How clearly do we really see 30s/40s/50s Style?

[Harp]

Hard Times

I'll second Elaina's observation about hard times and the lessons taught.
My grandmother was fond of telling a story about the Depression era
small dinner she gave for $1.00, which included a trip to her neighborhood
butcher right down to the flowers she picked from a vacant prairie lot.
People certainly struggled to keep up appearances; never forgetting the
bad times, and imparted hard earned wisdom to future generations.

 

[deanglen]

There I was, 13 years old, with a copy of the Ballentine Illustrated History of World War II series, the volume on Pearl Harbor. There was a convention of Pearl Harbor Veterans meeting at the Park Place Hotel in Traverse City, MI where I grew up. I got the great idea to take the book to the hotel and have some of the veterans autograph it. This was 1971. I went to the hotel lobby, book in hand, and waited to see if some of the veterans passing through would sign it.. I went up to one gentleman who had one of those VFW overseas caps with embroidered script that indicated he had been at Pearl Harbor. I asked him if he would sigbn the book for me. I'll never forget what he said.
"Why the *&^% would you want that?!" he growled, "Worst @#$%^&* day of my life. I lost my best *^&%#$#& friend that day." but he signed it anyway. I felt horrible, but even so, I tried two more times, and got three autographs. The other men were friendly, as I remember. But that first guy, his tone was angry. The generation that fought WWII and the Vietnam generation might have more in common than we think?

dean

 

[Twitch]

Great observation Matt! If we were to look back in just a year at what the media has chronicled we'd probably see tons of errors and inappropriate fashion that they touted as mainstream when in fact it was just hype.

I'm surprised at candid shots from past eras showing the vast majority of men wearing fedoras but in clothing other than dress suits. Men wore them and as they drove trucks, played cards, and went about daily activities or all sorts. Yet we tend to picture Bogart, Cary Grant, Clark Gable or Dick Powell in a movie role as our mental example of "how it was."

I got a picture of my Grandpa sitting outside a shed in Van Buren, Arkansas in the 50s with a fedora but no suit so...[huh]

 

[Etienne]

These are some very provocative posts. My grandparents were born in the late 1800's and my parents in the 20's. They lived through the Great Depression and the wars and were people of simple means. While I never really observed an attitude of maintaining appearances, I can say with certainty that a couple of the pet phrases around our home were, "Save it for good!" and, "Make do with it." Sadly, I think they never realized that the "everyday" was as good as it was ever going to get, and many things got saved and saved and never used. (Which may be why it's just the opposite in my home today! My most honored guests are my own little family--and we always use ALL the good stuff.) But I learned thriftiness and ingenuity from "making do" so I think it balanced out! I will have to sit down soon and get better at posting pictures so I can share some. I have several thousand photos dating all the way back to my great, great grandparents, many in everyday settings--fishing, picnicing, skiing, dressed up in costumes for school, etc. Wonderful!!

 

[mmeckel]

Dressing Up in The 1950s

Dear WR and Everyone,

Thank you very much for your warm welcome. I find myself feeling very much at ease and comfortable in your Lounge.

I must admit, dressing up during the 1950s was a major project. Women looking back upon those years respond with differing attitudes and ideas.

Some consider that decade as one of severe oppression, hypocrisy, and enforced conformity. Others fondly remember the 1950s as good years when women knew how to dress and behave respectfully and in good taste.

Some aspects of dressing up and getting around were challenging and even humorous. Imagine this: Trying to get into a car with a piled high bee hive hair style, wearing a pencil slim skirt or dress without kick pleats, wearing three inch spiked, high heels with needle nosed toes. We actually danced when dressed like this.

We did figure out how to handle this problem of getting into a car. We sat down back side or butt first and then we'd swing our legs around, to get in position.

At times just about everything hurt from your too tight clamp on earrings to your squished up feet, not to mention everything in between. Just walking was difficult, but getting into a car was another matter.

Air conditioning wasn't common place until the mid-1950s, so we had additional problems and became very inventive. During the worst heat of the summer, we'd use pancake make up and power on our legs instead of wearing those hot, nylon stockings. Then, the trick was to use an eyebrow pencil to draw on the seams of our stocking.

Another trick was putting wet wash cloths into the freezer for a while and then blotting our faces to set our facial make up. During the mid-fifties, we wore 7 can can slips, which had been starched, under our full dresses and skirts. I even had at least one skirt with a hoop. It wasn't easy to sit down or get into a car at all gracefully when dressed this way, either.

I must say, at home air conditioning made a big difference, with more than a few intentional and unintentional consequences.

Fondly,

Mary M.
*********************************************************


WR said:

"Very well said... and very true! Great first post I must say! Welcome to the Lounge, we're happy to have yet another new face!

I like your whole post but, the last part struck me... most girls today get all fussy about just doing something with their hair... they have no idea what work went into going out only 50 years ago."

=WR=
__________________
Wrong is wrong even if every one says it's right.
Right is right even if every one else says it's wrong. -Hugh Beaumont

 

[BigSleep]

There is a lot of discussion on the forum about fabrics of old. But, I remember as a kid (Late 60s & 70s) my mom talking about how much they loved polyester. And I'm talking about that thick plastic stuff. This was a generation that had to starch and iron EVERYTHING. They loved the ease of the "new" fabrics.

I remember hating it and how happy I was when I discovered Banana Republic (the cool one not the one we have now). It was just about the only place you could get a pair of khakis believe it or not.

Another thing I've been thinking about is how much clothes we have compared to the golden era. Most people had just a handful of clothes unless they were well off.

Anyone remember parents or grandparents talking about the rag man? This was a guy that came around colecting old pieces of cloth for rags. Remember this was a time before paper towels.

Just some thoughts.

 

[John in Covina]

Rose colored glasses.

Grandpa Simpson: "We all used to wear onions on our belts back then, it was the style."

You can figure that the movies of the time were probably skewed to present a stylized interpetation. Magazines were scewed to presenting the designers ideas. Even the Sears catalog pushed what the buyers were pushing. There is probably some type of scew in a lot of the media, but the question is how far from reality does it go.

I think that snapshots have less skewing if they are the travel type. A visit to the big city or a visit to the country type. Holiday pictures represents Holiday events and dress. You need to remember when people would dress as they would on an ordinary day versus a dress up day. Such as a farm hand would be in work clothes but possibly in a suit and tie for Sunday, Holidays or events. So wedding pictures would not be indicative of everyday dress.

I am reminded of a story of a painter, about a hundred years ago painted a copy of "the Last Supper" and had painted cigar cutters on the table. (That would give a whole different take on Communion!)

SIncerely,

 

[RedShoesGirl]

...It's the view of women who loved hard and stupid, who were too progressive for their time and who were going to look like they had money even if it killed them.

you have described my mother to a T. what a wonderful way with words you have.

lara

 

[Lauren]

Just popping in. I think my images of what it was really like came from family photos and home movies. Movies never are what things were like. But this book about Hollywood and it's effect on fashion is very interesting and I highly recommend it:
Screen Style: Fashion and Femininity in 1930s Hollywood

 

[happyfilmluvguy]

I could imagine the 20th Century was exactly like our day and age with the exceptions of some of the techincal breakthroughs we've been having. You can't say the 50's were full of innocence and the good and happy because I can doubt any day and age was. Watching "Leave it to Beaver" won't give you a very good perpective of the 50's.

I would believe that people didn't sit at a certain object like a computer, though they did have a typewriter. They wrote letters to one another, probably getting more mail in their mailbox than we probably do now a days.

I've always heard they would go to the picture show once a week, usually the weekend, and probably ate out depending on their finances or the reason of doing so. Kids after school probably did just the same as any kid would do. Play a sport, or do homework, different things depending on the person. I wouldn't think that any age was very different than ours. Nothing is simple, even the past.

Even they had difficulties.

 

[The Wolf]

good question

I think Loungers dress in different "old styles". Some of us prefer the Hollywood look that the movies showed us, some wear only vintage, some go for the "feeling' of the '30s or '40s.
I think serials and low budget movies fairly accurately show how people dressed or how shops or living rooms looked. I look at magazines of the time, movies and all sorts of stuff. I also pick clothes I like and just go with it.

I don't know if that answered your question.[huh]

Sincerely,
The Wolf

 

[Matt Crunk]

Younger women often look astonished when I mention that pantyhose didn't exist until the 1960s. Moreover, the nylon stockings we wore had seams! No joke. Making sure your seams were straight was actually a matter of concern. I won't even mention the dress code of the times, nor the necessity of wearing a girdle, no matter how thin you were. After all, your back side or butt was not supposed to wiggle.

I actually like the way the lines ran up the back of the stockings. Vintage stockings are much sexier than pantyhose ever were. Pantyhose in fact look pretty silly and unattractive when you see them worn alone.

-MC

 

[20thCenturyTim]

How about how society in general sees this period's style?

Speaking for myself (and not peering through rose colored glasses) most
of modern 'culture' cannot favorably compare with that of the Golden Era;
which, seen through a pragmatic prism is hardly a utopian period,
but a time when standards still existed.

Harp's statement was excellent. I think for myself and perhaps many others, this is the attitude. I see the styles, music and culture in an almost utopian like nostaliga. I know this was far from the truth, but in this crazy present age, it helps to idealize those times, in order to deal with the present. I learned about the Golden Era most from my late mother, young child of the depression, teenager of the war, by the way.

My point is that I see today the culture of the "golden era," especially in terms of fashion, sometimes taken to warped extremes. Certian areas of culture have just used it and thrown out any standards of taste and decorum. How excited I was when I discovered the FL and saw how many people are sincere about emulating taste and attitiude. The last post I read here from the gentleman in Alabama about women in seamed stockings was interesting. Because, I had just finished reading about some of the women here who get scary, leering looks from men when wearing them. Well, let's think about it. What has modern society done to this simple affectation of style? They pervert it. It is seen as something prosititutes wear or as something you wear only in the bedroom to get your man going without viagra. I rarely see them, but yeah I find them alluring, and I also find them the height of feminine style and class. I "get it," when I see a woman in vintage style wearing them.

Another area of incredible annoyance is the tattoo craze and how that somehow tattoos on women are some how "retro," looking. Men too, ack! Ok, I won't rant on, that's for another thread. Again, I think it is more of a question of how the general public precieves "vintage," and "retro," rather than those like FLers. I think it is different. The true vintage subculture respects the past, the rest are clueless or affect some sort of weird mutation of it. I admire all of you here who continue to hold a candle to treating people with kindness and courtesy and looking "swell," while doing it. Tim

 

[mmeckel]

More About Fabrics

There is a lot of discussion on the forum about fabrics of old. But, I remember as a kid (Late 60s & 70s) my mom talking about how much they loved polyester. And I'm talking about that thick plastic stuff. This was a generation that had to starch and iron EVERYTHING. They loved the ease of the "new" fabrics.


Greetings to Everyone:

Big Sleep mentioned the appearance of polyester. This fabric certainly did arrive with a smash! I had a hearty dislike for it myself, even though it didn't require ironing. Ironing used to be a huge job. We'd wrap some cloths in wet towels before we ironed them to assist in eliminating wrinkles.

Still, that was better than my grandma's day when women placed big, heavy irons on the stove before they ironed. Can you imagine? I was told that women had little pieces of fabric to use as testers to avoid scorting. That's one smell I'll never forget -- the odor of scorched cloth.

I certainly do remember hearing talk about the Rag Man. Nope, we didn't have paper towels, sandwich bags or plastic wrap.

I was born in 1941, so I really wasn't a baby boomer I've always taken a great deal of kidding, because I can remember the World War II days, at least in part. The frequent comment is that I'm putting everyone on, or that I'm lying about my age. <huge laugh>

At any rate, the discussion about fabrics reminded me of the scarcity of nylon stockings during the WW II era. I may be wrong, but I think my mother told me that women wore rayon stockings back at that time as a substitute.

I had a brother who worked as a paper boy (the term of that era). Once in a while, one of the big department stores would provide a coupon through the news paper that provided a discount on genuine nylon stockings.

You can imagine what happened. Some less than ethical people would follow the paper boys around town and steal the news papers to get the coupons. As a result, the news papers were getting lots of telephone calls, because customers found their papers missing.

Mary Meckel

 

[mmeckel]

Stockings with Seams

I actually like the way the lines ran up the back of the stockings. Vintage stockings are much sexier than pantyhose ever were. Pantyhose in fact look pretty silly and unattractive when you see them worn alone.

-MC

Hi Matt and Everyone,

A good many men and women have voiced this opinion. Men thought they were sexier and women knew that the seams in their nylons were slimming. We wore some rather stylish seams during the late 1950s and early 1960s. The seams had small designs of one kind or another.

You're undoubtedly correct about the pantyhose, from a male point of view. In the mid to late 1960s, when women were no longer forced to feel that a girdle was mandatory, no matter how slim she was, the garter belt was reborn. Frankly, it was almost a necessity. Skirts and dresses became shorter and shorter and pantyhose weren't around until about the mid
1960s.


That generated a great deal of laughter and some raised eye brows. I think the vision of a women in a fancy garter belt has been regarded as extremely sexy by men. Is this still correct, or has the garter belt just faded away?

love and laughter,

Mary M.

 

[mmeckel]

technological changes

I could imagine the 20th Century was exactly like our day and age with the exceptions of some of the technical breakthroughs we've been having. You can't say the 50's were full of innocence and the good and happy because I can doubt any day and age was. Watching "Leave it to Beaver" won't give you a very good perspective of the 50's.

I would believe that people didn't sit at a certain object like a computer, though they did have a typewriter. They wrote letters to one another, probably getting more mail in their mailbox than we probably do now a days.

I've always heard they would go to the picture show once a week, usually the weekend, and probably ate out depending on their finances or the reason of doing so. Kids after school probably did just the same as any kid would do. Play a sport, or do homework, different things depending on the person. I wouldn't think that any age was very different than ours. Nothing is simple, even the past.

Even they had difficulties.

Greetings,

You're absolutely right. Nothing is simple. Moreover, for all good things there are trade offs. Sadly enough, these trade offs aren't entirely attractive or healthy.

You bet, we did have difficulties. Don't ever let us (I'm a 65 year old grandma) kid you. The old days weren't altogether good. We had a good many problems. The cold war drained everyone emotionally. Further, the rate of intolerance was shameful. We like to see the 1950s as simple, in retrospect, but that era, like any other, was fraught with difficulties.

I do think that technological breakthroughs made an incredible difference. I'm old enough to remember the pre-television era, when we only had radio as an entertainment device in the home.

Silly as this may sound, I think the advent of television and then home air conditioning dramatically affected our lifestyle. More and more people were staying inside, sealed up. This resulted in less and less sitting out on the front porch and neighboring. Air conditioning meant all windows and doors had to be closed. I'm afraid family members interacted less with each other, as well.

In some respects, television has opened up another entire dimension, however there are the obvious limitations. Kids spend less time outside playing and as we all know, this has affected their health. Sitting glued to the television or computer without outside activities isn't an altogether great idea.

I can't even begin to explain how the appearance of the computer seems to have revolutionized life in almost every dimension. We certainly did type a good many letters. Indeed, letters written in cursive or long hand were flat out mandatory for some kinds of communication, i.e., hand written envelopes for wedding invitations, Christmas cards (inside personal notes were hand written), sympathy cards and the all important thank you cards. Of course, this was a very time consuming set of responsibilities.

I've already talked too much, so I turn the discussion back over to you. Thanks.

Love, Light and Laughter,

Mary M.

 

[happyfilmluvguy]

Greetings,

You're absolutely right. Nothing is simple. Moreover, for all good things there are trade offs. Sadly enough, these trade offs aren't entirely attractive or healthy.

You bet, we did have difficulties. Don't ever let us (I'm a 65 year old grandma) kid you. The old days weren't altogether good. We had a good many problems. The cold war drained everyone emotionally. Further, the rate of intolerance was shameful. We like to see the 1950s as simple, in retrospect, but that era, like any other, was fraught with difficulties.

I do think that technological breakthroughs made an incredible difference. I'm old enough to remember the pre-television era, when we only had radio as an entertainment device in the home.

Silly as this may sound, I think the advent of television and then home air conditioning dramatically affected our lifestyle. More and more people were staying inside, sealed up. This resulted in less and less sitting out on the front porch and neighboring. Air conditioning meant all windows and doors had to be closed. I'm afraid family members interacted less with each other, as well.

In some respects, television has opened up another entire dimension, however there are the obvious limitations. Kids spend less time outside playing and as we all know, this has affected their health. Sitting glued to the television or computer without outside activities isn't an altogether great idea.

I can't even begin to explain how the appearance of the computer seems to have revolutionized life in almost every dimension. We certainly did type a good many letters. Indeed, letters written in cursive or long hand were flat out mandatory for some kinds of communication, i.e., hand written envelopes for wedding invitations, Christmas cards (inside personal notes were hand written), sympathy cards and the all important thank you cards. Of course, this was a very time consuming set of responsibilities.

I've already talked too much, so I turn the discussion back over to you. Thanks.

Love, Light and Laughter,

Mary M.

Darn you, technology! (shakes fist)

But back on topic. I think the perspective on the lifestyle, depending on the age, depends on who you were, and who you were around. I live in a middle class neighborhood, and they act middle class. Nice homes, safe neighborhood, interestingly nice people, friendly in some cases. I kind of looked at the ages as being much friendlier, you all knew one another in one way or another, then again, it all depends on who you were and who you were around. That's really how any day and age is. But an everyday life is different for us all, as for let's say the 30's, or the 40's.

To Miss Mary, what was your lifestyle like, without explaining other types of lifestyles you may have come across. What was a regular day like for you?

 

[mmeckel]

Typical Day in 40s, 50s,60s

QUOTE=happyfilmluvguy]Darn you, technology! (shakes fist)

But back on topic. I think the perspective on the lifestyle, depending on the age, depends on who you were, and who you were around. I live in a middle class neighborhood, and they act middle class. Nice homes, safe neighborhood, interestingly nice people, friendly in some cases. I kind of looked at the ages as being much friendlier, you all knew one another in one way or another, then again, it all depends on who you were and who you were around. That's really how any day and age is. But an everyday life is different for us all, as for let's say the 30's, or the 40's.

To Miss Mary, what was your lifestyle like, without explaining other types of lifestyles you may have come across. What was a regular day like for you?[/QUOTE]




Dear Happy Film Guy,

OK, I'll simply dive in

I was born in 1941, and I graduated from high school in 1959. I've often insisted that I have a foot in two worlds. The '50s were very traditional and the '60s an era of dynamic change, often characterized by the student protests and the flower children.

I was in preschool until 1946 but I well remember the end of WWII and the death of President Franklin Roosevelt. I attended a nursery school, which I enjoyed very much. I remember shopping with my mother, and the rationing booklet everyone had to use during WWII. Most everything was very scarce, including sugar, meats, laundry soap and cigarettes.

After I started school, I was no doubt a typical grade school kid, aside from the fact that I drove most of my teachers crazy. My parents bought a TV set in 1951, but I can't say we used it very often. Of course, programing was very limited in those days.

By the time I was in Junior High, as we called it back at the time, I must admit I was probably a perfect brat. I'd take the bus to school, go to my classes and come home where I read a book of my choice, although we kids often talked on the telephone. Meals were prompt and the entire family ate together.

Evenings were consumed by home work, talking on the telephone, and an occasional TV program. Most of our parents insisted that all home work had to be completed before viewing any television programs.

On weekends, friends got together and played records. We would often save up some money so that we could buy the records we wanted. Radio was used extensively and provided all kinds of popular music and the popular songs were rated 1 to 10, with 1 being the most popular.

As a matter of fact, a popular radio program called the "Hit Parade," originated on radio and eventually aired on television. Some of us had stacks and stacks of 45 R.P.M. records. The RPM stood for 45 rotations per minute.

I'll have to admit that Jr. High was a time when most kids experimented with smoking cigarettes. We usually hid in some park and smoked one or two cigarettes we'd mooched from our parents. Of course, they didn't realize what we were up to.

Movies were often a weekend treat. At times, the entire family would attend and sometimes we attended with friends. During the 1950s, movies were regarded as a principle form of entertainment. You're totally right about eating out. Most family did eat out about once a week. It was during this era that the drive in places originated for fast food (we didn't have the term back then) where you could place your order and stay or take the food home.

I graduated from high school in 1959. In many respects, our school study and entertainment time wasn't very different from our Jr. high school days, although we had a great deal more home work than earlier.

However, by 15 most of us had driver's permits. By 16, many of the boys had very old, second hand cars; but it was unusual for a girl to have her own car. Boys would spend hours working on their cars, repairing them and keeping them shining.

Dating became extremely important and having a car provided a means of getting around and attending drive in movies, which were all the rage at that time. If boys didn't have their own car, they borrowed their Dad and Mom's.


The one car family wasn't unusual, it was quite common. The world was considerably different. Kids only had weekend jobs, for the most part, and activities were scheduled quite differently. Most, mothers didn't work, they stayed home.

These days, it isn't unusual for a family of three to have three cars, one for Dad, one for Mom and one for their kid. Often, all three (or more) family members are extremely busy, and three cars are a necessity.

I think I've chattered too much already, so I'll discuss the 1960s another time. I hope I've answered at least a few of your questions. Thanks for reading a very long post.

Sending All My Best,

Mary M.

 

[Tourbillion]

Elaina, this is excellent, excellent stuff. I'm going to be thinking about this for awhile. You've sort of opened a new door - was there a demand for dignity no matter the financial circumstances? Was 'hide the reality' also a northern Depression-era thing?
I keep thinking about the generation born in the early - mid 1920's. So much promise when they were young and so much exciting change was afoot, only to have it stolen time and again. From the Depression through WWII and the Cold War, capped by the 60's unrest and tragedy. We may call it the Golden Era, but it was also an era of many agonies. A century of almost inconceivable change.

My grandmother made sure her home was spotless. Mom also, though not so maniacally. And mine? always a struggle. But that seems quite rare today. Maybe it is related to a loss of that "going to look like they had money even if it killed them."

Thanks for a great post.

That generation is known as the GI or greatest generation. My dad was one of them, so I know them well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G.I._Generation

The G.I. Generation is the cohort of Americans born 1900-1925. They fought World War II, and then created the vanguard of the Baby Boom. The generation is also known as the Greatest Generation (after Tom Brokaw's book), the World War II Generation, the Veteran Generation, the Depression Generation, Builders, and the Traditional Generation or Traditionalists. The term "GI Generation" has been in common use since the 1970s.[1]

These are the people that this country (and also many European countries) great. They were totally up to the challenges of the times. They are called the greatest generation, because they were well...the greatest. Sometimes adversity adds character that ease just never will.

The boomers, the me generation and generation X just can't compare. See also the "Lost Generation" (those who came of age in the 30's).

The "Lost Generation" were said to be disillusioned by the large number of casualties of the First World War, cynical, disdainful of the Victorian notions of morality and propriety of their elders and ambivalent about Victorian gender ideals. Like most attempts to pigeon-hole entire generations, this over-generalization is true for some individuals of the generation and not true of others. It was somewhat common among members of this group to complain that American artistic culture lacked the breadth of European work—leading many members to spend large amounts of time in Europe—and/or that all topics worth treating in a literary work had already been covered. Nevertheless, this selfsame period saw an explosion in American literature and in art, which is now often considered to include some of the greatest literary classics produced by American writers. This generation also produced the first flowering of jazz music, arguably the first distinctly American art form.

 

[Miss Sis]

This is an interesting post.

My Nana was just about to go to Teaching College when the Depression hit in New Zealand. They closed the school to new entries and she had to do Bookkeeping instead. She came from a Scotish background and they are big on education and 'bettering' yourself. Her Aunt was a School Teacher and was a driving force behind all the girls in the family being able to support themselves. When my Grandfather was out of work in the 30s my Nana went out to work whilst he stayed home to look after my Uncle.
This really coloured my mother's upbringing. Her father died of Tuberculosis six weeks after my mother was born. My Nana had three children under the age of 7 and she had to work hard to keep them all going. She told me without her parents to help her she would not have been able to manage on the Widows Pension (luckily we had a progessive Labour Government who had introduced Social Welfare in the 30s) but they really did make an effort to look as good as possible. She told me about making trousers for my uncle out of old flour sacks, boiled and dyed and cutting down adults clothes to re-make things for the children. It certainly was a time to make do. This stood them in good stead for the war years when the same skills came to the fore.
My mother also inherited the same attitudes which she has passed to me. The old 'Cut your coat according to your cloth' or living within your means, saving a little from every pay for a rainy day, all the 'old' skills of sewing and knitting.
So, I know it wasn't all glamour, evening dresses and cocktails. But the same people who struggled with day to day life aspired to look like the rich and famous, like Movie stars, even if they had to save hard to buy material to make it themselves. They had self respect to look the best they could.