It's been 20 Years; release Song of the South

[Harry Lime]

Since this is a forum that's largely about "The Good Old Days" it's not suprising that most of the posters are white males with conservative views. Fond nostalgia for the past doesn't run so deeply in many communities, they're more concerned with moving forward. Not understanding why some people don't really want to re-visit the innocence of L'il Black Sambo, Uncle Remus, Stepinfechit, Rochester, Amos 'n' Andy et all really shows a lack of true empathy toward black people. That said, that may not even be the real reason Disney doesn't re-release it. There are many, many reasons some films are released and some aren't. It could be a matter of licensing certain rights that are currently unavailable.

Harry Lime

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Last weekend, we were making pancakes, and I was thinking how my family used to eat at Sambo's Pancake restaurants. My wife hadn't heard of them. They had the story of "Little Black Sambo" painted around the restaurant.

"Sambo" and "Sammy" were pejorative terms used by British colonialists for brown-skinned Indians (from India). In fact, Britons referred to Indians as "black". The "Sambo" from the restaurant was inspired by a children's book, "The Story of Little Black Sambo", authored by Helen Bannerman. Bannerman also wrote "Little Black Mingo", "Little Black Quasha", and "Little Black Quibbba".

Here, in its entirety, is "The Story of Little Black Sambo" from India. Derogatory? I leave that to you to judge. (Apparently, Indian, Pakistani and Bangladeshi children still enjoy it. If they are not offended, should we be? I'm still trying to decide.) Surprisingly, perhaps, the book can be purchased in the U.S.A. via Amazon.com.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0397300069/002-4792712-0101660?n=283155






"Once upon a time there was a little black boy, and his name was Little Black Sambo.
And his mother was called Black Mumbo.
And his father was called Black Jumbo.

And Black Mumbo made him a beautiful little Red Coat,
and a pair of beautiful little blue trousers.
And Black Jumbo went to the Bazaar,
and bought him a beautiful Green Umbrella,
and a lovely little Pair of Purple Shoes
with Crimson Soles and Crimson Linings.

And then wasn't Little Black Sambo grand?

So he put on all his Fine Clothes,
and went out for a walk in the Jungle.
And by and by he met a Tiger.
And the Tiger said to him,
"Little Black Sambo, I'm going to eat you up!"

And Little Black Sambo said,
"Oh! Please Mr. Tiger, don't eat me up,
and I'll give you my beautiful little Red Coat."

So the Tiger said,
"Very well, I won't eat you this time,
but you must give me your beautiful little Red Coat."

So the Tiger got poor Little Black Sambo's beautiful little Red Coat,
and went away saying,
"Now I'm the grandest Tiger in the Jungle."

And Little Black Sambo went on,
and by and by he met another Tiger,
and it said to him,
"Little Black Sambo, I'm going to eat you up!"

And Little Black Sambo said,
"Oh! Please Mr. Tiger, don't eat me up,
and I'll give you my beautiful little BlueTrousers."

So the Tiger said,
"Very well, I won't eat you this time,
but you must give me your beautiful little Blue Trousers."

So the Tiger got poor Little Black Sambo's beautiful little Blue Trousers,
and went away saying,
"Now I'm the grandest Tiger in the Jungle."

And Little Black Sambo went on,
and by and by he met another Tiger,
and it said to him,
"Little Black Sambo, I'm going to eat you up!"

And Little Black Sambo said,
"Oh! Please Mr. Tiger, don't eat me up,
and I'll give you my beautiful little Purple Shoes
with Crimson Soles and Crimson Linings."

But the Tiger said,
"What use would your shoes be to me?
I've got four feet, and you've got only two;
you haven't got enough shoes for me."

But Little Black Sambo said,
"You could wear them on your ears."

"So I could," said the Tiger:
"that's a very good idea.
Give them to me, and I won't eat you this time."

So the Tiger got poor Little Black Sambo's beautiful little Purple Shoes
with Crimson Soles and Crimson Linings,
and went away saying, "Now I'm the grandest Tiger in the Jungle."
And by and by Little Black Sambo met another Tiger,
and it said to him,
"Little Black Sambo, I'm going to eat you up!"

And Little Black Sambo said,
"Oh! Please Mr. Tiger, don't eat me up,
and I'll give you my beautiful Green Umbrella."

But the Tiger said,
"How can I carry an umbrella,
when I need all my paws for walking with?"

"You could tie a knot on your tail and carry it that way,"
said Little Black Sambo.

"So I could,"said the Tiger.
"Give it to me, and I won't eat you this time."

So he got poor Little Black Sambo's beautiful Green Umbrella,
and went away saying,
"Now I'm the grandest Tiger in the Jungle."

And poor Little Black Sambo went away crying,
because the cruel Tigers had taken all his fine clothes.
Presently he heard a horrible noise that sounded like "Gr-r-r-r-rrrrrr,"
and it got louder and louder.

"Oh! dear!" said Little Black Sambo,
"there are all the Tigers coming back to eat me up!
What shall I do?"

So he ran quickly to a palm-tree,
and peeped round it to see what the matter was.

And there he saw all the Tigers fighting,
and disputing which of them was the grandest.

And at last they all got so angry
that they jumped up and took off all the fine clothes,
and began to tear each other with their claws,
and bite each other with their great big white teeth.

And they came,
rolling and tumbling right to the foot of the very tree
where Little Black Sambo was hiding,
but he jumped quickly in behind the umbrella.

And the Tigers all caught hold of each other's tails,
as they wrangled and scrambled,
and so they found themselves in a ring round the tree.

Then, when the Tigers were very wee and very far away,
Little Black Sambo jumped up, and called out,
"Oh! Tigers! why have you taken off all your nice clothes?
Don't you want them any more?"

But the Tigers only answered, "Gr-r-rrrr!"

Then Little Black Sambo said,
"If you want them, say so, or I'll take them away."
But the Tigers would not let go of each other's tails,
and so they could only say "Gr-r-r-rrrrrr!"

So Little Black Sambo put on all his fine clothes again and walked off.

And the Tigers were very, very angry,
but still they would not let go of each other's tails.

And they were so angry,
that they ran round the tree,
trying to eat each other up,
and they ran faster and faster,
till they were whirling round so fast
that you couldn't see their legs at all.

And they still ran faster and faster and faster,
till they all just melted away,
and there was nothing left but a great big pool of melted butter
(or "ghi," as it is called in India)
round the foot of the tree.

Now Black Jumbo was just coming home from his work,
with a great big brass pot in his arms,
and when he saw what was left of all the Tigers he said,
"Oh! what lovely melted butter!
I'll take that home to Black Mumbo for her to cook with."

So he put it all into the great big brass pot,
and took it home to Black Mumbo to cook with.
When Black Mumbo saw the melted butter, wasn't she pleased!
"Now," said she, "we'll all have pancakes for supper!"

So she got flour and eggs and milk and sugar and butter,
and she made a huge big plate of most lovely pancakes.

And she fried them in the melted butter which the Tigers had made,
and they were just as yellow and brown as littleTigers.

And then they all sat down to supper.

And Black Mumbo ate Twenty-seven pancakes,
and Black Jumbo ate Fifty-five
but Little Black Sambo ate a Hundred and Sixty-nine,
because he was so hungry."


THE END.

 

[Naama]

Well I'm not sure if the story of little black sambo is racist, but the drawings, for sure, they are...... I would be rather offended by them. Or well, I am offended, and I'm white......

Naama

 

[Lena_Horne]

Wow.

I was asked to come over and give my opinion on the movie. I've found much more. I'm a black, 19 year old, female lover of the golden era. Through my "studies" I've learned to take most things in stride and credit it to it's times. While I've always found the Little Black Sambo somewhat offensive I've been much kinder to Uncle Remus and company. I guess it just depends on what I'm looking at and what values I can glean from it. I suppose it helps that I'm currently a history major and a writer which requires that I look at things from a much larger context. I find African-American folk songs such as "Forbidden Fruit" (I'm listening to the Nina Simone version as I type) and spirituals wonderful, relaxing even, my friends however might not agree. I have seen the stage performance of Porgy and Bess, I also listen to Miles Davis take on the soundtrack on a regular basis but I know of people who consider that entire work (as well as the Gershwin brothers) to be racist (the same could possibly be said for Carmen Jones [1954] which I also adore). At the end of the day it comes down to context. I could see this movie released with a little set up explaining its history affording parents an opportunity (should they choose) to give their children some substance. For me the experience wins out over feeling upset or cheated. While I don't agree with a lot of things (that Sambo restaurant comes to mind) as a writer I am required to empathize with a lot more than my contemporaries might. And I consider myself richer for that fact.

L_H

P.S. The Boondocks (both in comic strip form as well as television show) was created by Aaron McGruder (who is African-American) and is meant to be a social comentary both on the state of African-American/White relations today as well as politics in general. McGruder is an avowed Liberal and I was a great fan of his for a long time before getting into vintage culture. While I no longer prescribe to his sentiments exactly I certainly agree with a lot of what he has to say. The younger brother Riley is meant (as I understand it) to be a parody of today's predominant gansta rap culture and its affect on young black males. His older brother Huey however is a sensitive intellectual who tries to collar Riley as their grandfather certainly isn't going to interfere anytime soon. That said, you either like the show or you don't.

 

[jake_fink]

Re: Little Black Sambo

Isn't insistently referring to someone by their race rather than just their name or individual identity by definition, racist?

Yeah!

 

[jdjs]

Well . . .

(Preface: urban white male here)

I've been fortunate enough to have a copy of SotS on Laserdisc for several years, and in teaching both animation and film history, I really found this line of discussion interesting.

The film itself has a lot of merit - first Disney live action, combines live action and animation (though not a lot), Academy Award Winner, one of the most famous Disney songs, animated characters that still appear at parks (although many have no idea who they are), wonderful Hattie McDaniel and James Baskett performances. The film has a lot of problems too - the "happy slaves" on the plantation, disjointed story, dull and negative image adults (grandma's a busybody, mom's a pain, dad's absent (almost a divorced couple riff)), manipulative cloying resolution. The problem is - should the public be "exposed" to this, or does "big brother Disney" get to make the choice?

In discussing this with my classes (I love teen response), they quickly paralleled this with the Muslim cartoon controversy - where does free speech begin and what limits are there. The results:
- SotS is a historical (albeit inaccurate) record of its time. Were there plantations and slaves? Yes. Were they happy? Probably not. If we don't acquaint ourselves with our history (both the positive and negative), does it not make it too easy to repeat?
- SotS may have been a kid friendly movie, but does it hold up? Generally, no. This is not an animated Disney feature that younger kids will play over and over. No blood. No gore. Too much sugar. The audience would be more nostalgic for the movie than for the time (as one pointed out, remember that the civil war is a full century past, as opposed to when it opened sixty years ago.
- Is SotS offensive? No more than Huckleberry Finn or Gone with the Wind or Charlie Chan (yes, I was shocked when a group of teens knew who Charlie Chan was). Viewers are more aware of context.
-Should it be released? Yes. It is up to the public to decide whether to support or reject a movie. Some suggested that if Disney wants to restrict availability, overprice it (do a collector's set or tin, limit the release period, etc.). How many would buy it? From the class, only the students who intend to pursue animation.

My two cents.

 

[Lincsong]

Civility is greatly appreciated

I read all the comments except the individual who is on my ignore list and all comments were well thought out, lucid, frank and honest. I'm glad that we all could voice our opinions on a film and not resort to attacking each other.

What I didn't like about the Boondocks on Saturday was where the older brother was contemplating watching several days of "black" television, he picked up the remote and said; "n!$$ize me". As far as the other social commentary, hey funny is funny. But, what if some 5 or 6 year old wakes up at 11 p.m. on Sunday, his parents are asleep, walks into the rumpus room, turns on the Cartoon Network and hears "n!$$ize me"? He then goes to school, says it and all of a sudden he's expelled and his parents are sent to sensitivity training?

Sambo's Restaurant; I remember it as a kid. Really nothing to get riled up over. Sub-continent Indians are genetically classified as caucasians. I'll have to bring the story up with some Indian friends and get their take on it.

Song of the South is harmless. No one is going to see it unless they pay the price of a movie ticket or buy the DVD. If it is broadcast, then put it on right at 8 p.m. and the same parents hand that turned the television on can turn the channel.

 

[Lincsong]

Charlie Chan was a real cop.

- Is SotS offensive? No more than Huckleberry Finn or Gone with the Wind or Charlie Chan (yes, I was shocked when a group of teens knew who Charlie Chan was). Viewers are more aware of context.
-Should it be released? Yes. It is up to the public to decide whether to support or reject a movie. Some suggested that if Disney wants to restrict availability, overprice it (do a collector's set or tin, limit the release period, etc.). How many would buy it? From the class, only the students who intend to pursue animation.

The character in the Charlie Chan movies was based on a Chinese Honolulu police detective who did not carry a gun. He carried a horse whip!:cheers1:

 

[Marc Chevalier]

A great thread.

 

[jdjs]

Wow

The character in the Charlie Chan movies was based on a Honolulu police detective who did not carry a gun. He carried a horse whip!:cheers1:

Okay, two in one day. First, I find people under thirty who heard of Chan, and then this. I never knew that! I'll admit I was never a big CC fan - no real reason why. Thanks!

 

[shamus]

But, what if some 5 or 6 year old wakes up at 11 p.m. on Sunday, his parents are asleep, walks into the rumpus room, turns on the Cartoon Network and hears "n!$$ize me"? He then goes to school, says it and all of a sudden he's expelled and his parents are sent to sensitivity training?

Song of the South is harmless. No one is going to see it unless they pay the price of a movie ticket or buy the DVD. If it is broadcast, then put it on right at 8 p.m. and the same parents hand that turned the television on can turn the channel.

But what is thats the same child that wakes up at 11 p.m. and they re-broadcast Song of the South at 11 pm! Now he goes to school singing zippidy Doo-Da!

The boondocks is on at 11 pm for a reason. That same child could turn on the television at 11 pm and watch soft-core porn since his parents have cable.

You can't classify the Boondocks with Song of the South.

Maybe we should worry less about an old film that isn't going to be released anyway (in the US) and take a look at what's going on right now.

 

[Sinatra]

As a kid I saw Song of the South and came away from the movie thinking Uncle Remus was the smartest (wise), kindest and most loving adult in the film.

A hero if you will.

Such is the innocence of childhood.

 

[MudInYerEye]

I'm a black, 19 year old, female lover of the golden era.

Wait a second? So you're not THE Lena Horne?
Oh man. What a bummer...

 

[Doh!]

Back to Sambo's:

While the restaurant's motif may have been borrowed from the "Little Black Sambo" book, the name was not. Two friends named Sam and Bo decided to open up a restaurant together years ago...

http://www.everything2.com/index.pl?node=Sambo's

(yet another reason I love Google -- I had only a vague memory of this story from when the chain was bought by Denny's in the '80s.)

 

[Senator Jack]

About Sambo's:

I remember when the Sambo's lawsuit was going on in the 80s. I recall hearing on the radio that the case was won when the attorney for the plaintiff said 'What would people say if I went opened up a restaurant called 'K*kes.' I laughed for quite some time over that.

Certainly we don't have to look at a 60 year old picture for racism. It's all around us today. Watch 'The Simpsons' sometime. 'Hold it right there, you filthy Eye-talians' says chief Wiggum to the Fat Tony mob. Replace Italian with Blacks, Puerto Ricans, Chinese, or Bora-Borans and there would have been a major protest. Indeed, there was that Seinfeld protest over the episode where Kramer accidentally burns the Puerto Rican flag and then stomps on it. But there was the same joke done on The Simpsons a few years before, with the British flag, and we didn't have the Brits asking for an apology, did we?

Yeah, I've gone off thread hear a bit, but I can't stand when everyone shouts racism at the drop of a hat. Especially when it comes to banning art. There's a scene in 'A Day at the Races' that was routinely cut because the Marx Brothers hid out in the black part of town and wore blackface. Well, the Marx Brothers lived in an era when that was acceptable. Sure, it's wrong, but we can't judge that era by the standards we have today. To excise all such references from our inglorious past is like Stalin cutting out every reference to Trotsky in the encyclopedias. (yes, he really had this done)

Funny how people like to complain about these things. Considering all the really hateful material available out there today, to decry films like SotS and The Little Rascals series is akin to lighting a match in a forest fire.

Regards,

Senator Jack

 

[Harry Lime]

Funny how people like to complain about these things. Considering all the really hateful material available out there today, to decry films like SotS and The Little Rascals series is akin to lighting a match in a forest fire.

Regards,

Senator Jack[/QUOTE]


Careful Jack. The FL is all about "complaining about these (sic) little things." Why don't they make suit armholes like they used to? Why don't they make hats like they used to? Why don't people dress like they used to? Why don't people act like they use to? These are the little things. Complaining about these things in certain circles is more like wetting down the roof of your house when a brush fire threatens it.

People complain about racism when it comes up in "every little thing" because it's a hot button topic, it's uncomfortable, and it's annoying to them when it's about something they haven't personally experienced a great deal of. It's the fact that it was treated so nonchalantly in The Golden Age that it should be watched more vigourously today. Like what you will about The Golden Age (as do I) but it was also an age of monumental prejudice and insensitivity toward race. Some of the things that go on in old films is truly cringe-worthy:
1) Humphrey Bogart adapting a "black" accent in one of his films, a brief bit of dialogue on the phone
2) In same movie HB routinely calling a black bellman "boy"
3) The prevailing part for any black actor in the Golden Age was a trifecta of choice - he could play a porter, a bellman, or a wide-eyed comic foil to a white man
4) It is easier to find a Golden Age film with the leading character in black face than it is to find one with the lead male actually being black
5) Mexicans and other ethnicities routinely treated as sub par

It annoys you that this question always pops up. It annoys others even more that it always has to. That's why race relations are a constant struggle - there was no war that was fought and completely won. The only people who think that it's a done deal are certain white people ie. "We've come so far that I don't see the problem anymore, I saw it as a kid and loved Uncle Remus." I'm sure you all did - how could you not love Uncle Remus, Stepinfethcit and Rochester? They were lovable and unthreatening, just the way a lot of folks like their black people to be.

Again, The real SOS isn't released probably isn't even racially considered - it's probably a money thing. But it has provoked a discussion that is, in reality, more about race issues than it is about the release of a film. There's a siide that sees it as no big deal and a side this sees it as a small deal that when added togetehr with a thousand others, then a thousand more - is a huge deal. It's part of a larger picture that can never be forgotten. And I'm not really buying "It's the suppression of Art" argument either. It's not banned, it's not burned, it's just not easy to find - like a copy of "Mein Kampf."

A final note on SOS - it's an average film at best anyway. There are so many more choices of better films for kids today it will never be missed. Adults who love the Golden Age can find thousand of titles readily available that are far better, many with just the right scosh of good ol' fashioned racism that goes by so fast you can ignore it or forget it if you choose.

Harry Lime

 

[Senator Jack]

Being of Italian heritage, I could certainly object to the way Italians are filmically depicted to this day. In 95% of the programming out there, we're mobsters. No one can gainsay that. Are we always in an uproar? No. And if you think the Italians and Irish weren't as looked down upon as any other nationality in this country, I'd suggest checking out any history book that deals with the immigration of the twenties. Certainly, Sacco and Vezetti immediately come to mind. And, again, it is perfectly all right to stereotype both of these nationalities even to this day. Perhaps it's because we're just not as thin-skinned as everyone else.

There are Italian groups that do protest the cast of the Sopranos marching in the Columbus day parade, and they're routinely laughed off. Dismissed as being ridiculous. I guess calls of racism is only valid for certain groups. The rest of us have to take it in stride.

Practically every group throughout history has been reviled, offended, subjugated, enslaved at some point. (Ever heard of the Christians and the Lions? The Huguenots? The Puritans?) It's time to get over it like the rest of us did.


Regards,

Senator Jack

 

[shamus]

I remember seeing those old photos of the water fountains labeled "Whites Only" "Colored Only," "Italians Only," "Irish Only," "Polish Only"...

What a crazy time that was....

 

[Lena_Horne]

Wait a second? So you're not THE Lena Horne?
Oh man. What a bummer...

*giggle* The jig is up. No I'm not the real Lena Horne, hm, which is kind of ironic in that lately I've been idolizing Dorothy Dandridge instead. Perhaps I ought to change my name.

L_H

 

[Lena_Horne]

I read all the comments except the individual who is on my ignore list and all comments were well thought out, lucid, frank and honest. I'm glad that we all could voice our opinions on a film and not resort to attacking each other.

What I didn't like about the Boondocks on Saturday was where the older brother was contemplating watching several days of "black" television, he picked up the remote and said; "n!$$ize me". As far as the other social commentary, hey funny is funny. But, what if some 5 or 6 year old wakes up at 11 p.m. on Sunday, his parents are asleep, walks into the rumpus room, turns on the Cartoon Network and hears "n!$$ize me"? He then goes to school, says it and all of a sudden he's expelled and his parents are sent to sensitivity training?

Sambo's Restaurant; I remember it as a kid. Really nothing to get riled up over. Sub-continent Indians are genetically classified as caucasians. I'll have to bring the story up with some Indian friends and get their take on it.

Song of the South is harmless. No one is going to see it unless they pay the price of a movie ticket or buy the DVD. If it is broadcast, then put it on right at 8 p.m. and the same parents hand that turned the television on can turn the channel.

The point of that as I imagine (I never saw that episode) is that it was a comment on the state of television aimed at Blacks today which is shall I say, atrocious. Just sitting back and watching BET requires herculean strength on my part and others might agree. I concur, the idea that some child tuning in late at night probably isn't going to get the context and certainly shouldn't be watching is true. But the events afterward might call attention to some things his parents should have been aware of in the first place. I.E. his staying up watching television when he should be getting rest for the next day. Along with his penchant for repeating things that he ought to know better than to say. And if he didn't know, now's a perfect opportunity to explain the boundaries of what is expected language from a child.

L_H