From The Mail: SS Uniforms Cause Stir at Dambusters Event.

[Cobden]

Honestly, this sort of thing is one of the reasons I've moved from WWII to Great War. That and the fact that most events these days seem to ignore the fact that the war was the most horrific event in human history in favour of people dancing in daylight on a railway station platform to "In The Mood".
That said, I think there is a place for Waffen-SS, but it needs an intelligent and sensitive approach. Alas in the UK they are inevitably portrayed by the sort of person (for some reason they are often from Burnley) who invariably refers to himself as "Like Marmite - you either love me or you hate me" (a phrase that usually means, in fact, that everybody hates you) and is proud of his tactlessness, declaring that he "calls a spade a spade" - though by spade he is less likely to be talking about gardening implements and more gentlemen of African/Carribbean ancestry.

 

[alsendk]

Yeah, same here. Maybe it's something about that nazi memorabilia that fascinates us, or the evil with which it is associated? And that fascination could become dangerous to someone that is ignorant of what those things represented, and still represent today. It wasn't all just some movie with actors, it was very real.
I had an SS officer's tie stick pin in the form of a skull and crossbones, finely crafted and very detailed in my collection of assorted world war 2 artifacts. I bought it for a few dollars at an antiques show at the local mall back in the 80's. Before I moved across country recently, I put a lot of stuff on ebay to raise needed cash. I thought to sell the stick pin, as it may have been a rare collectable but something told me no. I ended up actually smashing it with a hammer and destroying it.
I thought of the person who once owned and wore it, what his values were, what he might have done day to day. My conscience got the better as I would have felt guilty if I had profited from the sale of the thing and what it represented. I have heard that objects retain an energy from the people that once owned, used or wore them. Maybe there is something to that?

A good thing to do. The lesser of these nazi remains the better.

In 1962, being a kid at 12, I was on holiday with my dad and mom, trying to find the Bergen-Belsen camp, but all the german people in the small villages denied the existence of such a camp. Finally we found it ourselves. It was made to a memory park. only
the terrible many large piles of soil, with their individual inscriptions of....Hier ruhen 5000 tote were to be seen. No cremation chambers, no chimneys were left. Not like in Poland
All the villages sorrounding the camp must have known. Just in one night the camp cremated 80.000 jews. This could not have been going on un-notified. Today I understand the feeling of shame and guild these german citizens must have felt

How on earth grown up men of today wishes to flash their purchased nazi uniforms in front of good people is something I will never learn to understand.

 

[the hairy bloke]

Some of my Grandmother's family died in the concentration Camps. I'm not asking for sympathy, just setting the scene. I re-enact (not WWII, yet), and feel a bit queesy about SS re-enactors. As has been suggested they have made a conscious choice to represent some of histories nastiest people. But then I've done Roman and also Napoleonic Imperial Guard. I think we all should be willing to answer hard questions about motivations.

But then again the destruction of stuff, such as your tie pin are worrying. What happens if everyone does this, and there are no artifacts left? We mustn't let history forget through lack of evidence. Even a tie pin might cause someone, as you did, to think about what it represents.

 

[p51]

Isn`t re-enacting mostly for men, that never did a real military drafted service themselves ?

Actually, there are plenty of veterans (such as myself) in the hobby. In my case, I joined the Army because of the hobby, not the other way around...

 

[alsendk]

Some of my Grandmother's family died in the concentration Camps. I'm not asking for sympathy, just setting the scene. I re-enact (not WWII, yet), and feel a bit queesy about SS re-enactors. As has been suggested they have made a conscious choice to represent some of histories nastiest people. But then I've done Roman and also Napoleonic Imperial Guard. I think we all should be willing to answer hard questions about motivation
But then again the destruction of stuff, such as your tie pin are worrying. What happens if everyone does this, and there are no artifacts left? We mustn't let history forget through lack of evidence. Even a tie pin might cause someone, as you did, to think about what it represents.

There is plenty of evidence left in Europe to remind people about the nazi regime, even without a lost tie pin










NAMES OF NAZI EXTERMINATION CAMPS INSIDE EUROPE

Camp name Country (today) Camp type Dates of use Est. prisoners Est. deaths Sub-camps Webpage
Alderney Channel Islands Labor camps Jan 1942 – Jun 1944 6,000 700 Lager Borkum, Lager Helgoland, Lager Norderney, Lager Sylt [2]
Amersfoort Netherlands Transit camp and prison Aug 1941 – Apr 1945 35,000 1,000 [3]
Arbeitsdorf Germany Labor camp 8 Apr 1942 – 11 Oct 1942 600 min. none
Auschwitz-Birkenau Poland Extermination and labor camp Apr 1940 – Jan 1945 135,000 min.[4] in August 1944 1,100,000 min.[5] out of 6,000,000 rec. arrivals [6] list of 48 sub-camps with description at the Auschwitz-Birkenau State Museum [7] [4] [5] [7] [6]
Banjica Serbia Concentration camp Jun 1941 – Sep 1944 23,637 3,849[8]
Bardufoss Norway Concentration camp Mar 1944 – ???? 800 250 [citation needed]
Bełżec Poland Extermination camp Oct 1941 – Jun 1943 434,508 min. [4]
Berga an der Elster (Berga, Thuringia) Germany Labor camp; Buchenwald subcamp
Bergen-Belsen Germany Collection point Apr 1943 – Apr 1945 70,000 2 [5]
Berlin-Marzahn Germany Early a "rest place" then labor camp for Roma July 1936 – none [6]
Bernburg Germany Collection point Apr 1942 – Apr 1945 100,000 2
Bogdanovka Moldova Concentration camp 1941 54,000 40,000
Bolzano Italy Transit Jul 1944 – Apr 1945 11,116
Bredtvet Norway Concentration camp Fall, 1941 – May, 1945 1,000 min. ???? none
Breendonk Belgium Prison and labor camp 20 Sep 1940 – Sep 1944 3532 min. 391 min. none [7]
Breitenau Germany "Early wild camp", then labor camp Jun 1933 – Mar 1934,
1940–1945 470 – 8500 [8]
Buchenwald Germany Labor camp Jul 1937 – Apr 1945 250,000 56,000 list [9]
Chełmno
(Kulmhof) Poland Extermination camp Dec 1941 – Apr 1943,
Apr 1944 – Jan 1945 152,000 min. [10]
Crveni krst Serbia Concentration camp 1941–1945 30,000 12,300
Dachau Germany Labor camp Mar 1933 – Apr 1945 200,000 31,591 list [11]
Drancy France Internment camp, transit 20 Aug 1941 – 17 Aug 1944 70,000 Three of five Paris annexes: Austerlitz, Lévitan and Bassano camps [12]
Falstad Norway Prison camp Dec 1941 – May 1945 200 min. none [13]
Flößberg (Frohburg) Germany Labor camp; Buchenwald subcamp November 1944 – Apr 1945 1904 235 min. [14]
Flossenbürg Germany Labor camp May 1938 – Apr 1945 100,000 min. 30,000 list [15]
Fort de Romainville France Prison and transit camp 1940 – Aug 1944 8,100 min. 200 min. none [16]
Fort VII (Poznań) Poland Concentration, detention, transit Oct 1939 – Apr 1944 18,000 min. 4,500 min. [17]
Fossoli Italy Prison and transit camp 5 Dec 1943 – Nov 1944 none
Grini Norway Prison camp 2 May 1941 – May 1945 19,788 8 Fannrem
Bardufoss
Kvænangen
Gross-Rosen Poland Labor camp; Nacht und Nebel camp Aug 1940 – Feb 1945 125,000 40,000 list [18]
Herzogenbusch
(Vught) Netherlands Concentration camp 1943 – Summer 1944 31,000 750 list [19]
Hinzert Germany Collection point and subcamp Jul 1940 – Mar 1945 14,000 302 min. [20]
Janowska
(Lwów) Ukraine Ghetto; transit, labor, & extermination camp Sep 1941 – Nov 1943 40,000 min. none [21]
(see "A-Z")
Jasenovac concentration camp Croatia Extermination camp for Jews, Serbs and Roma[9] 1941–1945 100,000 min.[10] 100,000 min.[11] Stara Gradiška concentration camp, Sisak children's concentration camp, Donja Gradina, Jasenovac main [22]
Kaiserwald
(Mežaparks) Latvia Labor camp 1942 – 6 Aug 1944 20,000? 16,
incl. Eleja-Meitenes [23]
Kaufering/Landsberg Germany Labor camp Jun 1943 – Apr 1945 30,000 14,500 min. [24]
Kauen
(Kaunas) Lithuania Ghetto and internment camp ???? Prawienischken [25]
Kemna Germany Early concentration camp Jun 1933 – Jan 1944 4,500 none [26]
Klooga Estonia Labor camp Summer 1943 – 28 Sep 1944 2,400
Koldichevo Belarus Labor camp Summer 1942 – Jun 1944 22,000
Langenstein-Zwieberge Germany Buchenwald subcamp Apr 1944 – Apr 1945 5,000 2,000
Le Vernet France Internment camp 1939–1944
Majdanek
(KZ Lublin) Poland Extermination camp Jul 1941 – Jul 1944 78,000 [27]
Malchow Germany Labor and Transit camp Winter 1943 – 8 May 1945 5,000
Maly Trostenets Belarus Extermination camp Jul 1941 – Jun 1944 206,500 (official)
65,000 [28]
[29]
Mauthausen-Gusen Austria Labor camp Aug 1938 – May 1945 195,000 95,000 min. list [30]
Mechelen Belgium Transit camp July 1942 – Sep 1944 25267 min.[12] 300 min.[13] none [31]
Mittelbau-Dora Germany Labor camp Sep 1943 – Apr 1945 60,000 20,000 min. list [32]
Mittelsteine Poland Labour camp; Gross-Rosen subcamp Aug 1944 – April 1945 300–1,000 10–20 none [33]
Natzweiler-Struthof (Struthof) France Labor camp; Nacht und Nebel camp; extermination camp May 1941 – Sep 1944 40,000 25,000 list [34]
Neuengamme Germany Labor camp 13 Dec 1938 – 4 May 1945 106,000 42,900+ list [35]
Niederhagen Germany Prison and labor camp Sep 1941 – early 1943 3,900 1,285 none [36]
Oberer Kuhberg Germany Concentration camp Nov 1933 – 1935 0 Former infantry base Gleißelstetten (Fortress of Ulm) [37]
Ohrdruf Germany Labor and concentration camp; Buchenwald subcamp Nov 1944 – Apr 1945 11,700 [38]
Oranienburg Germany Early concentration camp Mar 1933 – Jul 1934 3,000 16 min. [39]
Osthofen Germany Collective point Mar 1933 – Jul 1934
Płaszów Poland Labor camp Dec 1942 – Jan 1945 150,000 min. 9,000 min. list
Ravensbrück Germany Labor camp for women May 1939 – Apr 1945 150,000 90,000 min. list [40][41]
Risiera di San Sabba
(Trieste) Italy Police detainment camp Sep 1943 – 29 Apr 1945 25,000 5,000 [42]
Sachsenhausen Germany Labor camp Jul 1936 – Apr 1945 200,000 min. 100,000 list [43]
Sajmište Serbia Extermination camp Dec 1941 – Sep 1944 > 50,000
Salaspils Latvia Labor camp Oct 1941 – Summer 1944 2,000 [44]
Skrochowitz
(Skrochovice) Czech Republic Transit (1939) and labor camp Sept 1939 - Dec 1939, 1940-1943 1939:700 1939:13 [45]
Sobibor Poland Extermination camp May 1942 – Oct 1943 200,000 max. [46]
Soldau Poland Labor; Transit camp Winter 1939/40 – Jan 1945 30,000 13,000
Stutthof Poland Labor camp Sep 1939 – May 1945 110,000 65,000 list [47]
Theresienstadt
(Terezín) Czech Republic Transit camp and Ghetto Nov 1941 – May 1945 140,000 35,000 min. [48]
Treblinka Poland Extermination camp Jul 1942 – Nov 1943 870,000 [49]
Vaivara Estonia Concentration and transit camp 15 Sep 1943 – 29 Feb 1944 20,000 950 22 [50] [51]
Warsaw Poland Labor and extermination camp 1942–1944 400,000 max. 200,000 max.
Westerbork Netherlands Transit camp May 1940 – Apr 1945 102,000 [52]

 

[Edward]

I don't want to stray into politics but I have real concerns about re-enactors. At an event in the UK I saw a black man dressed in a full Luftwaffe general's uniform. Most bizarre.

That guy must really get around because, I swear, I must have seen him (or his cousin!) at an event here in the US, only he was wearing an SS uniform! :doh:

Maybe channeling Samuel L Jackson as The Octopus?

It does seem rather bizarre. Maybe ignorance, though I could also see how someone so obviously from one of the groups the Nazis hated could find it hilarious to disrespect them (as they would see it) in that manner. Most likely, though, it's all part of WW2 passing into the zone of "all good fun and fancy dress", which is how most seem to see it today. Not that that's necessarily a good thing.

I'm not pro-SS re-enactor or anything (frankly, I don't 'get' it, and never have), but simply can't portray an entire time period and then say, "Oh, half of you can't show up, we don't like the other part." How silly would a Napoleonic re-enactment be if, say, the French weren't allow to attend because France did something back then to annoy the rest of Europe... oh wait, they did, didn't they?
I'm reminded of an event where a group was invited to put on a public battle. The problem was, they didn't want Axis forces. I asked how we'd accomplish that without looking like the US and Brits had turned on each other (or perhaps re-enacting the US Revolution taking place in 1944). The people trying to put it on just sat there with shocked expressions. They honestly hadn't thought that part out!

Plausibly, but as has been said several times over, the SS were not the mainline of German forces. Them not being portrayed is not remotely comparable to re-enacting only one side in Vietnam, or the US Civil War, or whatever.

It's undoubtedly a more sensitive subject in Europe - unsurprisingly so, given that a number of countries were either occupied by or under serious threat of occupation by Nazi Germany.

Honestly, this sort of thing is one of the reasons I've moved from WWII to Great War. That and the fact that most events these days seem to ignore the fact that the war was the most horrific event in human history in favour of people dancing in daylight on a railway station platform to "In The Mood".

Yes, that is what bothers me most. When day to day the most common reference to WW2 is now more likely to be some cheap political jibe by the obvious anti-crowd, this sort of thing really is sad. The notion that the true horror of it all, and the true reasons why the war was fought, might disappear into a puff of nonsensical fancy dress and jingoism is truly disturbing.

That said, I think there is a place for Waffen-SS, but it needs an intelligent and sensitive approach. Alas in the UK they are inevitably portrayed by the sort of person (for some reason they are often from Burnley) who invariably refers to himself as "Like Marmite - you either love me or you hate me" (a phrase that usually means, in fact, that everybody hates you) and is proud of his tactlessness, declaring that he "calls a spade a spade" - though by spade he is less likely to be talking about gardening implements and more gentlemen of African/Carribbean ancestry.

It's certainly true that there is a certain type which appears to see the quasi-respectable sheen of "re-enactment" as an excuse to dabble with some very unpleasant stuff.

Some of my Grandmother's family died in the concentration Camps. I'm not asking for sympathy, just setting the scene. I re-enact (now WWII, yet), and feel a bit queesy about SS re-enactors. As has been suggested they have made a conscious choice to represent some of histories nastiest people. But then I've done Roman and also Napoleonic Imperial Guard. I think we all should be willing to answer hard questions about motivations.

But then again the destruction of stuff, such as your tie pin are worrying. What happens if everyone does this, and there are no artifacts left? We mustn't let history forget through lack of evidence. Even a tie pin might cause someone, as you did, to think about what it represents.

I'm inclined to agree. It's one thing to object to these things being used in certain ways, or worn as marks of support for certain ideologies; I can also certainly appreciate distaste at such things being used to turn a profit. That said, I find the destruction of historical artifacts of any sort unconscionable. It doesn't achieve anything - except perhaps to remove more evidence of the evil that was done, which in the long run is a boon to the revisionists.

 

[alsendk]

I'm inclined to agree. It's one thing to object to these things being used in certain ways, or worn as marks of support for certain ideologies; I can also certainly appreciate distaste at such things being used to turn a profit. That said, I find the destruction of historical artifacts of any sort unconscionable. It doesn't achieve anything - except perhaps to remove more evidence of the evil that was done, which in the long run is a boon to the revisionists.[/QUOTE]

I do see your point about this matter Edward, and have to agree with you, But I just hate to see these nazi symbols hanging on maladjusted people regardless which country they come from

 

[1961MJS]

Hey, the Nazi's had what are arguably the absolute BEST looking uniforms in history, especially the Black uniform.

It even looked good on fat 50 year old bureaucrats. You may not LIKE that, but there it is.

The Nazi Party including the SS was also one of the worst, most evil, strangest organization ever conceived. I don't know about you guys, but it's difficult if not impossible to look at one and not see the other. Good Grief, Himmler couldn't even make money raising chickens...

Later

 

[1961MJS]

...
NAMES OF NAZI EXTERMINATION CAMPS INSIDE EUROPE

Camp name Country (today) Camp type Dates of use Est. prisoners Est. deaths Sub-camps Webpage
Alderney Channel Islands Labor camps Jan 1942 – Jun 1944 6,000 700 Lager Borkum, Lager Helgoland, Lager Norderney, Lager Sylt [2]
Amersfoort Netherlands Transit camp and prison Aug 1941 – Apr 1945 35,000 1,000 [3]
Arbeitsdorf Germany Labor camp 8 Apr 1942 – 11 Oct 1942 600 min. none
Auschwitz-Birkenau Poland Extermination and labor camp Apr 1940 – Jan 1945 135,000 min.[4] in August 1944 1,100,000 min.[5] out of 6,000,000 rec. arrivals [6] list of 48 sub-camps with description at the Auschwitz-Birkenau State Museum [7] [4] [5] [7] [6][52]

Hi again

Is this the list of stuff that is still around to see? I certainly wasn't aware of much besides Buchenwald and Auschwitz.

Thanks

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

How on earth grown up men of today wishes to flash their purchased nazi uniforms in front of good people is something I will never learn to understand.

Ideology and politics notwithstanding, perhaps even an adolescent desire to offend just for the sake of being offensive. With "grown up" being a relative term.

 

[p51]

When day to day the most common reference to WW2 is now more likely to be some cheap political jibe by the obvious anti-crowd, this sort of thing really is sad.

Not just political, "Godwin's law" is well-supported that you'll see it online all the time as well: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

That said, I find the destruction of historical artifacts of any sort unconscionable. It doesn't achieve anything - except perhaps to remove more evidence of the evil that was done, which in the long run is a boon to the revisionists.

But isn't it revisionist as well to say, "We want to show what the uniforms and equipment of WW2 looked like... EXCEPT the ones we don't like."

 

[Fastuni]

Hey, the Nazi's had what are arguably the absolute BEST looking uniforms in history, especially the Black uniform.

It even looked good on fat 50 year old bureaucrats. You may not LIKE that, but there it is.

Meh... That's up for debate... there were many sharp and interesting uniform designs in the 1930-40's across the world, that rate IMO aesthetically higher (purely subjective of course).

For the love of heaven I don't understand the adoration the Nazi uniforms receive. And I'm just talking about those "fans" with "aesthetic" reasons. The motives of those with "fitting" political inclinations are transparent.

Many, if not most of them, were downright ugly (the whole SA, Brownshirt thing is pretty shoddy - as is the swastika armband).

The most fawned over uniform - black SS uniform - is in my opinion entirely overrated - as is the whole pseudo-mythology around it (i.e. the widespread false notion that "Hugo Boss designed them".)
It was a pretty standard design for the time - similar uniform ensembles (also in black or navy) with the 4-pocket pattern, breeches, riding boots and visor cap were to be found in numerous police or other government organizations across the world. In any case it was nothing "groundbreaking".

The "mystique" surrounding them is entirely due to the organization it symbolizes and was built up by (especially post-war) Hollywood flicks. Add to this the "fetish" SM-aspect.

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

It seems that the Nazis attempted to emulate the British when designing their uniforms, the most notable features being the open collar tunic and the Sam Browne belt which shows the British influence as they first introduced that style of uniform during World War I.

 

[Fastuni]

Yes, the open-collar + tie was indeed rather "unteutonic".
This configuration (Sam Browne, open collar tunic in blue/grey/black, boots and breeches, visor cap) was also predated by various late-20's early-30's American police/state trooper/National Guard uniforms (and many other law enforcement uniforms across the globe).

New Jersey:

njspmuseum.blogspot.de

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

You read my mind.

 

[Edward]

I do see your point about this matter Edward, and have to agree with you, But I just hate to see these nazi symbols hanging on maladjusted people regardless which country they come from

I know what you mean.

Ideology and politics notwithstanding, perhaps even an adolescent desire to offend just for the sake of being offensive. With "grown up" being a relative term.

Absolutely. Those of the Punk Rock Class of '77 who adopted elements of Nazi regalia, although fewer in numbers than popularly believed now, did so purely for its capability to cause offence. Bearing in mind that many of their parents would have been of an age to have lived through, even fought in, the War, adopting the symbolism of an enemy you had grown up hearing about as "the ultimate evil" has an obvious power as a symbol of rejection of the previous generation and that for which they stand. I wore a swastika briefly myself when I was fourteen, and I was never in truth a Nazi, simply acutely aware of the power of symbols to shock. I wouldn't go there now, but, well... we all have to grow up, don't we?

Not just political, "Godwin's law" is well-supported that you'll see it online all the time as well: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

Oh, yes - Godwin's law is an old friend. It's especially common over here for people who want to think they're clever making moronic points with regards to particular supra-national organisations. "We fought a war against them to stop them telling us what to do blah blah blah hot air".

But isn't it revisionist as well to say, "We want to show what the uniforms and equipment of WW2 looked like... EXCEPT the ones we don't like."

It's all context. Turning up at most events dressed as SS is no different than turning up at a US Civil War re-enactment in KKK robes and claiming to be "representing history". There's a place - on screen, on film, in museums - for this sort of thing, but it's all about context. The event referred to in the OP is effectively a fancy dress party. There's no historical education going on there. TBH, though, the revisionism I'd be far more worried about relates more to the portrayal of the Allied side, but that's a whole nother can o'worms.

It seems that the Nazis attempted to emulate the British when designing their uniforms, the most notable features being the open collar tunic and the Sam Browne belt which shows the British influence as they first introduced that style of uniform during World War I.

The Sam Browne is a real design classic. A purely utilitarian design in origin, which of course now has a whole stylistic cachet to it. I'm not sure there are many armed forces in the world who don't have at least some sort of adaptation of it in some of their uniforms. Even among un-uniformed forces... it was particularly popular in Ireland among both the early IRA during the War of Independence (1919-1923), and the Anti-Treaty rebels of the 1922-23 Civil War. The latter were ranged against the new Free State Army, who of course (as their IVF, ICA, and many other forbears) also wore them. It surely has to be one of the most universal pieces of military kit on the go?

 

[p51]

It's all context. Turning up at most events dressed as SS is no different than turning up at a US Civil War re-enactment in KKK robes and claiming to be "representing history".

Actually, there's a huge difference there. The SS was in WW2, like it or not.
The Klan, however, didn't even exist until after the US Civil War was over... :eusa_doh:

 

[1961MJS]

Wow, the New Jersey State Police are Starship Troopers. I guess that in a way, the Nazi uniform isn't that much different that a 1920 and 1930 period Police Uniform. The German Police were incorporated into the SS sometime well before the war started so that makes some sense (odd for the Nazi's...).

Interesting that the Nazi's started with the Brown shirts, who DID have an ugly uniform.

I've met some fairly racist types, and none were ever in a full (or even partial) Nazi Uniform. Most have a Swastika on there clothing or tattooed, but usually not much more than that. The only KKK member I've ever met (that I was sure was KKK) was wearing jeans with a KKK T-shirt that looked like it was drawn by the Far Side guy.

Later

 

[Dixon Cannon]

Meh... That's up for debate... there were many sharp and interesting uniform designs in the 1930-40's across the world, that rate IMO aesthetically higher (purely subjective of course).

For the love of heaven I don't understand the adoration the Nazi uniforms receive. And I'm just talking about those "fans" with "aesthetic" reasons. The motives of those with "fitting" political inclinations are transparent.

Many, if not most of them, were downright ugly (the whole SA, Brownshirt thing is pretty shoddy - as is the swastika armband).

The most fawned over uniform - black SS uniform - is in my opinion entirely overrated - as is the whole pseudo-mythology around it (i.e. the widespread false notion that "Hugo Boss designed them".)
It was a pretty standard design for the time - similar uniform ensembles (also in black or navy) with the 4-pocket pattern, breeches, riding boots and visor cap were to be found in numerous police or other government organizations across the world. In any case it was nothing "groundbreaking".

The "mystique" surrounding them is entirely due to the organization it symbolizes and was built up by (especially post-war) Hollywood flicks. Add to this the "fetish" SM-aspect.

Wow, Fastuni! The most agreeable part of that post was the "IMO". -dixon cannon

 

[Fastuni]

Subjective aesthetic preferences are not supposed to be agreed upon.
I just don't partake in the gushing and fawning over "snappy" Nazi uniforms, which were yet another variation of the period's standard formula for "authority exuding" uniforms.

If you want to contest that the SS uniform was an overall pretty banal design for it's time, you may point out what was so stunningly extraordinary or innovative about it...

Without the organization and "ideas" it represents, the uniform wouldn't garner any significant interest - that's the point.
Would as many folks care about it if i.e. a fire police marching band would have worn the very same design?