David Conwill
Call Me a Cab
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Flivver said:
Ack! Say it ain't so! Sounds like it's Ford who is stuck in the eighties, not our B-Body-and-Panther-driving brethren.
-Dave
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I'm stuck in the 80s...automotively
- Thread starter davestlouis
- Start date
Ack! Say it ain't so! Sounds like it's Ford who is stuck in the eighties, not our B-Body-and-Panther-driving brethren.
-Dave
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davestlouis
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Flivver, I thought you were full of beans on the curb weight of the new Taurus being more than the Crown Vic...but you're right, with an asterisk...only the AWD Taurus outweighs the Panther, the FWD one is a smidge lighter.
I'm not thrilled with how heavy new cars are, but you have to stuff a bunch of electrical/electronic/safety items in, so I guess they will tend to weigh more.
I'm not thrilled with how heavy new cars are, but you have to stuff a bunch of electrical/electronic/safety items in, so I guess they will tend to weigh more.
Diamondback
I'll Lock Up
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Which is what a little judicious RE-engineering, like carbon-fiber bodywork and drivelines and aluminum radiators, is for...
Before the builds start putting electronics in, the MIBmobile and Firebirds are gonna have every practical ounce shaved out of 'em. (Especially the former--once loaded, that gunrack's gonna be heavy, y'know!)
Before the builds start putting electronics in, the MIBmobile and Firebirds are gonna have every practical ounce shaved out of 'em. (Especially the former--once loaded, that gunrack's gonna be heavy, y'know!)
davestlouis
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I did some online sleuthing, and found curb weights in the 5000-5300 range for early 70s Imperials/Continentals/Fleetwoods, so cars have lost some weight since their peak.
edit...the new Rolls Royce Phantom weighs 5400-5500 Lbs.
edit...the new Rolls Royce Phantom weighs 5400-5500 Lbs.
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Oh yes, the 70's was the heyday for big cars, the end of the decade was the end of that Era. Not sure about Mopar, but GM downsized their cars in 77 and I think Ford's was 79. My friends laugh because I complain my 79 Buick isn't big enough, and I'd like a 75 or 76 Fleetwood instead. Love big ol' Caddys!!
Flivver
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davestlouis said:
One of the main reasons modern cars have become so heavy is the quest for structural stiffness. This improves handling precision and yields that solid feeling many modern vehicles have. But the weight penalty for all of this is significant.
I blame the automotive buff books (magazines) for much of why today's cars are so heavy and feature laden. Consumers didn't want structural stiffness or DOHC engines until the buff books told them they did.
None of this feature-laden FWD stuff for me...I'll stick with Ford Panthers and GM B-Cars as long as I can find good clean used ones.
Professor
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Yes, Chrysler downsized in '79 too. Cadillacs would've been even bigger if it hadn't been for the realization that most garages couldn't fit a car longer than twenty feet!AtomicEraTom said:
Plain fact of the matter is after the war everything went lower, longer, wider with more power (the V8 suddenly became dominant), mileage wasn't even a consideration. Add on top of that emissions controls, and there was no way things could continue. The oil crisis was the smack upside the head American automakers needed to wake up to reality.
David Conwill
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Professor said:
American automakers, or the American auto-buying public?
-Dave
PistolPete1969
One of the Regulars
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I remember all those 80's cars. I first drove (illegally at 12 in 1981) our "other" car, a '72 Olds Cutlass. That was a fun car; big 350 V-8 Rocket, two-door coupe.
My fave 80's car was one of my beater college cars; a 1984 VW Rabbit. it was well used when I got it, but it was a great car for me then. It was great on gas, easy to fix even for a mechanical klutz like me, and zippy around town. It was ridiculously simple, no power anything; 4 cylinder 5-speed standard. Great car....
Pete
My fave 80's car was one of my beater college cars; a 1984 VW Rabbit. it was well used when I got it, but it was a great car for me then. It was great on gas, easy to fix even for a mechanical klutz like me, and zippy around town. It was ridiculously simple, no power anything; 4 cylinder 5-speed standard. Great car....
Pete
davestlouis
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PistolPete, I have fond memories of early VW Rabbits too...a neighbor had a diesel Rabbit(traded in an Olds 98, of all things) and at that time had to go to truck stops to find fuel.
I'm going to go slightly off topic for an editorial...my 3rd child is in high school, and I'm always struck by the NICE cars teenagers drive today. We go to sporting events at school, and the lot is full of Mustangs, BMW convertibles, Jeeps, 4x4 trucks, even Hummers.
My kids all drive beaters, and they pay for their own insurance. One has a Taurus, one has a Kia Rio, and the 17 year old girl has a Chevy Impala that is a retired St Louis County police car, complete with spotlight and dogdish hubcaps. When I was 16, I bought a 1970 MG Midget, and when it turned out to be a complete piece of you-know-what, replaced it with a $350 1969 VW Beetle, complete with holes in the floor and no heat. It got me where I was going, and if it accumulated a ding or two along the way, no harm done.
I'm going to go slightly off topic for an editorial...my 3rd child is in high school, and I'm always struck by the NICE cars teenagers drive today. We go to sporting events at school, and the lot is full of Mustangs, BMW convertibles, Jeeps, 4x4 trucks, even Hummers.
My kids all drive beaters, and they pay for their own insurance. One has a Taurus, one has a Kia Rio, and the 17 year old girl has a Chevy Impala that is a retired St Louis County police car, complete with spotlight and dogdish hubcaps. When I was 16, I bought a 1970 MG Midget, and when it turned out to be a complete piece of you-know-what, replaced it with a $350 1969 VW Beetle, complete with holes in the floor and no heat. It got me where I was going, and if it accumulated a ding or two along the way, no harm done.
scottyrocks
I'll Lock Up
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My Dad had a '71 Beetle. I learned to drive a stick in that car. Later on, I had a '79 Rabbit. Loved it. Same basic car as the '84. I bent the frame in an accident.
Pilgrim
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I sold Chevy, Olds and VW cars from 1977-80, and therefore got a pretty good preview of what was coming for the 80's.
Many of the GM cars from that era were far from inspiring. The early diesel engine in the Olds Cutlass series was a failure. The Caddy Seville and the trunk-angled Cutlass were also just plain odd. There also wasn't much going on in terms of styling. The only visually interesting cars we sold were the Corvette and Camaro.
Occasionally we'd get Chevy pickups with GMC emblems on the side of the cab. Most of the motors and transmissions were GM-wide, and although they were durable and serviceable, they sure weren't inspiring.
Perhaps it's a surprise, but I was a big fan of the GM X-cars such as the Citation. I owned a sport model for 3+ years and it performed great.
The oil crunch propelled our VW cars into the spotlight - the 5-speed Diesel Rabbit was the hottest car in the US. We sold them for full retail sticker and took trade-ins at the cash value, no markup.
But in general, the 80's were really NOT a good time for Detroit. It was after the last muscle cars had died out in the mid-70's, and before the resurgence of quality building and performance. It was also the last gasp of the true "land yachts" that put 19-foot cars into garages owned by 105-pound old ladies who couldn't imagine driving anything smaller. When pickups that ran on leaded gas went out of production, the farmers bought up the old models...just delaying the inevitable, as they've all adapted to using unleaded now. People are always nervous about change.
There are certainly individual cars here and there that were decent, but overall - not a very good decade.
In terms of performance...Ford's new Mustang puts out 305 HP from a V-6!!!!!! That was unheadr of in the 80's, when cars were notoriously fuel-inefficient for most of the decade.
My opinion? Cars are much, much better now than they were then. Safer, last longer, more fuel-efficient, more powerful per cubic inch....and they generally handle better due to advancements in suspension and tire technology. My 2007 Nissan Murano is a category of car that didn't exist then, including its CVT transmisison. But it's very snappy, goes fast, gets mid-20's on the highway, and handles very well.
Many of the GM cars from that era were far from inspiring. The early diesel engine in the Olds Cutlass series was a failure. The Caddy Seville and the trunk-angled Cutlass were also just plain odd. There also wasn't much going on in terms of styling. The only visually interesting cars we sold were the Corvette and Camaro.
Occasionally we'd get Chevy pickups with GMC emblems on the side of the cab. Most of the motors and transmissions were GM-wide, and although they were durable and serviceable, they sure weren't inspiring.
Perhaps it's a surprise, but I was a big fan of the GM X-cars such as the Citation. I owned a sport model for 3+ years and it performed great.
The oil crunch propelled our VW cars into the spotlight - the 5-speed Diesel Rabbit was the hottest car in the US. We sold them for full retail sticker and took trade-ins at the cash value, no markup.
But in general, the 80's were really NOT a good time for Detroit. It was after the last muscle cars had died out in the mid-70's, and before the resurgence of quality building and performance. It was also the last gasp of the true "land yachts" that put 19-foot cars into garages owned by 105-pound old ladies who couldn't imagine driving anything smaller. When pickups that ran on leaded gas went out of production, the farmers bought up the old models...just delaying the inevitable, as they've all adapted to using unleaded now. People are always nervous about change.
There are certainly individual cars here and there that were decent, but overall - not a very good decade.
In terms of performance...Ford's new Mustang puts out 305 HP from a V-6!!!!!! That was unheadr of in the 80's, when cars were notoriously fuel-inefficient for most of the decade.
My opinion? Cars are much, much better now than they were then. Safer, last longer, more fuel-efficient, more powerful per cubic inch....and they generally handle better due to advancements in suspension and tire technology. My 2007 Nissan Murano is a category of car that didn't exist then, including its CVT transmisison. But it's very snappy, goes fast, gets mid-20's on the highway, and handles very well.
I sometimes daydream about the car I fantasized about owning when I was five years old. I was an '80s baby, in Philly, and that meant it had to be a Trans Am with a louvered back window and a screaming chicken on the hood. Pure quiet sophistication, of course, lol, just like "the big kids" in the neighborhood. I would also take a Camaro.
Diamondback
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Ugggh... *cringes* Do you know what those louvers do to the Drag Coefficient and thus fuel economy? 
I've already posted a pic of one of the builds that inspired my plans, right? (Two-tone black over silver, reshaped nose, all new digital dash...)
I've already posted a pic of one of the builds that inspired my plans, right? (Two-tone black over silver, reshaped nose, all new digital dash...)
MAKE CAR FASTER (just like painting it a bright, BRIGHT color, and also T-tops!) Do not argue with the memories of being five, D-back.
I do vaguely remember thinking even at five the guy in the neighborhood who put decals of Jesus over his lights so He would sillhouette was in questionable taste, though.
I do vaguely remember thinking even at five the guy in the neighborhood who put decals of Jesus over his lights so He would sillhouette was in questionable taste, though.
Diamondback
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Match my memories of age 5 against yours anytime... same basic bodies: KITT and KARR from Knight Rider. Which are, not coincidentally, the two builds I'm planning...
same basic bodies: KITT and KARR from Knight Rider. Which are, not coincidentally, the two builds I'm planning...
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I'm a land yacht guy, but would LOVE a Smokey and the Bandit Edition Trans Am, and used to drive a 1980 Corvette Stingray with T-Tops.
And I like a lot of the land yacht styling of the 1970s, but am a much bigger fan of today's mechanics, even though me and it are not compatible as far as working on it. I love the reliability. I am going to try to learn a little about Fuel Injection this summer, and set my 79 Buick up with a Throttle Body on the 350 in there. The car's got a 4bbl Quadrajet (IMO, the best Carburetor you can put on a daily car up north) but I have a bit of a commute to work and want the reliability offered by today's standards.
I also plan on putting a 350 out of a 90s bubble Caprice Police Interceptor and the transmission with it in my 87 Caprice Wagon. I also plan on putting a Ford 9 Inch rear end in it, with Posi.
And I like a lot of the land yacht styling of the 1970s, but am a much bigger fan of today's mechanics, even though me and it are not compatible as far as working on it. I love the reliability. I am going to try to learn a little about Fuel Injection this summer, and set my 79 Buick up with a Throttle Body on the 350 in there. The car's got a 4bbl Quadrajet (IMO, the best Carburetor you can put on a daily car up north) but I have a bit of a commute to work and want the reliability offered by today's standards.
I also plan on putting a 350 out of a 90s bubble Caprice Police Interceptor and the transmission with it in my 87 Caprice Wagon. I also plan on putting a Ford 9 Inch rear end in it, with Posi.
Diamondback
I'll Lock Up
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Tom, based on your "boat" experience what kinds of upgrades, retrofits and additions would you recommend for the MIB-mobile aside from a gut-'n'-stuff with the innards of a Crown Vic interceptor? I assume I'd better stick with Ford or FoMoCo-compatible guts for it...
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Depending on how far you want to go, I would buy a car like my Crown Vic Interceptor (Mine's a 2000) that has collision damage, but is mechanically sound. The motor, trans, and computer, take them and put them in the MIB mobile. I'm not sure what year yours is, but if it has a Fuel Injected 5.0 motor, which they did in the late 80's, early 90's if memory serves me, stick with it. They're GREAT motors! They used identical ones in the Mustangs, and still do.
As for parts otherwise, Crown Vics always have the option for interceptor parts, which can still be bought at auto parts stores, such as heavy duty shocks, ball joints, and police tires. I invested in all this stuff for my Vicky and it handles like a sports car, and rides like a Fleetwood.
As for parts otherwise, Crown Vics always have the option for interceptor parts, which can still be bought at auto parts stores, such as heavy duty shocks, ball joints, and police tires. I invested in all this stuff for my Vicky and it handles like a sports car, and rides like a Fleetwood.
