Fur Question!

[Miss Golightly]

Hello Ladies,

I was wondering if you might be able to help me - I've been on the lookout for a 50's cardigan with a faux fur collar for ages and I found this - I know this style cardi usually has a real fur collar - the seller says it's faux - does anyone know if this kind of cardi was ever made with a faux collar that may look like this one? I mean the fur - does it look faux? :confused2:

Another seller had a similar cardigan and said the collar was faux but when I asked her about it she checked again and said she thought it could be real - I would hate to buy it and then not wear it!

Thank you!

 

[Puzzicato]

Sorry mate, I think that looks real. I've never seen faux that good.

 

[wahine]

I'm no fur expert, but I'd say Puzzikato is probably right. It looks quite real (considering from the foto - don't you have one with a closer look?). Even nowadays they can't imitate fur very well, much less in the 50s.
Do I get it right: it's about an online / mail order purchase, and you can't check it yourself, right? (Otherwise I'd recommend the old "blowing method")

 

[BinkieBaumont]

We eat meat (most of us) & wear leather shoes whats the problem with vintage fur?

 

[Miss Golightly]

Thank you everyone!

Wahine - it's an online purchase so unfortunately I can't see for myself.

Binkie - I do wear leather but I'm not vegetarian so I have no problem wearing a by-product - in fact I would have no issue wearing the by-product of something I would eat - but I can't see myself eating mink anytime soon!

 

[wahine]

... I do wear leather but I'm not vegetarian so I have no problem wearing a by-product - in fact I would have no issue wearing the by-product of something I would eat - but I can't see myself eating mink anytime soon!

How very well put, Miss Golightly. I always wondered why do I have a problem with real fur (be it vintage or not) since I'm no vegetarian either. I guess you just gave the answer.
On the other hand, I'd eat pretty much anything if it's offered to me in the according environment (like in a foreign culture). But I've never heard of any culture eating mink...

Anyway, I tried to find some information on when they started making faux fur and how the quality was in earlier times.
I only found this: "It was first introduced in 1929[1] and has been commercially available since the 1950s" (wikipedia)

plus some information on production and quality: "In the 1940s, the quality of fake furs was vastly improved by advances in textile manufacture technology. However, the true modern fake furs were not developed until the mid 1950s, ...These new fabrics, called modacrylics, are now the primary polymer used in fake fur manufacture." (from http://www.madehow.com/Volume-3/Fake-Fur.html)

To me, that sounds as if there wasn't a big quality improvement since the 50s, but that's just my interpretation. Unfortunately, they don't say smth like "They didn't make realistic looking furs before.."

 

[Miss Golightly]

How very well put, Miss Golightly. I always wondered why do I have a problem with real fur (be it vintage or not) since I'm no vegetarian either. I guess you just gave the answer.
On the other hand, I'd eat pretty much anything if it's offered to me in the according environment (like in a foreign culture). But I've never heard of any culture eating mink...

Anyway, I tried to find some information on when they started making faux fur and how the quality was in earlier times.
I only found this: "It was first introduced in 1929[1] and has been commercially available since the 1950s" (wikipedia)

plus some information on production and quality: "In the 1940s, the quality of fake furs was vastly improved by advances in textile manufacture technology. However, the true modern fake furs were not developed until the mid 1950s, ...These new fabrics, called modacrylics, are now the primary polymer used in fake fur manufacture." (from http://www.madehow.com/Volume-3/Fake-Fur.html)

To me, that sounds as if there wasn't a big quality improvement since the 50s, but that's just my interpretation. Unfortunately, they don't say smth like "They didn't make realistic looking furs before.."

Thanks for checking into that for me Wahine - I had a feeling that decent looking faux fur may not have been around till much much later.

So many lovely vintage coats have fur trim on them - and I love the look of them (only looking at photos at the weekend of my Gran in her fur coat - she looked so glam!) but I just can't bring myself to wear it.

 

[Tifa]

Just by looking at the picture it's hard to tell.
But I agree, I don't think faux fur was that common back in the days so I would assume it's real.

I have much modern faux fur, some are so real looking and feeling it's hard to tell the difference!
I'm a vegetarian so I hunt for great faux fur all the time since I just love the look!
But no vintage coat or garment with fur that I ever came across has been faux.

 

[bunnyb.gal]

I don't know if this would be of interest, but there's an excellent tutorial on how to do your own faux-fur cardigan. Also on my to-do list, as I'm a veggie non-fur wearer and I've been coveting one of these cardis for months and months (I saw the perfect one at Wallis about a year ago, didn't snap it up in time and have been kicking myself ever since!).

http://blog.caseybrowndesigns.com/2010/11/vintage-flair-make-a-faux-fur-collar

 

[Lauren]

They did make them with faux fur but they're not as common.
I have a faux fur jacket from the 1940s. It's actually pretty good- unless you get right up to it and touch it it's hard to tell. Nothing like modern faux fur- some of that stuff is unbelievable (but so are the prices. Eek!).
Hard to tell from the pictures. Sometimes if it's really really shiny you can tell, but since that shot somewhat dark I don't know... I guess if it's reasonable, if you get it and it's real you could resell it?

 

[Drappa]

I bought a really great faux fur scarf/collar from Topshop last winter, and also have a winter coat from Debenhams that comes with a removable collar - I haven't tried it but if you got a cardi with one waist button, I am sure you could find modern faux fur collars and attach them, no? Sounds like an easier method.
Asos also had quite a few, but can't tell you what quality they are as I haven't seen them IRL.

 

[Lauren]

That's a great idea. They were also making new ones that looked very vintage with the faux fur collars just like the vintage one you pictured not that long ago.

 

[Drappa]

^Oh yes, I almost bought one a few months ago at a charity shop, but it had a hole somewhere, so I passed. I do have a sweater with a faux fur collar, that I assume is from the 90's and it was also a charity shop find.

 

[Lauren]

Same here! I see them pretty frequently in thrift shops
Hey, it's just like newer vintage... kind of

 

[Romy Overdorp]

I love the way how fur looks, but I would never wear it. It's a principle, even though it was common back in the days.

 

[ferula98]

I find the fur debate an interesting subject, and would like to submit my opinion. This is in no way a slant on anything anyone has said before as i compleatly respect everyones opinion on the subject and think its a personal choice.

I do however take offence to (if anyone lives in London) to the people that stand outside of 'Beyond retro' or other shops that sell recycled goods and shout at me for wearing fur. Please by all means if you want to object that is your perogative but go to 'Selfridges' and 'Harrods' or somewhere that sells new clothes, funds the fur trade, and sells something as objectional as made to order Chinchilla fur coats.

My argument is that, one, same as everyones argument if im honest... if its antique it doesnt fund the fur trade, but, two... a lot of the stuff we buy on the high st is dubiously sourced. So second hand goods, even if they are fur, are not items made cheaply for minumum wage (if that) and exploiting those in other countries. If im going to buy second and fur i think thats more ethically correct than buying a coat in Primark.

I feel second hand, even if fur, keeps my concience in order, i know its only my opinion but just wanted to see what others had to say. Hope i havent opened a can of worms here! I know your all *sighing* and weary of this debate but i feel i have to (especially in London) fight my corner sometimes or be very intimidated by a large group of people shouting there set opinions on the subject at me!

www.flairinaladysboudoir.blogspot.com

 

[Yeps]

In an article discussing nutria fur I saw an interesting concept. It pointed out that real fur, if harvested responsibly and such, is a renewable resource while, on the other hand, faux fur is a petroleum product.

 

[Edward]

Hello Ladies,

I was wondering if you might be able to help me - I've been on the lookout for a 50's cardigan with a faux fur collar for ages and I found this - I know this style cardi usually has a real fur collar - the seller says it's faux - does anyone know if this kind of cardi was ever made with a faux collar that may look like this one? I mean the fur - does it look faux? :confused2:

Another seller had a similar cardigan and said the collar was faux but when I asked her about it she checked again and said she thought it could be real - I would hate to buy it and then not wear it!

Thank you!

I'd suspect real.... firstly, it looks too good to be faux, in my experience; secondly, it seems to me that our modern ethical concerns over the fur trade were much less common back in the day, so there was probably much less of a marketing impetus to produce faux fur.

In an article discussing nutria fur I saw an interesting concept. It pointed out that real fur, if harvested responsibly and such, is a renewable resource while, on the other hand, faux fur is a petroleum product.

I think - and I'm not trying to be snarky at all - that's the first substantively new point on the fur debate I've read in years. It definitely merits consideration. I wonder, then, for those who like the look of fur but don't want to wear an animal they would not eat, is mouton the ideal compromise? I'm all for the superiority of natural materials over manmade, especially where petro-chemicals have been involved in the latter, but like many others I baulk at the notion of wearing a pelt for which the animal has been killed (especially to order), as opposed to it being a by-product.

 

[Edward]

I find the fur debate an interesting subject, and would like to submit my opinion. This is in no way a slant on anything anyone has said before as i compleatly respect everyones opinion on the subject and think its a personal choice.

I do however take offence to (if anyone lives in London) to the people that stand outside of 'Beyond retro' or other shops that sell recycled goods and shout at me for wearing fur. Please by all means if you want to object that is your perogative but go to 'Selfridges' and 'Harrods' or somewhere that sells new clothes, funds the fur trade, and sells something as objectional as made to order Chinchilla fur coats.

My argument is that, one, same as everyones argument if im honest... if its antique it doesnt fund the fur trade, but, two... a lot of the stuff we buy on the high st is dubiously sourced. So second hand goods, even if they are fur, are not items made cheaply for minumum wage (if that) and exploiting those in other countries. If im going to buy second and fur i think thats more ethically correct than buying a coat in Primark.

I feel second hand, even if fur, keeps my concience in order, i know its only my opinion but just wanted to see what others had to say. Hope i havent opened a can of worms here! I know your all *sighing* and weary of this debate but i feel i have to (especially in London) fight my corner sometimes or be very intimidated by a large group of people shouting there set opinions on the subject at me!

www.flairinaladysboudoir.blogspot.com

I'm fairly local to that area myself, and I know exactly what you mean. I agree entirely that fur is not the only ethical issue when it comes to clothing. I can see both sides of the argument. I hate to think of clothing going to waste in this world. Equally, however, I can see the merit in the argument that suggests that wearing vintage fur to some extent helps to legitimise the modern fur trade by maintaining the notion that wearing fur in general is acceptable. I oscillate between the two views myself, to be honest. I have no ethical discomfort over vintage fur, but at the same time I'd hate to think I was 'legitimising' the contemporary trade. whatever position one wishes to take on this, however, I have seen those particular protesters and while I respect their desire to take a stand on something in which they believe, I should imagine that a friendly appeal to an individual's reason rather than haranguing them would be a much more effective way of communicating their point of view.

 

[sheeplady]

I am really leary of new fake fur on finished clothes. About two or three years ago I saw a news report that said that many fake fur items (such as fur collared jackets) were using dog and cat fur and being labeled as faux fur.

Here is a link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17298301/ns/business-us_business/

I've got no problems with farm animal pelts or pelts from animals that are eaten. For instance, it used to be quite common that sable (rabbit) was harvested from animals that were eaten, I had a sable hat and muff as a kid. I have a wool-pelt jacket that was my moms, and several pelts from my parents sheep (we ate them or sold the meat).

I really don't find other "fur" attractive (other than rabbit or sheep). It feels soft, but it is just not me. I feel like I am walking around in something I stole from a rich lady. I won't even wear fake fur because I feel so out of place. It looks nice on other people, and I'd rather admire it on them.