IRVIN NUTS?...the ULTIMATE thread for those who love 'em!

[GreatWhiteNorth]

How's the glue holding up so far?

Hi Mike ,
I came across your post , saw your great repair on your Irvin , is there any special glue you can recommend for mending sheepskin ?

Also it is still wearable it after the repair ? How stronge is it on the mended joint line .. hope you can shed some light on this for us.

Beautiful jacket by the way!

Well done James! And just in time for Christmas...

I've been playing with my early Christmas present from Alan. Now you see it...

now you don't...

A weeks worth of evenings spent very slowly and carefully glueing all the rips up. At the moment, this isn't a restoration, merely consolodation.... This was by far the worst rip, but I could see there didn't seem to be any missing leather...

Anyway, a question... the jacket appears to have been painted or dyed with something at sometime during it's life...? Anyone know what? Or when? Was it something done by the RAF maybe? I thought it may have been brought up before in this thread, but I had a quick flick and couldn't find anything.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

So, what's the first thing i should do. Should i treat the leather or not? there seems to be widely varying advice on this point (see earlier this thread). I'd like to hear from those who've purchased an (or multiple) original(s). What would you do? The leather eerywhere is supple, except from the hood where it is a little brittle, peeling and slightly patchy.

bk

 

[aswatland]

So, what's the first thing i should do. Should i treat the leather or not? there seems to be widely varying advice on this point (see earlier this thread). I'd like to hear from those who've purchased an (or multiple) original(s). What would you do? The leather eerywhere is supple, except from the hood where it is a little brittle, peeling and slightly patchy.

bk

I usually treat the leather with Pecards and from my experience it feeds it so it becomes more supple. I recently took possession of a very early '30s Irvin. The leather was stiff and dry. Two coats of Pecards have brought it back to life and it is now supple.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

If the leather on the CC one was dry etc., i'd have no problems with jumping in and treating it. But with the discussion earlier about over-treating (esp. shearling jackets), i'm shy of doing so to a jacket whose leather seems nicely supple. I guess my question is: Is treating the jacket just after receiving it generally held to be good practice? Independent of how the leather feels . . . Even if the leather appears supple?

(I'm currently treating a sweatband on a French fedora - brittle, dry, almost cracking leather. It needed rehydration.)

bk

 

[Smithy]

I'd say so long as you do not over condition it it certainly won't do any harm. Be careful what you use though BK as some conditioners, leather foods are bloody terrible.

Although, I've never used it, Pecards (as Andrew and Alan often mention) is widely regarded as great stuff with museums using it on old and antique leather items.

Eastman's offering seems very good, and I still swear by RM Williams Saddle and Leather Dressing which I have used for years on all sorts of leather items and has done a great job. Just make sure you use a product that doesn't go rancid.

 

[aswatland]

I don't treat every leather jacket with Pecards Antique Leather dressing. It depends on the condition of the leather. A light coat on the hood of your CC jacket will do no harm and should help to make the leather supple.

 

[fishmeok]

So I spent some time last night with my "first pattern" WPG Irvin. I added some color with Createx airbrush acrylics. I couldn't get the lighter color I was looking for, the leather is just too dark. but I added some brownish-reddish tint to the leather and gave the entire jacket a nice finished look.
Before:

After:

It's not a huge difference, but I like it...
BTW I picked up a pair of the repro 1940 pattern RAF shearling flight boots Avirex sold back in the '80's on e-bay, should be here this week. I've wanted a pair of those for 20 years...
Cheers
Mark

 

[nightandthecity]

I thought I would drop in the lounge today and see if anyone would like to see my latest jackets.

The first is the 39/40 Irvin.

This is my first original Irvin and I am VERY happy with it.
It’s fair condition but the colour has faded in places, but it seems to have all the original fittings. I have made a small repair to the main zip as the tape is tearing, just to stop it getting worse really, it works ok and as I don’t intend to wear it very often its seems a shame to have it replaced.

I have been given some information about the gunner who wore in WW2 which is really great to know.

James,

I am curious about that 600 squadron jacket. I was considering bidding on it but I couldn’t get any sense out of the seller about the size, or about features that would have helped me date it more precisely.

For example, the back/arm/chest measurements he gave seemed totally incompatible with each other‚ĶI did manage to drag out of him that the back wasn‚Äòt actually 25‚Äù as stated but was 23 ¬?!! Hardly a minor discrepancy! But that‚Äôs about as much as I could get out of him.

Anyway, please put my mind at rest, what size is it, in fact?? From the limited info and the scale in the pics I’d guess a size 4 (38 chest)?

 

[jamespibworth@n]

Good evening,

I am bang on a 40" chest and 5'9". All my A2s are 40" reg. As you can see from my pics this Irvin fits well (Well I think so!) So I would say its a 40 regular.
For your information I have taken some measurments:
Under the arms zipped 22 1\2"
Shoulder seam to Shoulder seam 21 1\2"
Shoulder seam to bottom of cuff 24 1\2"
Bottom of collar to bottom of jacket 23 1\2"

Glad you did not bid me up even more! I just love this jacket!!!

Hope this helps.

Cheerio

 

[ukali1066]

Very professional finish there fishmeok, I like it, well done

 

[Spitfire]

Nice work there Fishmeok.

And congrats with your 1936 Pattern Flying Boots.
I had a pair from Avirex for many years - but sold them half a year ago.
(They had always bee too small) Great, solid boots though.

I am now the happy owner of a pair from Aero - in the right size.
Uses them almost daily this time of year.

 

[nightandthecity]

Good evening,

I am bang on a 40" chest and 5'9". All my A2s are 40" reg. As you can see from my pics this Irvin fits well (Well I think so!) So I would say its a 40 regular.
For your information I have taken some measurments:
Under the arms zipped 22 1\2"
Shoulder seam to Shoulder seam 21 1\2"
Shoulder seam to bottom of cuff 24 1\2"
Bottom of collar to bottom of jacket 23 1\2"

Glad you did not bid me up even more! I just love this jacket!!!

Hope this helps.

Cheerio

thank you for that James! The seller listed the chest ambiguously as "38-40", but told me that that was what it literally measured, around 19-20" across the chest! Sounds like a size 5 from your figures and photos. It would have fitted me, but I prefer size 4 (I am 38 chest and 5ft8).

One major problem with ebay is the large number of people who seem unable to use a tape measure! And it really is an awful lot of people.

It's a long while since I bought an Irvin, but I'm afraid the mood is coming on me again. I sold off most of my collection over the last ten years and am now down to 3 (from a high of around 40-50). But I find myself without an "early" pattern wearer after selling my 1938 size 5 a while back.....

Anyway, the jacket looks well on you and I'm glad it has gone to a good home!

 

[fishmeok]

Nice work there Fishmeok.

And congrats with your 1936 Pattern Flying Boots.
I had a pair from Avirex for many years - but sold them half a year ago.
(They had always bee too small) Great, solid boots though.

I understand they are English made, so I'd assume they're good. I'll get some use out of them in Minnesota- it's been below freezing most of the month. Maybe we should start a flying boot thread...

Wore the WPG this morning, 9 degrees F, but it's supposed to get up to 30F today. Heat wave

BTW one of the guys over on the VLJ list is selling a WPG Irvin, size 42 if anybody is looking for one.
Cheers
Mark

 

[Spitfire]

SamMarlowPI ???? There's your Irvin!

 

[Spitfire]

1936 Pattern Flying Boots

My new Aero - with leathersole. Great boots!

The old Avirex versions - with a heavy profiled rubbersole - not as the originals.
But very, very usefull in Minesota!

But I am still dreaming about these:

Knowing that they were not as popular among the pilots,
'cause they tended to get very cold,
when wet before flying the canvas frose up.
(But who cares, if you stay under 1000 feet. )

PS Paddy, Feel free to move this to another thead - or start a new one.

 

[Alan Eardley]

D. Lewis was the original name of the company that produced much flying and motorcycle gear pre-war. The proprietor in WW2 (who wasn't D Lewis, BTW) was later joined by a partner name Godfrey Lewis. This much is fact. The theory is that Godfrey Lewis wanted to get into AM contracts in a way that didn't compromise the existing D Lewis 'brand', so a company was formed just to make 'Irvin' suits under contract. ' DGL (London) Ltd' (that's exactly what it says on the labels) is supposed to be short for D & G Lewis (London) Ltd.

There are some problems with this, but then there are with the 'Gamage' theory also.

Some people feel that DGL made the best suits, BTW. Their sheepskin is almost luxurious. It's an opinion.

Alan

D.G.L. probably stood for D. Gamage London, a pre-war maker of motor cycle clothing and a wartime contractor for the Air Ministry. This is Alan's guess, but it may be the abbreviation for D. Lewis, another maker (became Lewis Leathers), but then there is the question of the G! D. Lewis certainly made RAF flying gear from the 30s onwards as there are many surviving adverts from Lewis.

IAC is Irvin Air Chute, the original maker from Letchworth, Herts.

 

[Mike1973]

Welcome Great White North!

I just used a strong contact adhesive, but it does set hard. Not too much of a problem but I reckon Alan's recommendation of 'Shoo Gloo' sounds a lot better, as it stays flexible.
As for strength, the test repairs on the old BSA Irvin are holding up well... and that gets a fair bit of use. The shoulder panel is ripped from top to bottom, a good 4 or 5 inches. It's nasty and I want to replace/patch the whole panel, the glue is just to hold it together while I find the right leather... It's still holding despite being in a fairly highly stressed area...

Hi Mike ,
I came across your post , saw your great repair on your Irvin , is there any special glue you can recommend for mending sheepskin ?

Also it is still wearable it after the repair ? How stronge is it on the mended joint line .. hope you can shed some light on this for us.

Beautiful jacket by the way!

 

[aswatland]

D. Lewis was the original name of the company that produced much flying and motorcycle gear pre-war. The proprietor in WW2 (who wasn't D Lewis, BTW) was later joined by a partner name Godfrey Lewis. This much is fact. The theory is that Godfrey Lewis wanted to get into AM contracts in a way that didn't compromise the existing D Lewis 'brand', so a company was formed just to make 'Irvin' suits under contract. ' DGL (London) Ltd' (that's exactly what it says on the labels) is supposed to be short for D & G Lewis (London) Ltd.

There are some problems with this, but then there are with the 'Gamage' theory also.

Some people feel that DGL made the best suits, BTW. Their sheepskin is almost luxurious. It's an opinion.

Alan

Alan,

This theory puts a bit more flesh on the bones of my earlier suggestion. It sounds logical. I know another London maker called S.Lewis also made aviation clothing in the 30s and may also have been a wartime contractor. There are adverts for both Lewis firms in old issues of "Flight" mag.

 

[Aviakid]

S Lewis's

S Lewis's was a small store run by Sammy Lewis at 29 Carburton street, London W1. A 1930s catalogue I have states that S Lewis are a 'Motor Engineers and Government Surplus stores'. From the 50's onwards they basically sold D Lewis/Lewis Leathers motorcycle goods with S Lewis's labels applied internally and finally 'allied' with D Lewis Ltd/Lewis Leathers in 1967 the Carburton st shop then became a D Lewis Ltd outlet.
The thing that set D Lewis Ltd apart was that they were 'actual makers' and presumably supplied various companies with goods which would be labelled as necessary. The DGL name still remains a mystery though.

 

[SamMarlowPI]

thanks Spitty but i said the hell with trying to register on VLJ b/c they won't accept my email...SO ill have to pass on that one...