In praise of newer Stetson

[KY Gentleman]

I don't understand why so many people trash Stetsons. First of all I don't see that many hats being worn out there wherever I go for folks to say they don't wear as well as an Akubra. The prices are pretty comperable to other lids. Are there really many people who wear these hats while climbing mountains that can attest to Stetsons quality versus the hat they wore in 1945? Or the Akubra they wore to scale Everest?
I like my newer Stetsons and Akubras and I even have an older Borsalino.
I don't know if any of them would actually hold up under gale force winds or an action movie shoot.

 

[Jfala]

I'm not sure why either...all though I am rather new to hat "collecting" and wearing I really enjoy my Stetson Temple, and it's only a few months old. The felt has really become soft, and even though it's not as soft and pliable as my vintage Stetson, it certainly doesn't feel cheap.

Anyone else feel good about their newer Stetson?

- Jeff

 

[J.T.Marcus]

I have about a half dozen, and I love every one of them!

 

[warbird]

Well I guess you've been fortunate. The new stetsons are simply not up to snuff. The quality of their fur is not what it once was. Most importantly they now color their hats differently. The powder dye they use is notorious for running when they get wet. They end up blotchy and streaked.

I wouldn't say they are crap, but they will not hold up to elements like several other new brands such as Akubra and they won't hold up as the vintage Stetson. I have several newer Stetsons, I won't wear them in certain conditions simple as that. You don't have to climb mountains or walk through jungles to stress the materials of a hat. That's OK. I have hats that do fine for their limitations, but I also want hats that will last a long long time with lots of durability for weather and such. They are usually soft and fit nicely. I don't mind hats with a bit of taper so that doesn't bother me. I would buy a ton of them at their outlets, but I wouldnt pay the price for a regular one at retail cost.

The biggest thing to some is this, you can buy better hats and sometimes vintage hats for a lot less than a new Stetson. For many that's enough to end the story. JT if I recall a number of yours came from their outlet didn't they? You can't beat a deal like that. Those are great values.

If you like your new Stetsons good for you. Enjoy them.

 

[warbird]

Running dye or loss of shape is a legitimate concern if you may be wearing your hat in heavy rain.

But I think many hat wearers don't really care if a hat has "inferior felt" that will only last for five years instead of 50 years.

Many of the photos of vintage hats posted show hats that are obviously old, used, spotty, moth-eaten, and a bit cruddy looking.

I think a lot of people just want a new, clean looking hat that they can buy retail without a hassle.

I disagree. If you are going to spend over a $100 for something most expect it to last more than a dadgum 5 years. And if it gets wet and looks like crap a couple months after buying it most won't be happy either.

There are values at times and they are worth the purchase, but not standard retail for many of us. Nope. For that amount I'll get an Akubra or Major Moore or JP design.

 

[French]

My Stetson Temple experience

Has been good so far. I purchased a modern Temple last fall from my local hatter (for a reduced price). The hat has been rain and snow soaked and worn for outdoor activities (apple and pumpkin picking, hiking with the kids, light yard work) and I have not had a bad experience. The hat still looks good, the felt is softening nicely, and it seems to be holding up well.

Maybe I'm one of the lucky ones. I understand my Stetson can't compare quality wise to some of the other hats out there, but, so far I'm satisfied with how it has held up. Hopefully in 20 years I'll still be able to make similar claims (about the hat and about me .

French

 

[Spellflower]

So how low is too low(for the average person-not period correct)?...after you mentioned this I checked specs onthe Chatham...crown 3 3/4 ....seems a little low....
newhatguy

I bought one of these but returned it becaue the center dent kept popping up when I wore it, usually unevenly. I just couldn't stand that. I also discovered this place and decided that if I was going to spend over $100 I wanted it to fit and last.

I don't know that all modern Stetsons are junk- that would be a pretty strong statement. But I do know that of the hundreds of people on this site who have Akubras, I've never heard of ONE complaining about the color running out or the hat losing its shape after one downpour, and there seem to be at least a few people who had that experience with Stetson. Akubras aren't perfect, but I think they're a better value.

 

[J.T.Marcus]

I don't know that all modern Stetsons are junk- that would be a pretty strong statement. But I do know that of the hundreds of people on this site who have Akubras, I've never heard of ONE complaining about the color running out or the hat losing its shape after one downpour, and there seem to be at least a few people who had that experience with Stetson. Akubras aren't perfect, but I think they're a better value.

I do recall one guy who complained that his Akubra developed a bad case of taper, when he tried to use steam to shape it.

 

[Spellflower]

lol
Yeah, but it took multiple steamings to do that- it came out of many dowpours just fine. Like I said, they're not perfect, but they're not bad.

And at least you CAN shape them, as long as you're careful with the steam.

 

[carldelo]

My Chatham is in good shape so far (since Christmas) and I don't baby it in any way. The brim is soft and pliable, stays where I put it and the crown is softening up nicely. I think the actual number of people complaining about specific problems with Stetsons on the Lounge seems low, but the complaints turn up in multiple threads.

There seems to be about as much talk about tapering Akubras, but for some reason it is not usually lamented as a quality issue. The Akubra Sydney that I bought recently is well known to not hold a bash, and people seem OK with that, sometimes offering it as a positive attribute. The same problem with a Stetson, however, is judged to be an issue of poor quality. I'm not trying to pick on you SF, and I don't know if you'd like a Sydney either, but it is an example of what I think is a tacit double standard, with Stetson on the losing end.

I sold the Akubra Sydney not because it wouldn't hold a bash (and I know Roadrunner managed to put a nice permanent bash in his), but because the crown was too high for me. If you are looking for a moderate height crown, Stetson is about the only game in town. And if you have a large hat size (mine is 7-3/4) going vintage is not really an option. So all the quality comparisons between modern and vintage are compelling, but in my case a moot point. Custom is an option which I have yet to indulge.

If my Chatham wears out in 5 years (which I doubt), I won't be upset because I wear it all the time. Most of my suits wear out after about 5 years and they cost much more than my hats. The unworn vintage Cavanagh with Cavanagh edge that I bought in high school wore out after 10 years - it cost $0.75 so I can't complain. If I had paid the going rate on ebay for it, would I be justified in getting upset that it didn't last a lifetime? Maybe, but if I had paid $300 for it, it would probably have sat in the closet for much of that 10 years instead of being my daily hat, which it was.

My wife just bought me a Stetson Ashland (Royal quality), one level below the Chatham (Sovereign). The felt is noticeably less soft, I had to trim some stray threads, but it's still a nice hat and looks good. I'll wear it where-ever and when-ever, and when it wears out I'll replace it. Hey it's a hat, not a car, it's not meant to last forever. How else are we going to keep our hat guys in business if we don't wear out our hats?

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

I too have been looking at the modern stetson....is there any quality difference between the Chatham and Temple? price varies a little...guess it is just trim style difference....have not seen these in the $20 to $45 price range from the usual list of vendors...would rather buy thru a "true" dealer than ebay...especially if Im buying new.

Hi. I commented on this in the Stetson Chatham thread also, but I own both a Chatham and a Temple and basically find the Temple to have a smoother, softer feel to it. I do, however, like the C-crown style of the Chatham and the Caribou color better - and it was slightly less expensive.

 

[Spellflower]

Cardelo, I actually bought a Sydney (well, a Fedora) to replace the Chatham. They are two different hats.

For one thing, the reason the Chatham holds a bash is that it's chock full of stiffener. Yes, it holds shape, but you can't easily re-shape it. I started with a teardrop in my Fedora, then switched it to center dent with no problem.

The Fedora is slightly tapered, but that's part of the design- it wasn't straight when I got it, so I don't see this as a flaw (my Federation, on the other hand...) It's a flaw when a rainstorm causes the felt to shrink up rapidly, as some have reported with Chathams. I've never heard of an Akubra doing this after one downpour.

I actually wish the Fedora's crown was higher. It does measure fairly high, but it doesn't seem that high to me, compared to other hats I own.

I will grant that the Caribou color is nicer than the Fawn.

In the end, both hats were beginner hats for me. Neither was really what I wanted, but they helped me figure out what I wanted.

Probably there are some Stetsons that are great, but some that are not coming out of the factory. Akubra seems to have a more consistent product, based on reports here, but it's all anecdotal. In the end, the clincher for me was the open crown, more than anything.

 

[Doctor Strange]

I've had a caribou (light gray) Stetson Temple since 2002 (when it could still be found for under $100), and have worn it in the rain and snow plenty - no color run, no loss of shape. No, it's not in the same league as my Akubras (a Federation, a Stockman, and a Cattleman) in terms of felt toughness, and its sweatband is pretty lame compared to theirs. But I still love the Temple and continue to wear it with the jackets it coordinates with well...

I don't know if I'd feel so good about it if I spent nearly $150 to get it today, but there's certainly nothing "wrong" with it. It's a perfectly serviceable, attractive hat, and its tapered shape suits me better than the huge crown of the Federation.

 

[Spellflower]

I disagree, Kabuto. Good felt is pretty water resistant, even in a real downpour, and it will keep its shape well enough that it still looks presentable, even if wet. I don't want a hat that I have to baby and worry about. I want a hat that will protect me from the elements, be they rain or sun.

And as for wet climates, having lived in Portland, I can tell you that people there make less use of umbrellas than east-coasters. Why? Because it never really rains that hard, and they just get used to it. Here in NY, though, you never know what to expect. People carry umbrellas when rain is forecasted, but downpours happen unexpectedly too.

My hats have never had a problem in the rain, and they are much more fun to carry around than an umbrella!

 

[J.T.Marcus]

I have, for the purposes of shaping, dunked in cold water an uncountable number of hats, both vintage (many brands) and contemporary HATCO products. (Note: At some point in manufacturing, every hat has already been thoroughly soaked. That's how they are made!) Based on considerable experience, I offer the following. (Note, none of this is anecdotal. It is all first hand scientific observation.)

1. I have never destroyed a hat by soaking it in cold water. (A total dunking for over an hour is more water than anybody is going to encounter in the rain!)
2. There is seldom any observable shrinking. When there is, it tends to be less than 1/2 size (i.e. A 7 1/4 might or might not become smaller, but still larger than a 7 1/8.).
3. Even before I had blocks, and simply allowed the hat to dry in the shape I wanted, I never saw a hat "develop" taper. They end up with the taper (or lack of) they had before soaking.
4. When the hat is a dark color, the water will almost always become the color of the hat (For black hats, the rate is virtually 100%. If you don't believe it, try it yourself, with your Akubra!) This is what everybody calls "running." It happens with even the most desirable vintage brands. The good news is, unless you leave the hat in the water for MANY HOURS, you will be unable to observe any difference in color once the hat dries.

Based on my first-hand experience , I would suggest: If you are wearing a white shirt and a black hat (old or new, manufactured by anybody), and you must walk in a torrential downpour which will totally soak the hat (and then let water run out of the felt onto your collar), use an umbrella or wait for the rain to slack up! Otherwise, if it's a drizzle (or light shower), make a dash for it.

 

[Spellflower]

J.T., I respect your ample experience, and I believe everything you say, but unless you tested a statistically relevant number of the same model hat in laboratory controlled conditions and measured any changes, then did the same thing for other brands/models, your evidence is still anecdotal, not scientific.

That said, your informal tests are still very valuable as they are likely the best information we are going to get, due to the prohibitive cost, and, frankly, the wastefulness of doing a scientific test.

Maybe new Stetsons do get a bad rap. I'm glad you're brave enough to give them a working over to prove otherwise. I just couldn't justify spending over $100 to do my own informal test.

 

[carldelo]

I pledge that as my own anecdotal testing of 2 modern Stetsons goes forward, I will report any flagrant quality issues - now bring on the rain....

 

[J.T.Marcus]

It was raining a monsoon when I went to church at 7:30, this morning. My wife tried to give me an umbrella, but I told her I needed to do a test on a hat. She looked at me like I was crazy. By the time I got there, The Stetson Temple, which had not been in the rain before, was quite drenched, but not waterlogged. Raindrops were still sitting on the surface. I didn't even blot it off, just hung it on the hat rack. When I went to put it on, about five hours later, my heart almost stopped! It looked "blotchy." On a whim, I brushed over the blotches with my fingertips. That was all it took. Evedently, all that had happened was that the direction of the nap had changed in the wettest areas, and a light brushing took care of it. That was it. No loss of color. No change of shape. No shrinking. None the worse for the experience. See "What Hat Are You Wearing Today" thread for a picture.

 

[KY Gentleman]

It was raining a monsoon when I went to church at 7:30, this morning. My wife tried to give me an umbrella, but I told her I needed to do a test on a hat. She looked at me like I was crazy.

Thats awesome. And that is why I enjoy visiting The Fedora Lounge. :eusa_clap

 

[kysaddletramp]

Hat sizes are the problem

I had an Open Road in the 70's and it was a great hat. That LBJ went everywhere in all kinds of weather and held its own. Trouble is.........you can't find them in large sizes, i.e. 7 7/8 or 8. Fact is.......most outlets stop at 7 3/4 on most styles and makes. So a big head is a problem in the world of hats.