Horween USA and Aero Leather Joint Statement

[Paden]

The more I read the more I feel Aero should have kept quiet on this steerhide passing for horsehide scandal. So now they are going to refund decades worth of jackets because of one man who pocketed the difference in money for all those thousands of jackets? Justice would be having Will arrested and put in prison and have him pay all the refund costs until break-even point, but that is just unlikely. I would like to know what will happen to Will. I guess it would be 10 to 20 years in prison for him if caught and found guilty?

:eusa_doh:

30 years in prison? Boot camp, water and bread only?
Murder? Only in Russia or China you go to prison for this.
We are NOT in one of those countrys.
Better thinking, before writing.
Unbelivable!

 

[Rudie]

Well, I wouldn't be surprised if you got 10 or 20 years for this in the US. Doesn't sound too far-fetched to me. Surely not in Scotland, though.

 

[FAFOO68]

I think we should let the justice do her job

 

[wdw]

As it seems that a number of people suddenly left Aero, the reality is that the sudden loss of income (and reputation!) in a relatively deprived area in the middle of a recession will almost certainly outweigh any short-term gains that may have been made.

That alone will probably have a much more significant impact on their lives than the relatively lenient Scottish courts.

 

[Lungomare]

:eusa_doh:

30 years in prison? Boot camp, water and bread only?
Murder? Only in Russia or China you go to prison for this.
We are NOT in one of those countrys.
Better thinking, before writing.
Unbelivable!

Hi Paden!

Take it with a grain of salt and read this post with a suggestion of irony!

Regards,

Johannes

 

[caffeinated]

The more I read the more I feel Aero should have kept quiet on this steerhide passing for horsehide scandal. So now they are going to refund decades worth of jackets because of one man who pocketed the difference in money for all those thousands of jackets? Justice would be having Will arrested and put in prison and have him pay all the refund costs until break-even point, but that is just unlikely. I would like to know what will happen to Will. I guess it would be 10 to 20 years in prison for him if caught and found guilty?

I wouldn't get all carried away like that. I think the most likely scenario was not a deliberate scam. More likely just falling behind on orders and having more steer-hide on hand than horse, so...

Just a really poor decision made in the hope that none would be the wiser. And now the company is left to deal with the consequences. I really have sympathy for Ken and Holly and the rest who appear to just want to make a good product and give us what we want. But all this needs to be worked through.

 

[Paden]

It seems, at the end everbody will loose something.
The customer, the worker, Ken, Holly, Will, Amanda ect.
Very bad situation with lots of emotions from both sides, I guess.
Hopefully for all, they will find a objektively end.
Aero was (is) at the highest level of all time, with outstanding products and
a great team.Than it changed from one day to the other day.
Very intransparent at the moment.

 

[Vespizzare]

I don't know about you guys, but a few times I've worked at places where it came out that certain fellow employees were doing stuff that wasn't kosher to say the least. It reminds me of Miss Marple: any behavior or motive in the world can occur in an English village.

 

[Dr H]

OK, just one more post: English village?! :-S

 

[COLORADO]

:eusa_clap

You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I ask you to take the following into account.

The original post mentioned two people, Will and an un-named cutter, making steer-hide jackets and selling them as horse for just a year. Through the thread we came to find out that jackets had also been made with a mix of horse and steer and sold as horse. Now we are also hearing that whole jackets were made of steer and sold as horse earlier than we were first told. And just one page ago Aero confirmed that they don't know how long this has been going on, possibly for years. If the thread had been closed when people first started asking for it, we wouldn't have this information. Or at best we would all have had to email Aero directly and ask as individuals. Just in the last few pages, this thread has been quite valuable.

 

[COLORADO]

:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap

You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I ask you to take the following into account.

The original post mentioned two people, Will and an un-named cutter, making steer-hide jackets and selling them as horse for just a year. Through the thread we came to find out that jackets had also been made with a mix of horse and steer and sold as horse. Now we are also hearing that whole jackets were made of steer and sold as horse earlier than we were first told. And just one page ago Aero confirmed that they don't know how long this has been going on, possibly for years. If the thread had been closed when people first started asking for it, we wouldn't have this information. Or at best we would all have had to email Aero directly and ask as individuals. Just in the last few pages, this thread has been quite valuable.

 

[cuthbert]

The more I read the more I feel Aero should have kept quiet on this steerhide passing for horsehide scandal. So now they are going to refund decades worth of jackets because of one man who pocketed the difference in money for all those thousands of jackets? Justice would be having Will arrested and put in prison and have him pay all the refund costs until break-even point, but that is just unlikely. I would like to know what will happen to Will. I guess it would be 10 to 20 years in prison for him if caught and found guilty?

Gulag!Gulag!Gulag!Gulag!

:eusa_doh:

30 years in prison? Boot camp, water and bread only?
Murder? Only in Russia or China you go to prison for this.
We are NOT in one of those countrys.
Better thinking, before writing.
Unbelivable!

 

[dr.velociraptor]

Well, I wouldn't be surprised if you got 10 or 20 years for this in the US. Doesn't sound too far-fetched to me. Surely not in Scotland, though.

You're not serious are you? I assume you're just taking a pot shot at the US?

 

[apba1166]

I agree with this, below....you can't bottle stuff up in this day and age, the thread should go on...but I also am not interested in the people/blame/culprit issues....that will always be speculation. I AM interested in the jackets, leathers, and construction/build and even business aspects of the economies of the jackets and the leathers.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I ask you to take the following into account.

The original post mentioned two people, Will and an un-named cutter, making steer-hide jackets and selling them as horse for just a year. Through the thread we came to find out that jackets had also been made with a mix of horse and steer and sold as horse. Now we are also hearing that whole jackets were made of steer and sold as horse earlier than we were first told. And just one page ago Aero confirmed that they don't know how long this has been going on, possibly for years. If the thread had been closed when people first started asking for it, we wouldn't have this information. Or at best we would all have had to email Aero directly and ask as individuals. Just in the last few pages, this thread has been quite valuable.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Statement by Skip Horween (President, Horween, USA) and Ken Calder (Chairman of Aero Leather Clothing Ltd (“Aero Leather”).

It has been brought to our attention that Will Lauder (former MD of Aero Leather) has been responsible for the mis-selling by Aero Leather of Aero Leather jackets, cut from Horween’s heavy 4oz Chrome Excell Tanned Steerhide.

These have been labelled and sold as Front Quarter Horsehide. This constitutes a serious misrepresentation with which neither Horween nor Aero Leather wish to be associated.

In the past two days Aero Leather have had two jackets returned to the factory for exchange by customers unaware of the mis-labelling. Both jackets were Steerhide jackets which appear to have been intentionally mis-sold as Horsehide. Each had an Aero Leather Horsehide label.


Both Horween & Aero Leather regard this mis-selling as extremely serious. As our loyal and valued customers are aware, customer satisfaction and the authenticity of our products are our paramount considerations.

If any customers have purchased from Aero Leather any very heavy “Horsehide” jackets in the past 12 months, and are in any doubt about the authenticity of the leather in regard to the labelling used in the product they have received, those customers should email holly@aeroleatherclothing.com. Aero Leather will be happy to inspect the product and confirm what the leather is, and, in appropriate circumstances, offer a replacement jacket.

Please note, this only applies to the very heavy 4 oz Aero Leather jackets made during Will Lauder’s term as MD.

Aero Leather regret that, against the background of an ongoing criminal investigation in respect of the conduct of Will Lauder, in his capacity as MD of Aero Leather, and current civil proceedings by the company against Will Lauder in the Court of Session, Edinburgh, Will Lauder is no longer associated with Aero Leather nor Horween.

All one must do is read the above post...and then use reason rather than hysteria to find answers that would most likely be confirmed by Aero(or ARE..if you look close enough).
Using steer for horse was a 'deliberate' act by someone in the position of Aero MD. After this was discovered by others in a position of authority..he was removed. 'Reasonably' any he influenced were as well. Motive may be left out for 'legal' reason..but for any reason..it goes against Aero's creed(as stated here). Mixmatched hides were only revealed by recently dealing direct with Aero. Actual steer recognized in place of HH..the same. A reasonable approach was used in deducting the problems with establishing a 'time period' for questionable hides..and then confirmed by Aero.
However..again...any relevant announcements are still being buried in a feeding frenzy of further wild accusations and 'what ifs' searching for the nitty-gritty dissection of all fault...when it is already established in Aero's quote above.
HD

 

[GriffDeLaGriff]

I agree. I also think its unecessary to talk about prison or speculating in who was in on it or not. I agree we should not go outside of what has been said by Aero.

Im not saying the cutters/machinists were not in on it, but I know many bosses of mine who has ordered me to do things that has been below my pride in my profession. Nevertheless sometimes you are "forced" to just carry on what the boss tell you. In a perfect world everyone would just say "no" and leave the job. But in reality you cannot always afford this with wife, kids, house and so on. Some times you are told "this will be the only time" wich makes it a little easier, but when the line is crossed, its easier to cross again.

I say blame the boss, and not the ones following the bosses orders.

 

[Jaguar66]

A machinist sewing a jacket from steerhide and put in the label "Genuine Front Quarter Horsehide" must have known what the customer had ordered ...

How "must" they know. Only people that knew actually knew. And how are you going to know who that is? People are making many wild speculations in this thread. Who knows, maybe this statement is wild speculation, in which case I include myself.

I think the only way people found out is that the leathers from the main companies (namely Horween) have characteristics that the people that deal with these can recognize. Perhaps some cutters knew, but perhaps they didn't. Speculation.

Perhaps there are invisible aliens walking the Earth.

 

[dr.velociraptor]

I know many bosses of mine who has ordered me to do things that has been below my pride in my profession. Nevertheless sometimes you are "forced" to just carry on what the boss tell you. I

Almost every workplace has a whistleblower policy and mailbox to anonymously tip off misdeeds like this. It wouldn't be a valid excuse. I've had bosses tell me to do something outside of either my policy or company policy and I just say nope not going to do it. My integrity is worth more than my job, plus the lawsuit I would file would more than make up for any loss of employment.

 

[caffeinated]

All one must do is read the above post...and then use reason rather than hysteria to find answers that would most likely be confirmed by Aero(or ARE..if you look close enough).
Using steer for horse was a 'deliberate' act by someone in the position of Aero MD. After this was discovered by others in a position of authority..he was removed. 'Reasonably' any he influenced were as well. Motive may be left out for 'legal' reason..but for any reason..it goes against Aero's creed(as stated here). Mixmatched hides were only revealed by recently dealing direct with Aero. Actual steer recognized in place of HH..the same. A reasonable approach was used in deducting the problems with establishing a 'time period' for questionable hides..and then confirmed by Aero.
However..again...any relevant announcements are still being buried in a feeding frenzy of further wild accusations and 'what ifs' searching for the nitty-gritty dissection of all fault...when it is already established in Aero's quote above.
HD

I don't know. I think this has been an extremely restrained and reasoned discussion, with a couple of exceptions. Especially for the internet where people have anonimity to hide behind. I actually expected more outraged ranting, especially after finding out about the mixed hide jackets. I'm actually in awe of the maturity of the posters to this forum.

 

[Graemsay]

If it's any help, Holly confirmed that my old Cossack (as seen in the broken-in jacket thread) is made from horsehide. It was made in the autumn of 2008.