niv
Familiar Face
- Messages
- 51
- Location
- Austin, Texas
I broke horses when I was younger - miserable way to make a living, believe me. Family has a Ranch, so I'd have probably gone into that, especially if all of the Whisky Sampler jobs were taken.
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How would you earn a living?
- Thread starter Edm1
- Start date
Were I to enter the job market in the late 1930s, I'd surely be a shiny-pants bookkeeper, same as I am now. The only difference would be the tools I'd be using. Instead of a keyboard in front of me, there'd be books of ledger paper and literal spread sheets 13-column wide. All of that I know for a fact because that what I used when I started work in the early 1970s. I worked in two places that did not have computer-based accounting systems. There were some things about it that were better (the system never crashes) but I wouldn't go back to that for anything.
So instead of a computer with customers and vendors, you'd have boxes with ledger cards. Such a headache.
There'd be other differences, too. For one thing, I'd probably either walk to work (if I were still in my hometown) or take public transportation like Dagwood Bumstead, the one comic strip character I identify with more than any. And like Dagwood, I might not even have a car. I also might have to work half-a-day on Saturday, too. Then when the war came along, I'd probably get drafted, just like my father did, but hopefully not when I was as old as he was (he was 28 when he got drafted). Since I actually served in the army myself, I know they'd take me in any case, and that whatever I ended up doing in the army was probably not going to be what I was trained to do.
But before I got drafted and was still an office worker undoubtedly, I'd probably dress up more than I do now, as would everyone else. At lunchtime, I'd go to one of the main street diners, the 1930s equivalent of fast food. It would be packed, too, because "main street" was the economic hub of any town large and small. That's were the department stores, the banks, and all the little specialty shops that used to exist in those days were. Main Street was a crowded, busy place, full of life, and was for another 40 or 50 years, too.
Of course, I might not work on main street but rather in a plant or factory or "yard." In my hometown, that meant the railroad yard and shops. Before the war, between ten and fifteen percent of the population of the town worked in those shops, although not all the employees lived in town. But I still might walk to work, as did my grandfather (less than a mile). I'd still have to dress up, though.
I'd also have to pack a lunch since there were no convenient diners or cafeterias. But on the way home I could stop at one of the taverns near the train station. That was still a busy part of town, too. But fifteen years later when the trains no longer stopped, the center of activity had moved "uptown," (about four blocks away). By then the streetcars were gone, too.
Almost halfway between the train station and the big (and only) hotel, the Virginian, was a car dealer. They sold the cars that any ambitious white collar worker might aspire to own one day: Oldsmobile. But unhappily, like everything else I've mentioned, even Oldsmobile is gone. It is surely a sign of the end times.
Or maybe not. I didn't know anyone who had an Olds. We had Chevrolets, my uncles had either Fords or Pontiacs. One neighbor on the block had a Studebaker. Other people on the block had cars but I have no memories of the makes but some did not own a car and so they walked everywhere. But just about any place you probably needed to go was no more than three or four blocks away.
So instead of a computer with customers and vendors, you'd have boxes with ledger cards. Such a headache.
There'd be other differences, too. For one thing, I'd probably either walk to work (if I were still in my hometown) or take public transportation like Dagwood Bumstead, the one comic strip character I identify with more than any. And like Dagwood, I might not even have a car. I also might have to work half-a-day on Saturday, too. Then when the war came along, I'd probably get drafted, just like my father did, but hopefully not when I was as old as he was (he was 28 when he got drafted). Since I actually served in the army myself, I know they'd take me in any case, and that whatever I ended up doing in the army was probably not going to be what I was trained to do.
But before I got drafted and was still an office worker undoubtedly, I'd probably dress up more than I do now, as would everyone else. At lunchtime, I'd go to one of the main street diners, the 1930s equivalent of fast food. It would be packed, too, because "main street" was the economic hub of any town large and small. That's were the department stores, the banks, and all the little specialty shops that used to exist in those days were. Main Street was a crowded, busy place, full of life, and was for another 40 or 50 years, too.
Of course, I might not work on main street but rather in a plant or factory or "yard." In my hometown, that meant the railroad yard and shops. Before the war, between ten and fifteen percent of the population of the town worked in those shops, although not all the employees lived in town. But I still might walk to work, as did my grandfather (less than a mile). I'd still have to dress up, though.
I'd also have to pack a lunch since there were no convenient diners or cafeterias. But on the way home I could stop at one of the taverns near the train station. That was still a busy part of town, too. But fifteen years later when the trains no longer stopped, the center of activity had moved "uptown," (about four blocks away). By then the streetcars were gone, too.
Almost halfway between the train station and the big (and only) hotel, the Virginian, was a car dealer. They sold the cars that any ambitious white collar worker might aspire to own one day: Oldsmobile. But unhappily, like everything else I've mentioned, even Oldsmobile is gone. It is surely a sign of the end times.
Or maybe not. I didn't know anyone who had an Olds. We had Chevrolets, my uncles had either Fords or Pontiacs. One neighbor on the block had a Studebaker. Other people on the block had cars but I have no memories of the makes but some did not own a car and so they walked everywhere. But just about any place you probably needed to go was no more than three or four blocks away.
Inkstainedwretch
One Too Many
- Messages
- 1,037
- Location
- United States
I'd be writing for the pulps, which is pretty much what I do now. I'd probably use a series of pseudonyms for the different genres: western, sci-fi, Oriental adventure, modern war, etc. I'd keep my real name for my "serious" writing, which would probably never get published.
How much writing would a writer have to do, that is, what would the output have to be to actually earn a living writing pulp novels and adolescent or juvenile fiction? There were two or three dozen titles of series characters published from the 1920s up into the 1970s and that was a lot of writing. It could be called a golden era of juvenile fiction and perhaps a golden age for being a boy or girl, too, for that matter.
A related field would be script or screenplay writing. Motion pictures were turned out week after week even by the small studios. Of course, that continues in the form of television. I recall someone describing the work of composers who produced background music for movies as being paid by the yard. It was also a period, up until the war at least, when it was apparently easier to get a job as a musician, that being the time of the big band.
It goes without saying that skill and talent were required for every occupation.
A related field would be script or screenplay writing. Motion pictures were turned out week after week even by the small studios. Of course, that continues in the form of television. I recall someone describing the work of composers who produced background music for movies as being paid by the yard. It was also a period, up until the war at least, when it was apparently easier to get a job as a musician, that being the time of the big band.
It goes without saying that skill and talent were required for every occupation.
Inkstainedwretch
One Too Many
- Messages
- 1,037
- Location
- United States
It was possible to make a decent living during the Depression writing for the pulps, but you had to write fast and you had to write a lot. Pay was low but so was the cost of living. This led to the same story being rewritten multiple times in differing settings. It could be a cowboys-and-Indians tale for the westerns, a spacemen and aliens story for the sci-fi pulps, a Foreign-Legion vs. the Tuaregs story for the FL pulps, a Brit Adventurer -against-the wily Asians for the Oriental Adventure pulps, a Buccaneers-against-Spaniards for the seafaring pulps, and on and on. Robert E. Howard, Texas pulp writer, had the highest income in town and supported himself and his parents with the hundreds of stories he wrote in most of the genres. Famous now for his Conan stories, he wrote far more boxing stories for the sports pulps and was best known locally for his westerns. Frederick Faust actually got quite wealthy writing for the pulps. Best known for his westerns written under the name Max Brand (he also wrote the Dr. Kildare stories under that name) nobody has ever compiled a list of all his pseudonyms. He was saving his real name for his real art, which was epic poetry. Alas, he lived in an era with little taste for epic poetry. Robert A. Heinlein in his early years sometimes filled an entire issue of Astounding with his stories, each under a different name. Not many people had the imagination or stamina for that kind of writing, though.
vitanola
I'll Lock Up
- Messages
- 4,254
- Location
- Gopher Prairie, MI
I'd be a good fit in the radio business. Now of course I consider the "era", so-called to be the period between the Spanish War and WWII. I am intimately familiar with the art and the science of that business, from the Wireless era up to the days of television. Am a pretty good and fast trouble-shooter and a decent technician, so radio repair and installation work would be an option, though a rather poorly paid one.
I could easily work in engineering at a radio manufacturer, or perhaps a radio station. Then later on there would always be talking picture and public address work.
In addition, my work in the telephone industry might serve me in good stead. I can troubleshoot outside plant, both open wire and cable lines. Was taught to splice and clear trouble in dry core cable, so might be able to work as a cableman. Early in my career I maintained Western Electric 701 step-by-step Private Branch telephone eXchanges, and so would be able to hit the ground running at servicing the 355A step central office equipment. My radio background would probably allow me to quickly pick up the skills necessary to maintain Long Lines repeaters and carrier equipment.
A job working for the Bell System would be a good bet, for crafts jobs were well paid and steady. They included things such as paid sick leave, vacation, disability insurance and a pension. A senior switch man or Long Lines man would make about $2800 a year back in the 1920's. These jobs were available all across the country in medium sized towns and big cities. These wages would allow a fairly pleasant though modest life, and would allow one to save money for emergencies. In a city like Cleveland, Indianapolis, or Detroit one could easily afford a three-bedroom house in a pleasant neighborhood, decent food and clothing (though the distaff members of the household would still have to make their own wash and house dresses), church membership, lodge membership, weekly attendance at a neighborhood picture show, weekly attendance at a Vaudeville or First Run house, outside laundry service at a Steam Laundry (which takes an immense load off of the housewife), and the ownership of a modest automobile, say a three-year-old Dodge Brothers or a Whippet. A little side work, say repairing and installing radios would bring in an additional twenty or so dollars a month to ease any budgetary tightness.
This would be a good Depression-proof job. During the economic collapse the Bell System engaged in little retrenchment, opting instead to keep their skilled tradesmen employed in system modernization. The big change to machine switching took place in the 1930's.
I could easily work in engineering at a radio manufacturer, or perhaps a radio station. Then later on there would always be talking picture and public address work.
In addition, my work in the telephone industry might serve me in good stead. I can troubleshoot outside plant, both open wire and cable lines. Was taught to splice and clear trouble in dry core cable, so might be able to work as a cableman. Early in my career I maintained Western Electric 701 step-by-step Private Branch telephone eXchanges, and so would be able to hit the ground running at servicing the 355A step central office equipment. My radio background would probably allow me to quickly pick up the skills necessary to maintain Long Lines repeaters and carrier equipment.
A job working for the Bell System would be a good bet, for crafts jobs were well paid and steady. They included things such as paid sick leave, vacation, disability insurance and a pension. A senior switch man or Long Lines man would make about $2800 a year back in the 1920's. These jobs were available all across the country in medium sized towns and big cities. These wages would allow a fairly pleasant though modest life, and would allow one to save money for emergencies. In a city like Cleveland, Indianapolis, or Detroit one could easily afford a three-bedroom house in a pleasant neighborhood, decent food and clothing (though the distaff members of the household would still have to make their own wash and house dresses), church membership, lodge membership, weekly attendance at a neighborhood picture show, weekly attendance at a Vaudeville or First Run house, outside laundry service at a Steam Laundry (which takes an immense load off of the housewife), and the ownership of a modest automobile, say a three-year-old Dodge Brothers or a Whippet. A little side work, say repairing and installing radios would bring in an additional twenty or so dollars a month to ease any budgetary tightness.
This would be a good Depression-proof job. During the economic collapse the Bell System engaged in little retrenchment, opting instead to keep their skilled tradesmen employed in system modernization. The big change to machine switching took place in the 1930's.
green papaya
One Too Many
- Messages
- 1,261
- Location
- California, usa
Interesting that you mentioned "Steam Laundry." My father worked for such a laundry as a route man for about eighteen years. My next-door neighbor and one of my aunts also worked there. I don't know how many worked there but one source said it was the second largest employer in town. It had been established well before WWI. All of the machinery, and there was a lot of it, looked to be that old, too. My father drove a truck and did pickup and delivery door to door. That was before wash and wear and dress standards were somewhat higher.
Educational standards, however, were somewhat lower. My father never went to high school. He worked for the laundry starting after he was discharged from the army in 1945. He also drove a truck before the war, hauling logs for a sawmill that was owned by one of his brothers. Family connections always help.
I mentioned that I'd probably be doing the same thing I am now, more or less, working in an office keeping the books. But one difference might be that I probably wouldn't have gone to college to be able to do that. High school business classes would probably have been sufficient to get me started in bookkeeping. I probably would never have worked for either a CPA or an MBA as I do now but merely stayed busy keeping up the ledgers, all by hand, with or without eyeshade and sleeve protectors. But I definitely would have worn a suit and a hat to work.
Educational standards, however, were somewhat lower. My father never went to high school. He worked for the laundry starting after he was discharged from the army in 1945. He also drove a truck before the war, hauling logs for a sawmill that was owned by one of his brothers. Family connections always help.
I mentioned that I'd probably be doing the same thing I am now, more or less, working in an office keeping the books. But one difference might be that I probably wouldn't have gone to college to be able to do that. High school business classes would probably have been sufficient to get me started in bookkeeping. I probably would never have worked for either a CPA or an MBA as I do now but merely stayed busy keeping up the ledgers, all by hand, with or without eyeshade and sleeve protectors. But I definitely would have worn a suit and a hat to work.
- Messages
- 17,271
- Location
- New York City
As a college kid in the '80s, I had a bunch of jobs and did pretty well at all of them because I (1) showed up on time every day, (2) worked hard, (3) thought proactively of how I could help / do a better job, (4) didn't complain and (5) got better at what I was doing. In every situation - loading doc, warehouse, retailer, etc., I was offered more work, a raise, a position in management or supervision pretty much without asking - and within months of starting.
I'm am no genius or anything like that, but points 1 - 5 above clearly distinguished me in these entry level / minimum (or near minimum) wage jobs. And the one I stayed the longest at - retailing - led to an unsolicited offer for a management training program. All of that led me to believe that I could always earn a living (a fear I have to this day) just by doing points 1 - 5 somewhere / at some establishment.
The nagging fear I've always had in the back of my mind is that in another Depression scenario, where workers abound and people are desperate for jobs..any job, would I be able to stand out. I was able to, IMHO, because, by the '80s, the will to work hard at low-paying jobs wasn't there for a lot of Americans - at least that's what I saw time and again. But if people got desperate again, would my, IMHO, not particularly special work ethic / skills (points 1 - 5 above) really distinguish me? I think not.
Effectively, how much harder would it be to succeed - get, keep and advance in a job - in a Depression scenario? Kind of a variation on the theme of our thread question.
I'm am no genius or anything like that, but points 1 - 5 above clearly distinguished me in these entry level / minimum (or near minimum) wage jobs. And the one I stayed the longest at - retailing - led to an unsolicited offer for a management training program. All of that led me to believe that I could always earn a living (a fear I have to this day) just by doing points 1 - 5 somewhere / at some establishment.
The nagging fear I've always had in the back of my mind is that in another Depression scenario, where workers abound and people are desperate for jobs..any job, would I be able to stand out. I was able to, IMHO, because, by the '80s, the will to work hard at low-paying jobs wasn't there for a lot of Americans - at least that's what I saw time and again. But if people got desperate again, would my, IMHO, not particularly special work ethic / skills (points 1 - 5 above) really distinguish me? I think not.
Effectively, how much harder would it be to succeed - get, keep and advance in a job - in a Depression scenario? Kind of a variation on the theme of our thread question.
LizzieMaine
Bartender
- Messages
- 33,837
- Location
- Where The Tourists Meet The Sea
In the pit of the actual Depression, say 1931-33, getting a job was something accomplished against brutal competition. Men and women mobbed outside factory gates morning after morning in hopes of getting any jobs that might be available, and when the Soviet Union's Amtorg Trading Corporation advertised in New York in August of 1931 for Americans interested in filling 6000 job openings for skilled labor in the USSR, over 100,000 applicants showed up. If a hundred thousand people in 1931 were begging for a chance to move to the Soviet Union on the promise of a job, you can imagine the conditions that motivated them.
As for keeping a job once you got it, the principle of "You see those people out there outside the fence? Any one of them would kill for your job" was widely followed by many employers. Screw up, and you're done. Wage freezes and across-the-board pay cuts were also the rule in many operations during these years -- and you were expected to bow and scrape in the face of these and be grateful you still had a job.
As for keeping a job once you got it, the principle of "You see those people out there outside the fence? Any one of them would kill for your job" was widely followed by many employers. Screw up, and you're done. Wage freezes and across-the-board pay cuts were also the rule in many operations during these years -- and you were expected to bow and scrape in the face of these and be grateful you still had a job.
I've had jobs where there were salary cuts because of business conditions, although the owner's income didn't fall.
Different individuals have both different expectations and different needs. A man with a family clearly has greater needs than an unmarried worker and is much less flexible as far as changing jobs or changing locations. That's always been true, of course. I don't think it's generally realize that in many places, workers really have little choice as far as work goes. There were such things as company towns where everyone depended on one employer or a small number of employers in the same industry who were in reality very close to one another for some purposes even though they were otherwise very competitive. One object of most businesses was to do everything possible to reduce any collective power the workers had and that included both violence and the threat of violence. The idea that an individuall could in any way negotiate his own employment to his benefit is laughable.
Different individuals have both different expectations and different needs. A man with a family clearly has greater needs than an unmarried worker and is much less flexible as far as changing jobs or changing locations. That's always been true, of course. I don't think it's generally realize that in many places, workers really have little choice as far as work goes. There were such things as company towns where everyone depended on one employer or a small number of employers in the same industry who were in reality very close to one another for some purposes even though they were otherwise very competitive. One object of most businesses was to do everything possible to reduce any collective power the workers had and that included both violence and the threat of violence. The idea that an individuall could in any way negotiate his own employment to his benefit is laughable.
LizzieMaine
Bartender
- Messages
- 33,837
- Location
- Where The Tourists Meet The Sea
And that's why the strikes of the 1930s were so violent. There came a time when marching around carrying signs wasn't enough. Eventually the workers had to put down the picket signs and pick up blackjacks -- and aim them at the heads of cops, finks and goons -- in order to get their grievances addressed. The five day week, paid vacations, and workplace safety laws were bought with blood.
Walter Reuther and Richard Frankensteen of the UAW, after a nice, rational discussion with Harry Bennett's goons at Ford, May 1937.
Nobert
Practically Family
- Messages
- 832
- Location
- In the Maine Woods
Yes, it seems as though there would be more money in fixing horses.*
I might make a stab at being a commercial artist, back when there was such a thing.
*Take that however your mind desires.
Tiki Tom
My Mail is Forwarded Here
- Messages
- 3,408
- Location
- Oahu, North Polynesia
Is this within the rules laid out by the OP? To try to land a contract with the US Military to provide handy pamphlets to GIs on French, German, and Italian (not to mention British!) customs and manners, including helpful phrases?
With the proceeds I'd invest in beachfront property in Florida.
With the proceeds I'd invest in beachfront property in Florida.
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Respectfully disagree - The Army published a lot of language phrasebooks, guidebooks, and etc. during WWII. As one example, the War Department put out a small booklet entitled "A Pocket Guide to France" prior to the D-Day invasion. Another later one was "Paris - Guide to Leave Troops".
These were more leisure-oriented.
There were also official Technical Manuals (TM), such as TM 30-255 "War Department - Military Dictionary English-German, German-English, August 5, 1941"
"Stars and Stripes" also had suggestions for handy French phrases:
"Allons Nous Amuser"
pronounced: Allanoose AmewZAY
"Let's go have some fun."
There might be a job opportunity in producing the more leisure-oriented booklets. Some of them had some vivid, well-done art work on the covers.
I was born an engineer and will die an engineer in the modern era, so I'd likely also be an engineer in the Golden Era. Assuming we could carry our interests/capabilities/qualifications with us, I'd look for an aeronautical engineering design job with Boeing (B-17, B-29), Republic (P-47), or Lockheed (P-38). Any of those would be great to work on.
By coincidence, I met Major Alexander P. de Seversky, founder of Republic Aviation, in the 1970's. Perhaps he would remember me in advance and give me a job at Republic working on the P-47 Thunderbolt. (Major de Seversky wrote the influential book, "Victory Through Air Power", which was later made by Disney into an animated feature of the same name advocating a strategic air force.)
Teaching/academics would also be a possibility, as I'm doing now. However, in those days it was almost all teaching and not as much research, so it would not be as much fun.
By coincidence, I met Major Alexander P. de Seversky, founder of Republic Aviation, in the 1970's. Perhaps he would remember me in advance and give me a job at Republic working on the P-47 Thunderbolt. (Major de Seversky wrote the influential book, "Victory Through Air Power", which was later made by Disney into an animated feature of the same name advocating a strategic air force.)
Teaching/academics would also be a possibility, as I'm doing now. However, in those days it was almost all teaching and not as much research, so it would not be as much fun.
LizzieMaine
Bartender
- Messages
- 33,837
- Location
- Where The Tourists Meet The Sea
Writing for radio consumed a great deal of material, and the industry's appetite was insatiable. The script for a typical fifteen-minute/five-a-week dialogue program containing about ten minutes of actual program content ran about four single-spaced pages a day, or about 1800 words a day. The most common programs of this type, soap operas, were literally churned out on an assembly line, in a bullpen full of writers who kept grinding the stuff out day after mind-numbing day. Those writers who owned their own programs and wrote them themselves had to get up every day and bang out a script, four pages, 1800 words, every single weekday whether they felt in the mood or not. The maw had to be fed.
There were some radio writers who could stand with the greatest names in American literature had they worked in a more permanent medium. Paul Rhymer, of "Vic and Sade," was as worthy of a place on a shelf as Mark Twain or George Ade. But most radio writers, especially in the dialogue field, were hacks, and nursed no illusions about being anything else.
Writing radio comedy was even more difficult. Comedians were notorious for chewing up writers and spitting them out, and many writers did it the lazy way, by maintaining huge card catalogs of jokes. They'd decide what the program's setting or topic would be, go thru the files for twenty or thirty jokes relating to that subject, string them together, stick musical interludes between them, and that would be the show. These were the types of writers who tended to get bounced around a lot. The comedy writers who really cared about the quality of the material were among the best-paid people in radio, and they could have their pick of the top jobs -- if they could manage to claw their way out of the slush pile and get noticed.
Inkstainedwretch
One Too Many
- Messages
- 1,037
- Location
- United States
I've seen one printed for GIs going to Britain in preparation for D-Day. It had such advice as, "The British can't make a decent cup of coffee, but you don't know how to make a decent cup of tea." Also: "Don't say 'I feel like a dirty bum.' It means something different to the British."
