree to use. Just like Bladerunner I bought hides from A to V but was rejected. Don't blame Langlitz, most of the Horsehide I've seen is full of flaws and stiff like cardboard. After paying big dollars to LW for 4oz.+ Horsehide I was sure I had the quality. I walked into the Langlitz shop confident I had scored. NO--it wasn't quality enough --now I was starting to panic but was on a mission to get that horsehide Langlitz so after a long phone call, convinced LW to exchange the hides for some hand picked perfect specimens.LW horsehides are beautiful,very pliable,thick and smell wonderful! Took the new hides to Langlitz with even more confidence only to be turned down again! This time the quality was very good but too thick,some 6oz+ and would have trouble sewing through the doubled or tripled seams. Well the air was out of my sails by then and on the verge of quitting with a bunch of unreturnable Horsehides on hand. One lady at Langlitz (can't remember her name)came up to me and said if you can get a small quantity of 3-3.5oz. horsehide of same quality to be used where needed, she could build the jacket. Awesome-and Dave agreed to it. Was all the trouble and time worth it? One word-Yes. Like I said earlier, if you can get a horsehide Langlitz now by paying 1200.00 extra its a bargain and alot less stressful than going out and trying to find the horsehides. By the way-there is no jacket out there that fits and feels and looks like a Langlitz and Horsehide makes it legendary!

Threy are awesome pix - how do you get the shine and the patina? By polishing the jacket?