From The Mail: SS Uniforms Cause Stir at Dambusters Event.

[scotrace]

They're all Win With Wilkie buttons.

 

[rjb1]

Here in the US we have the First Amendment in addition to generally tolerant attitudes about history. You have a VERY wide latitude in terms of acceptable appearance and political expression. WWII reenactors of any sort just fit into the the general atmosphere of tolerance we have.
It would take a lot more in the way of unusual behavior or appearance, in most cases, to cause a problem than any reenactors would ever exhibit. Remember that it was decided years ago by the Supreme Court that REAL Nazis (swastikas and all) could march thorough Jewish neighborhoods. (First Amendment!!)
I have met and talked to a lot of WWII vets at reenactments and have yet to hear of any negative reactions to German or Japanese reenactors of any sort.

 

[Sloan1874]

"The portable solar panel experiment was not the success North Korea's army hoped it would be..."

 

[rjb1]

I thought of one other big factor concerning reenactor acceptance, other than tolerance, here in the US and that is the general lack of public knowledge about history.
If you had three groups of Germans at a reenactment and pointed out to the average spectator that some were Wehrmacht, some were Luftwaffe, and some were SS, it would not mean a thing in terms of having any particular feelings about any of them.
And anyone who knows enough to appreciate the nature of each is likely to be enough of an historian not to put value judgments on the people involved.

 

[Dixon Cannon]

Here in the US we have the First Amendment in addition to generally tolerant attitudes about history. You have a VERY wide latitude in terms of acceptable appearance and political expression. WWII reenactors of any sort just fit into the the general atmosphere of tolerance we have.
It would take a lot more in the way of unusual behavior or appearance, in most cases, to cause a problem than any reenactors would ever exhibit. Remember that it was decided years ago by the Supreme Court that REAL Nazis (swastikas and all) could march thorough Jewish neighborhoods. (First Amendment!!)
I have met and talked to a lot of WWII vets at reenactments and have yet to hear of any negative reactions to German or Japanese reenactors of any sort.

Well said rjb1. The CAF has reported some complaints over uniforms such as those I posted above, but generally and over-all, there is a very wide latitude of tolerance. For instance, though there may have been some hushed talk and some raised eyebrows, these gents were not hassled or asked to leave the event. I think that kind of tolerance (protected by our 1st Amendment) is a good thing and allow individuals to step out, make mistakes and learn. -dixon cannon

 

[Fastuni]

@ V.C. Brunswick, 1961MJS, Edward

If I'm not mistaken in North Korea they wear also the medals of their ancestors... so young cadets can strut around in 1950's war bling.

 

[Stearmen]

Well said rjb1. The CAF has reported some complaints over uniforms such as those I posted above, but generally and over-all, there is a very wide latitude of tolerance. For instance, though there may have been some hushed talk and some raised eyebrows, these gents were not hassled or asked to leave the event. I think that kind of tolerance (protected by our 1st Amendment) is a good thing and allow individuals to step out, make mistakes and learn. -dixon cannon

Things have changed. I remember the early CAF Tora Tora Tora pilots, not much in the way of accurate Japanese uniforms, but a fun bunch of guys. I still have a fake Kamikaze head band one of the pilots gave me.

 

[Maj.Nick Danger]

Whatever I choose to do with any object in my posession is no one else's concern. Not only did the pin make me think of what it represented and the person that wore it, it more importantly, made me feel something. A lot of things really, the most prominent feeling being that of pure revulsion. Unlike many of the so-called "Politically Correct" or "liberals" whose views we are subjected to these days, I firmly believe that there are indeed still governing principles called moral absolutes. Laws that are written into our very being from the moment we are born. Expressed via our conscience. My conscience is something I choose to obey, regardless of popular "culture" or so-called political correctness or even that nebulous grey area some refer to as "reason".
There are plenty of museums all over the world just chock full of artifacts such as the pin in question. Countless documents and books about the era have been published for all to see, as well as films made by the various armies that liberated the camps. My choice to destroy that single piece of offensive nazi memorobilia is of absolutely no consequence, so it's nothing to worry about.

Some of my Grandmother's family died in the concentration Camps. I'm not asking for sympathy, just setting the scene. I re-enact (not WWII, yet), and feel a bit queesy about SS re-enactors. As has been suggested they have made a conscious choice to represent some of histories nastiest people. But then I've done Roman and also Napoleonic Imperial Guard. I think we all should be willing to answer hard questions about motivations.

But then again the destruction of stuff, such as your tie pin are worrying. What happens if everyone does this, and there are no artifacts left? We mustn't let history forget through lack of evidence. Even a tie pin might cause someone, as you did, to think about what it represents.

 

[Capesofwrath]

Here in the US we have the First Amendment in addition to generally tolerant attitudes about history. You have a VERY wide latitude in terms of acceptable appearance and political expression. WWII reenactors of any sort just fit into the the general atmosphere of tolerance we have.
It would take a lot more in the way of unusual behavior or appearance, in most cases, to cause a problem than any reenactors would ever exhibit. Remember that it was decided years ago by the Supreme Court that REAL Nazis (swastikas and all) could march thorough Jewish neighborhoods. (First Amendment!!)
I have met and talked to a lot of WWII vets at reenactments and have yet to hear of any negative reactions to German or Japanese reenactors of any sort.

These people weren't re enactors though. You could hardly have a pretend war without two sides. But this was a 1940's themed day. They wen't breaking any laws either. Although they would be in Germany if they went out in public dressed in SS uniform; but not a Wehrmacht one. It was more a question of taste, and the people who complained most were German tourists if you read the piece.

Wonder how tolerant you would be if a bunch of Bin Laden lookalikes turned up on the anniversary of the twin towers attack? There was a huge fuss when it was alleged that a mosque was being proposed to be built at the site. When in reality it was a Muslim information centre and it was over a quarter of a mile away.

 

[ButteMT61]

You're comparing war to terrorists. I personally don't equate the chicken-*hit 9/11 thugs to soldiers - not even the dirtbags that wore the swastika. And WWII is almost 70 years over. Apples and oranges. But I think people who reenact (I am one) are best off using good judgement when donning WWII gear. I don't even dress until I'm at an event. Most people don't get it and I'm better off waiting to be amongst those that do before gearing up. The potential for anyone to be offended is there regardless of your uniform. Why push it?

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

That's why some people (including me) stated it was different if you reenact the Wehrmacht (=regular german army) or the SS (=Nazi Party organisation). I found that distinction not too hard to grasp. [huh]

 

[Capesofwrath]

You're comparing war to terrorists. I personally don't equate the chicken-*hit 9/11 thugs to soldiers - not even the dirtbags that wore the swastika. And WWII is almost 70 years over. Apples and oranges. But I think people who reenact (I am one) are best off using good judgement when donning WWII gear. I don't even dress until I'm at an event. Most people don't get it and I'm better off waiting to be amongst those that do before gearing up. The potential for anyone to be offended is there regardless of your uniform. Why push it?

I don't think I was. But terrorism is just war by other means if it comes to that; and it's increasingly become just a word to use against your enemies whether they attack civilians or the military. The Germans called the RAF terrorists, and they had a point in that one of the main objects of area bombing was to terrorise the population into overthrowing their leaders. Some hope of that with the tight control of the Nazi state. Still the Germans did start it and maybe they shouldn't have if they couldn't take a joke. Or as Harris put it rather more elegantly: "They have sown the wind, and will inherit the whirlwind...."

My latter point was to illustrate that tolerance is easy when you haven't had to tolerate something; and the UK didn't have to tolerate the SS on its soil either BTW. But most of occupied Europe did. So they and modern Germans don't see the uniform in the same way as a young person from the US might. To whom it's just a costume.

 

[Pulver]

Although I couldn't imagine why anyone would want to do a Heinrich Himmler impression, it is more the politicization of the pros and cons of historical impression that bothers me.

 

[1961MJS]

Back in the mid-1980's our Confederate Infantry was working on the manual of arms when the groom and his groomsmen came around the apartment complex where we were practicing. They were all black, and we were all in Confederate uniform. They asked if this was x apartment complex, we said no and told them how to get there. They thanked us and left. Fearless leader looked at us and said "In theory at least one of us should have been $#$#$ed off by that." He shrugged and we went back at it. They didn't care and neither did we, which is good.

Later Y'all

 

[Spitfire]

I can only quote my father, who fought the nazis in the danish resistance:
"It was not the single german soldier I fought. But I hated everything the uniform symbolized. So I fought them."
My father is dead now - but I still can not see any reason for people strutting around in these uniforms.
Not in my country. Not in Europe. They tried it once - and lost.