Hem protector on a Aero jacket opnions?

[Thuggee]

Currently working on the specs for a new Aero jacket.

I am looking at a lightweight tartan lining with a 2 inch corduroy strip hem protector.

Why am I doing this, I’ve owned a Aero jacket previously where a similar lining has sagged below the bottom of the jacket ( looked terrible) also the hem seems to me to be the weakest point when it comes to lining holes/wear and tear especially with these light weight wool linings.

Yes I could go cotton if I was worried out sagging/holes but I want a particular tartan which doesn’t come in cotton, does anyone have any negatives or positive experiences with a hem protector?

Apparently Aero will do it no questions asked so that’s not a issue.

 

[Seb Lucas]

The corduroy hem protector can sometimes sag too but it will resist wear better than the lining alone. The problem is some period styles (and Aeros) don't use a part lining of leather on the inside of the jacket. Maybe some leather is too thick for 1 inch of leather on the inside hem. That generally deals with sagging pretty well. You can always have a corduroy hem stitched in after the lining starts to go - I've had that done before. My Aero tartan started to sag and hang under just days after I got it.

 

[AeroFan_07]

I would suggest it, my Steerhide CR had it, and it never sagged or casued any issue. The rear section had the inside leather kidney panel so the cord did not extend across that. IMHO it's a worthwhile investment if you decide to go with a Tartan lining. It is not typically needed with lining such as cotton drill.

 

[Thuggee]

the OCD in me hates the hanging lining thing, the jacket I had a issue with was a 2nd hand Aero Cheyenne so quite a long lining/style, I can cant comment on what the previous owner did to it if anything maybe it also started to sag just after he got it it, for reference I have this SB cafe racer with a cotton hem protector & light weight tartan lining , the jackets been worn quite a bit and no issues yet, so a 2inch strip of corduroy may sag still? bugger.

 

[ton312]

The true solution is 1” leather band on in the inside of the jacket. It anchors the hem and provides a nice barrier against sagging liners. I’ve not had issues with newer jackets but almost all my vintage pieces suffer from this. Corduroy seems like a good stop gap but nothing compares to a leather band. I wish Aero would do that. It’s foolproof.
I’ve read it makes replacing the liner more difficult should it fail in other places. Not sure I understand why.

 

[AeroFan_07]

^^ So it turns out Aero Has done this, at least in the past. The FQHH 4-pocket Size 42 Aero CR I purchased this summer from a fellow FL memeber in Arizona has it. It's from apx 2012 as per the first owner - he ordered it through Carrie in the very early days of thier being a Stockist. Here it is (and it's a thick, grainy jacket too, very pleased)

 

[Steven65]

My old Steerhide HB was relined 3 times because my 1911 kept wearing holes in the lining.
Eventually I asked Aero to put a steer hide strip across the bottom to take the wear. The jacket never sagged and continued on for almost 20 more years like this.

I would definitely recommend a leather strip.

 

[Seb Lucas]

I well remember Aero offering this leather backing years back. I thought they moved against it on the grounds that it messed with the authenticity of the pattern and the jacket's drape. Maybe they've relaxed this view. Any jacket I've owned with leather on the inside hem has not had visible sagging. It annoys me that some new jackets begin to sag almost from the factory as mine did. Perhaps this is called period accurate vexation.

 

[navetsea]

The true solution is 1” leather band on in the inside of the jacket. It anchors the hem and provides a nice barrier against sagging liners. I’ve not had issues with newer jackets but almost all my vintage pieces suffer from this. Corduroy seems like a good stop gap but nothing compares to a leather band. I wish Aero would do that. It’s foolproof.
I’ve read it makes replacing the liner more difficult should it fail in other places. Not sure I understand why.

yeah I like leather facing on all edges, also on the back of the neck, I think it will require for the jacket to be turned inside out to sew a new liner with leather facing all around and then a portion of the liner that is used as an access to turn the jacket inside out and back has to be sewn by hand, but all the re stitching only affect the facing, no top stitches that is visible from outside is touched which is a huge plus for me

while if it doesn't have the leather bottom facing and cuff, the jacket doesn't have to be turned inside out just top re stitching the bottom and cuff, but it has to hit the old holes or fix up the old holes first with fillers and color touching or something before sewing a new one.

 

[ton312]

^^ So it turns out Aero Has done this, at least in the past. The FQHH 4-pocket Size 42 Aero CR I purchased this summer from a fellow FL memeber in Arizona has it. It's from apx 2012 as per the first owner - he ordered it through Carrie in the very early days of thier being a Stockist. Here it is (and it's a thick, grainy jacket too, very pleased)

View attachment 261541 View attachment 261542 View attachment 261543 View attachment 261544

That’s exactly how my 2012 j106 was done. Really helped shape the jacket too.

 

[ton312]

My old Steerhide HB was relined 3 times because my 1911 kept wearing holes in the lining.
Eventually I asked Aero to put a steer hide strip across the bottom to take the wear. The jacket never sagged and continued on for almost 20 more years like this.

I would definitely recommend a leather strip.

Now that’s a freaking hem guard. Nice!

 

[Seb Lucas]

yeah I like leather facing on all edges, also on the back of the neck, I think it will require for the jacket to be turned inside out to sew a new liner with leather facing all around and then a portion of the liner that is used as an access to turn the jacket inside out and back has to be sewn by hand, but all the re stitching only affect the facing, no top stitches that is visible from outside is touched which is a huge plus for me

while if it doesn't have the leather bottom facing and cuff, the jacket doesn't have to be turned inside out just top re stitching the bottom and cuff, but it has to hit the old holes or fix up the old holes first with fillers and color touching or something before sewing a new one.

That's what I always thought. I would have guessed that it is easier to replace a lining if you have a facing flap all round the inside to attach it to.

 

[Edward]

I’ve read it makes replacing the liner more difficult should it fail in other places. Not sure I understand why.

AS it was explained to me, the lining is sewn in *under* the leather strip in those older jackets, and so the strip has to be removed in order to sew in a new lining.

I well remember Aero offering this leather backing years back. I thought they moved against it on the grounds that it messed with the authenticity of the pattern and the jacket's drape. Maybe they've relaxed this view. Any jacket I've owned with leather on the inside hem has not had visible sagging. It annoys me that some new jackets begin to sag almost from the factory as mine did. Perhaps this is called period accurate vexation.

It was offered as an optional extra for £50 a pop (£65 in today's money). Ken put a stop the the practice because he felt it was inauthentic and unnecessary, and - as was also said at the time - that a previous MD had been pushing them, effectively ripping people off with something that was considered "Unnecessary".

Personally, I've never had a problem with lining sagging on any of my Aeros, having owned jackets both with and without. I would opt for the corduroy, though, if I was using one of the softer wool linings that are more prone to wear than a drill. At that, the only problem I ever had with a softer wool lining in an Aero is mothing, which is not an issue of construction.

 

[Thuggee]

Thanks everyone I’ve decided to have a corduroy 2inch strip added at the hem, can’t hurt and it doesn’t take away from the look of the jacket, now the wait

 

[Seb Lucas]

AS it was explained to me, the lining is sewn in *under* the leather strip in those older jackets, and so the strip has to be removed in order to sew in a new lining.

If it is a loose strip, yes. But most of my leather jackets are one piece leather, where the 'strip' is formed by folding over the outside leather by one inch inside the jacket to create a hem. The way the inside of a common suit sleeve is made. That's how 9/10 leathers I have owned do hems. That would require no removal or problems, I would think.

 

[Cornelius]

If it is a loose strip, yes. But most of my leather jackets are one piece leather, where the 'strip' is formed by folding over the outside leather by one inch inside the jacket to create a hem. The way the inside of a common suit sleeve is made. That's how 9/10 leathers I have owned do hems. That would require no removal or problems, I would think.

True, but from what I've seen in TFL photos of Aero jackets (never had one myself or even seen in person), since they offer a regular hem as standard, having the "suit sleeve" style folded hem to provide a protective interior strip would require altering the pattern which the Cutter uses to select portions of a hide for front & back panels. In every size, for every model.

Likely something a manufacturer as "large" as Aero would rather avoid. For a smaller operation that is probably already cutting custom pattern panels for many customers with specific upcharge requests, not as big a deal.

[From what I understand of their M.O., Aero has one Cutter selecting all the panels, which are then parceled out to individual Machinists who take it from there and complete the jacket entirely themselves.]

 

[Seb Lucas]

True, but from what I've seen in TFL photos of Aero jackets (never had one myself or even seen in person), since they offer a regular hem as standard, having the "suit sleeve" style folded hem to provide a protective interior strip would require altering the pattern which the Cutter uses to select portions of a hide for front & back panels. In every size, for every model.

Likely something a manufacturer as "large" as Aero would rather avoid. For a smaller operation that is probably already cutting custom pattern panels for many customers with specific upcharge requests, not as big a deal.

[From what I understand of their M.O., Aero has one Cutter selecting all the panels, which are then parceled out to individual Machinists who take it from there and complete the jacket entirely themselves.]

Of course, but I think the critical issue for Aero is that the patterns they have copied have the same style hems with no leather facing. It's accurate, and may sag like the period versions. But not all jackets sag. It may only be 20%. You're not going to change your patterns for a small number of minor issues. I'd be interested to understand why mine have sagged and none of Edwards. It might simply be a case of the lining being too generously cut in mine.

 

[Edward]

If it is a loose strip, yes. But most of my leather jackets are one piece leather, where the 'strip' is formed by folding over the outside leather by one inch inside the jacket to create a hem. The way the inside of a common suit sleeve is made. That's how 9/10 leathers I have owned do hems. That would require no removal or problems, I would think.

It should in theory be simpler that way - though of course going over to that approach may or may not be a construction technique that was used in the period pre-1959, which would be an issue, potentially, as while Aero's civilian jackets are rarely intended to be a reproduction of a specific jacket from the period, Ken's design philosophy has long been that any Aero jacket should have been something that could have come out of the 'norms' of the leather jacket industry at the time. On a more practical level, it would involve a significant rejigging of a lot of patterns, so if it's not putting off significant custom, I can see the logic in sticking with 'as is'.

True, but from what I've seen in TFL photos of Aero jackets (never had one myself or even seen in person), since they offer a regular hem as standard, having the "suit sleeve" style folded hem to provide a protective interior strip would require altering the pattern which the Cutter uses to select portions of a hide for front & back panels. In every size, for every model.

Likely something a manufacturer as "large" as Aero would rather avoid. For a smaller operation that is probably already cutting custom pattern panels for many customers with specific upcharge requests, not as big a deal.

That definitely would make a difference. Going bespoke does leave room for tweaks, and a one-man operation making one jacket at a time - say - can also practically build in more variation than an operation making a larger number of jackets, where a certain base-level of uniformity becomes necessary.

From what I understand of their M.O., Aero has one Cutter selecting all the panels, which are then parceled out to individual Machinists who take it from there and complete the jacket entirely themselves.]

I beleive this is fairly standard across the higher end men's clothing/tailoring industry, having a separate cutter and stitcher, for want of a better way of putting it. Two different skills. Again, in a very small firm these jobs could be replicated, but if you're working with enough staff to maximise efficiency on the production line model, I'd hazard a guess it would be much more productive to separate the roles.

Of course, but I think the critical issue for Aero is that the patterns they have copied have the same style hems with no leather facing. It's accurate, and may sag like the period versions. But not all jackets sag. It may only be 20%. You're not going to change your patterns for a small number of minor issues. I'd be interested to understand why mine have sagged and none of Edwards. It might simply be a case of the lining being too generously cut in mine.

It's definitely a period feature. Interesting point about the lining, though - I did wonder if a lining cut just a little bigger might have more cloth there to sag a little. Perhaps the type of lining might be an issue too? I.e. is it a textile prone to a bit of stretch with wear, it is one that has a bit of 'body', or is it one that is more malleable and therefore more likely to pull down a bit?

 

[Lebowski]

Thanks everyone I’ve decided to have a corduroy 2inch strip added at the hem, can’t hurt and it doesn’t take away from the look of the jacket, now the wait

Great idea, I like it Thuggee.

 

[dan_t]

Good idea.
For the record, I’ve had quite a few Aeros pass through my hands now & not a single one has suffered from a droopy hem.
Some of them dated from the ‘80’s too...
I must have been lucky.