Help me choose a perfect Perfecto

[Monitor]

I apologize if this doesn't belong here, but I couldn't find a more fitting place so...

Hi, I'm new and I'm happy to be aboard as a new member since I was until now a long time lurker of this excellent forum, to which I owe a lot. Us Europenas, especially the ex-Eastern block folk, don't really know about any good leather jacket brands outside Dainese or Held, so if it wasn't for the internet and you guys, I probably would've never even hear about Vanson, Aero, Schott, etc. Plus, I've pretty much learned all I know about leather jacket from excellent filmjackets forum and you guys, and I'd really like to thank all of you who have contributed over the years cause you're so doing much more than you are perhaps aware of. All the info, photos, stories you guys shared with the world, FTL may not seem like a very large community, but I am quite sure that there are countless of lurkers like myself that made their decisions based on what they read here so... Thanks, everyone.

Well first off let me introduce myself. I'm 30-something, living and working in Europe. My line of work requires me to constantly be on the move, and since my only mean of transportation is my motorcycle, it is safe to say that leather jackets are quite important to me. Motorcycle jackets don't have to be made of leather anymore, but that's the thing, once you discover, say, Vanson, it's really impossible to get back to that day-glo power rangers stuff that most European moto protective garments companies are producing. Not that there is anything wrong with any of that stuff, but then moment you put your hands on any of the above mentioned brands, you develop a sense of style and there's no going back. That's a fact.

Long story short, my first, oldest and favorite proper leather jacket was Schott 118 or 618 or some variation of the time - it's from the late 70's that I bought 10 years ago at a garage sale for $30 or so - and it has served me well. Back then I didn't even know what Schott is, but that is beside the point. Then few years ago I bought a Vanson, model B and an old Aero cafe racer of a kind, both of which I really do love, but... I don't know, for whatever reason, I always liked that Schott best. Don't know why, I guess I love the way it fits, because otherwise as far as the protection goes I really don't think there's any comparison to either of the two jackets I have.
Anyway, I am not a rich man. I get by but that's about it. I bought these two jackets because my Schott wasn't getting any younger and I really needed to have a replacement ready. I don't plan on having a collection of leather jackets - hell, in fact, I'd be really happy to have just one, you know, that right jacket, but... Something's not right with neither that Vanson nor Aero. I'm not feeling it. Again, there's nothing wrong with them, both jackets are nothing short of perfect, but you know... Maybe it's the fit or something else, I dunno but I'm not as happy as I was hoping I would be. I guess we're all weird like that, huh?

The reason why I went with the other brands is because the internet convinced to do so. And while I agree that as far as the leather thickness goes, it is understood that comparing Schott to either Vanson or Aero wouldn't be fair, the fact remains that I'm still spending most of my time in that beat up, old Schott. This had me thinking, why switch brands at all? Schott makes my favorite jacket in horsehide so there's no way I can go wrong with that, right? cause horsehide is the best, right? Seemed like a good idea, but then I've once again decided to run this by you guys and after searching and reading like hell throguh the forum, I've come to the conclusion that the FTL consensus is that while being okay, Schott horsehide isn't worth the money they're asking for it. That's cool, I believe you guys, but the problem is, now I've hit the wall... What the hell do I do now?

Man, this thing is too long already so seriously, let's cut to the chase - I've been saving up this whole year and have approx. $1000 to spend on a jacket, and I was wondering if you guys could help me out choose that perfect one! Obviously, I don't have enough for a new Aero or Lost Worlds (besides, I don't really like their interpretations of the Perfecto jacket), not to mention Langlitz, so what else is there? What's closest to Schott Perfecto in terms of quality, fit and style, that is worth that kind of money? I like Vanson C2, but am not sure about it, because considering I'm in Europe, I've only one shot to get it right, and if I won't like the jacket...
What about Bates? I cannot find a single piece of information about Bates leathers so could perhaps someone tell me something about them? Or should I go with Schott 618HH anyway?

I guess this probably may seem like a weird post to you, but basically what I'm asking is, well, what would you do? I'd really like to buy something that... You know, something that's perfect for that kind of money.

I guess that's that. Thanks for reading, and thanks in advance for any help whatsoever. Cheers!

 

[Alistar79]

Have you checked out lewis leathers?

 

[1911 Man]

First of all, welcome to the forum. I hope you are able to enjoy your time here, and benefit from the vast amount of knowledge pooled here.

I am like you, searching for that perfect motorcycle jacket. I have 2 Aeros in horsehide, and have had other jackets. Don't get me wrong, I love my Aeros, but they are not great motorcycle jackets. I also understand Schott's horsehide is questionable. My problem is that the style I want is the Schott 689HH, which is only available in horsehide. After much consideration, I have decided I want a MC jacket in steerhide / cowhide, and am looking at options. My long winded post brings me to this point: Have you considered the Schott Perfecto in cowhide? I understand that Schott's current cowhide is superb, and if they made the 689 in cowhide I would buy it in a heartbeat. I know they offer both the 618 and 118 (depending on how slim you want it) in cow. My impressions from reading this forum is that 3.5 to 4 oz cowhide is just as good as fqhh, and black cowhide weathers beautifully, IMHO.

 

[Highwaymanman]

Schott's naked cowhide in black really is iconic to me.

 

[Monitor]

Thanks for the welcome! And yeah, I forgot to apologize for my English, which obviously isn't my mother tongue.

@Alistar: They're kinda too pricy, and supposedly from what I hear, their stuff is more fashion oriented these days and no longer as tough as it used to be. I could be wrong on that one, though?

@1911 Man: Cheers! I know exactly what you mean about Aero - at least one that I have, it is a breathtaking jacket but for some reason that I have yet to put my finger on, they just don't work that well on a bike. It's a bit too classy for me, as well, but that's beside the point.
Anyway, yes - I have considered it, and in fact, I have always wanted a brand new Schott like the one that I have, in cowhide, but then I found out they're making one in horsehide and so I automatically assumed that this should be the ultimate 618 - plus they're relatively scarcer, which is of course appealing cause Perfectos being the most copied jacket design ever, who wouldn't want theirs to stand out, plus there's all that talk about how awesome horsehide is, how it's aging better, how it's tougher and all that - but now... I'm no longer so sure. I wish I could see it and compare it myself, but that's not going to happen any time soon. I could go with Schott cowhide, but then I'd be buying what I already have... I guess what I'd really like is to hear from someone having both jackets how exactly do they compare.

1911 Man, out of curiosity, have you handled Schott jacket in horsehide? 689 certainly looks like a beautiful jacket on the pictures, so I'm wondering, how questionable can their horsehide be?

@Highwaymanman: Absolutely so!

 

[Seb Lucas]

One thing about Schott, some are cut short so if you are over 5 ft 10 they may look odd. Whenever I've bought Schott I've always been limited to the models they do in long sizes.

 

[simonc]

Seb I'm 6'2" and I wear short jackets all the time, looks great feels great no problem, I agree shorter people tend to look worse in a longer cut but taller people wear it well, I think the trick is getting the right cut on the trousers to go with the jacket, ie a higher waist. In regards to Schott I understand the Brando thing but there are better made jackets out there, if you have the budget personally if i was gonna get a new biker jacket I would rock the "King of the Road" http://www.aeroleatherclothing.com/product-detail.php?id=1520

 

[Chi-Town Co]

Welcome Monitor. I used to own a Schott 689HH. I'm 6'1" and I really liked the way this jacket fit in the shoulders and chest but the sleeves were too short by a good inch or two. It was worse when riding a motorcycle as the sleeves pulled up over my wrists. Also the horsehide had a shiny finish that I did not really care for. I agree that Schotts cowhide is pretty solid. Did you look at the Schott 125?

 

[Seb Lucas]

Seb I'm 6'2" and I wear short jackets all the time, looks great feels great no problem, I agree shorter people tend to look worse in a longer cut but taller people wear it well, I think the trick is getting the right cut on the trousers to go with the jacket, ie a higher waist. In regards to Schott I understand the Brando thing but there are better made jackets out there, if you have the budget personally if i was gonna get a new biker jacket I would rock the "King of the Road" http://www.aeroleatherclothing.com/product-detail.php?id=1520

Hmm... I wouldn't wear a jacket that was shorter than 26.5 inches at the back. Schotts I've seen tend to be 25 inches. I'm 6'2" as well.

 

[Monitor]

Thanks for the replies, guys.

@Seb & Chi-town: I'm exactly 6' and I've no problem with the length of their Perfectos - like Simonc said, looks great, feels great. In fact, that's exactly why I'm here - The reason I was looking into getting another Schott in the first place is because it fits and looks so bloody good, but then again I'm not too comfortable spending 'round $800 on a jacket you guys say ain't really worth it.

Seb, I've actually had a 615 at one point, which is from what I gather pretty much the same as 125, and while it was an awesome jacket, I can't say that I cared much for the laced side gussets nor the fact that it didn't have a belt. I'd really like to go with the most classic version of the jacket. Yeah, the whole Brando thing (I know nothing Schott ever made matches Brando's jacket but that's another story), y'know, half-belt, d-pocket, etc.

That said, I find the back length of 618 to be absolutely perfect for riding a motorcycle, while both Aero and Vanson seem to be too long. Aero is all weird on a bike, but I guess it depends on what, or how you're riding but still, never had any trouble with 618 on whatever bike I sat on. In my experience, there's no such thing as a motorcycle jacket that's too short.

@simonc: It's a bit out of my price range but while perhaps I could buy this jacket, the fact that I'm not entirely happy with the Aero I have - once again, this isn't based on the quality of the jacket, which is beyond outstanding in every possible aspect, but rather on a personal preference - I'd rather not take my chances.

Anyway, it would really help me a lot if someone who've had a chance to handle both 618 cowhide and 618 horsehide would tell me how exactly do they compare? I understand that their recent horsehide isn't front quarter horsehide, but what exactly does that mean? How does their more recent horsehide age?
I've went through some of the threads on Schott forum regarding the matter, but... Let's just say that I'd prefer to hear this from an independent source.
Or should I just give Vanson C2 or Thunderbird a go? It's hard to find any decent info on any of these jackets, so do you guys have any experience with em?
What else is there?

Thanks again, everyone!

 

[winterland1]

There are quite a few Schott Perfectos that come up for sale on Ebay. You can get them usually for a great price. I would just stay with the Schott. Get one at a good price and if it doesn't fit or feel perfect sell and buy one until you find another great fitting one. You could always buy new also.

 

[Worf]

Just visited Vanson with a co-worker he bought a jacket for riding... not a Perfecto though while I bought an Ike. I can tell you... at least for my jacket.. it's every bit as good as my Aeros or my GoodWear. Give em a try.

Worf

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Just visited Vanson with a co-worker he bought a jacket for riding... not a Perfecto though while I bought an Ike. I can tell you... at least for my jacket.. it's every bit as good as my Aeros or my GoodWear. Give em a try.

Worf

I love my older steerhide Vanson Enfield out of all the MC jackets I have. Schott..Harley
..and several vintage. Had a new Aero HH MC years ago...but too stiff for me on a long trip. Must have comfort.
Put quite a few miles on the bike per year. My Vanson is heavy hided..but without all the waxes and fats to stiffed up like the Aero FQHH.
HD

 

[Monitor]

@winterland: I'm in Serbia, a country that's on the most 'Will not ship to' lists so while simply buying a jacket can be a pain, selling one over eBay is just not an option for me. And basically all of the good stuff is located in the US. If I am to go for a new Schott, that usaleatherco seller is pretty much my only hope. Unfortunately, he's as pricey as Schott themselves.

Well now I'm going to have to give Vanson some more thought considering how everyone seems to be happy with their jackets. I guess Model B just wasn't meant for serious riding? Though, I'd have to order directly from them cause I don't think I've ever even seen C2 or Thunderbird appearing on eBay...

Again, thanks guys. I guess it's up to me to ultimately decide. Hey perhaps you guys would be willing to help me out with this? You wouldn't happen to have a Vanson or Schott HH or Bates perfecto styled jacket extra you'd be willing to sell??

 

[IXL]

I have a Vanson Model B, and it is indeed made for riding. Why do you think it isn't? It has heavy zips on the riding-length sleeves, a wind flap, forward rotated sleeves for comfort in a riding position, an action back for same, racer (Mandarin) collar, and side belts for adjustment.
I also have a Vanson CHP, as well as a Schott model #118. The Vanson seems to be more "armor like" and stiff, but I don't feel the Schott is lacking in any way: it's a good jacket in a classic style.
Why don't you just get (another?)/a Schott #118, if this is the style you like and your favorite jacket is this brand and approximate style? If you email "Gail" at Schott she will be glad to help you with any sizing or material questions, as the sizing between the various models is not consistent.
Good luck with your quest!!

 

[Monitor]

IXL, It's funny, but my friend who owns a Harley also thinks that the Vanson is a perfect riding jacket, while I'm definitely having problems with the length of the jacket. Sleeves are absolutely perfect and far better than those on Aero, and it's certainly nice to have an action back that's not just there for the show (far superior to that of Schott), but yeah... I find it a bit too long and perhaps a little too boxy. I ride a 1978 Ducati 900SS Desmo, so when I bend forward the whole jacket bunches up and pushes into my chin. Looking at a Comet, I think it would be perfect, but I'm not really into the style.

You're right, though, I think I will stick with Schott... I only need some help deciding which one and whether to with horse or cow. Like I said, I'd prefer to finally own a horsehide jacket, just need someone to tell me exactly how it compares to cow in terms of quality and durability. IXL, thanks man!

 

[IXL]

IXL, It's funny, but my friend who owns a Harley also thinks that the Vanson is a perfect riding jacket, while I'm definitely having problems with the length of the jacket. Sleeves are absolutely perfect and far better than those on Aero, and it's certainly nice to have an action back that's not just there for the show (far superior to that of Schott), but yeah... I find it a bit too long and perhaps a little too boxy. I ride a 1978 Ducati 900SS Desmo, so when I bend forward the whole jacket bunches up and pushes into my chin. Looking at a Comet, I think it would be perfect, but I'm not really into the style.

You're right, though, I think I will stick with Schott... I only need some help deciding which one and whether to with horse or cow. Like I said, I'd prefer to finally own a horsehide jacket, just need someone to tell me exactly how it compares to cow in terms of quality and durability. IXL, thanks man!

I think I finally have a bead on your problem: you're riding the wrong motorcycle......

 

[IXL]

I have a horsehide "classic" style jacket as well as the Schott cowhide #118. The horsehide is stiff and shiny and both jackets are indeed shorter than the Vanson Model B.
Since you insist on riding the wrong bike (very,very cool motorcycle, by the way!) and like the classic style, would very much like to go over to the dark side and try horse, I still think you should contact Gail and give her as much information as you can on the old Schott you have, as it fits you well. Then, inquire as to which size you should order in the #618 horsehide.
You should end up with a double shot of cool, in a jacket that won't choke you while you are leaned forward and kissing the gas cap on the Ducati.

 

[pipvh]

How about doing something for Balkan relations (speaking as a part-Greek whose great-great grandparents lived in Serbia) and checking out Bill Kelso in Greece? A couple of their new models - the Duke and the Westfall look good from a biking point of view (but then again I don't ride). And I realize that this might be a difficult option, but how about looking out for a vintage CHPS or similar jacket on ebay? I've seen quite a few beautiful ones recently, and they aren't always in those tiny vintage sizes.

Great first post, by the way! Welcome to the Lounge.

 

[Monitor]

Hahaha! IXL yeah, trust me, it wasn't exactly my first choice either. Well actually it wasn't my choice at all! I inherited the thing from my father and quite out of the blue at that, and having only ridden scooters before, took me quite a few falls to get the hang of it but it grew on me in the process and now I cannot imagine riding anything else. And it's a kind of bike on which you just cannot wear some whatever motorcycle jacket. Though I'm kinda starting to feel too old for this bike. As cool and awesome as it is to kiss that gas cap, I find this way of riding a motorcycle more and more tiresome so I'll probably start considering something else sometime soon. Anyhow, I've emailed Schott this morning regarding the size (I'm looking at their 618 size chart and can't figure out whether I'm 40, 42 or 44) so we'll see! Thanks a ton for the suggestion!

Pipvh, but Balkan is something I'm trying to get away from! Nah, it's not that bad anymore and hey, Serbia even got the date when it's expected to join the EU, so you guys have a good ten years before we mess everything up. Again. Didn't know of Bill Kelso, though! Good stuff, and thanks for letting me know, though I'd really like a Perfecto style right now. It's like, I've been wearing jackets like Vanson Enfield or Aero Highwayman and also different flight jackets my whole youth, then I moved on to cafe racers and now when I'm older I want that cool factor of the Perfecto I should've been enjoying when I was young... I mean I'm actually this close to painting the B.R.M.C. logo on the back of my old Perfecto so yeah, it's that bad! Westfall is one awesome looking jacket, though!
I am constantly looking out for a good vintage jacket on eBay but it's tough when you don't knowing exactly what to look for and what's the actual condition of the jacket that's being advertised as vintage. That's why I've saved up for a new one. Bates isn't answering any of my mails so I think I'll pull the trigger on the Schott and if it won't be good then... Well that's that then.