Frock coats

[Edward]

Sir, you are missing out on a great deal if you would (if you will excuse the pun) cut out the frock coat!

Oh, don't discount them entirely, I simply don't believe they are a garment that suit many people - on most, in my opinion (naturally, yous may vary), tails are muxch more flattering on the average modern person, including myself. The frock coat is of course perfect for an earlier Victorian / Edwardian look, though that's not one for which I would typically opt.

 

[bobalooba]

It appealed to me for many reasons you have listed and as for the lengthening and shortening of figure I've never much cared, I wear a long trench coat belted at the waist and it looks fine and I have worn short jackets that look fine.

What I really love about frock coats is that they are so unique without being bizzare. They have slipped out of common usage because of the time period but I think they are coats which will always retain a classic appeal.

 

[dr greg]

It's all down to one's tailor, chaps.

 

[bobalooba]

This is really neat. Where did you find it?

 

[Dixon Cannon]

Well, it's a done deal...

I was in Liverpool, Merseyside, England last week and visited the shop on Matthew Street to order my Frock Coat. I got remeasured and put my money down. It should be completed by August I'm told due to a shortage of the proper material - which is fine here as it is over 100f already in the Arizona desert.

I have had a desire for this garment for three decades and now I'm in the final stages of possession. Crazy ain't it?!

Oh yeh. We saw some old historic stuff in London and Paris too - can't remember any of it though! lol

-dixon cannon

 

[dr greg]

This is really neat. Where did you find it?

About 30 years ago I decided I wanted one, and consulted a tailor, he had no patterns so I hunted up this one at the library and photocopied it, but I think something happened like my father had a heart attack and I had to move home in a hurry or something like that so it just fell off the radar, and it's been sitting in my files ever since......it took a fair bit of digging to find it lemme tall ya.

 

[bobalooba]

About 30 years ago I decided I wanted one, and consulted a tailor, he had no patterns so I hunted up this one at the library and photocopied it, but I think something happened like my father had a heart attack and I had to move home in a hurry or something like that so it just fell off the radar, and it's been sitting in my files ever since......it took a fair bit of digging to find it lemme tall ya.

well thanks, it is very interesting and will help me in my attempts to make one.

Do you happen to know what year it was from?

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Do you happen to know what year it was from?

I'd say it was from between 1905 and 1910.


.

 

[dr greg]

I danced with a girl who danced with a man.....

Do you happen to know what year it was from?

Like the man said above I reckon Edwardian, I can imagine the legendary Bertie swanning about in one, although I think he was a bit more portly than the dandies illustrated!

 

[bobalooba]

I think it's interesting you would find this in a library, were you in the UK or stateside at the time?

 

[the_imperialist]

As a frock coat aficianado may I offer my two cents.

(I assure you in person I am not as obnoxious nor as pretentious as I appear )

I can personally attest the many wonderful qualities of a frock coat, it flatters any wearers figure due to its cut (waist seam and the panels at the back [I have no idea the technical terms....]), if the wearer so wish, it can seemlessly blend in with any surroundings, the material (baretha or broadcloth, I can never tell...) keeps me warm in winter, cool in summer, but best of all, I just feel so darn good in one. As of now, I own two with a third one on its way... they're great.

To answer your other questions, to my knowledge, frock coats were military in origin being worn with a standing collar, gradually becoming more widespread during the middle of the 19th century, declining towards the end. It was during the edwardian era that they begin to enjoy a mild revival amongst the higher crusts of society, but that was cut abrubtly short by the great war.

Within its long span, there were many subtle changes. During the early 1800s the waist was particularly clinched and positioned slightly lower effectively elongating the upper torso. Furthermore, the sleeves seem to have more of a mutton leg effect [again with the lacking of proper terms...] with collars appearing taller and stiffer accomodating the popular stocks and parricide collars.

To my knowledge they gradually lost their defined silhouette, becoming more straight, lapels became less broad and buttoning stances creeping higher. But I digress.

They are still readily avaliable, sometimes you find them floating around on ebay, but particularly on german ebay listed either as 'gehrock' or 'frack' I have seen some go high as 100 euros and as low as 10 euros. I do wish you the best in your frock coating (?) endevours.

N.B: being body coats, it is nigh impossible to get one that fits perfectly outside of bespoke. That as it may, the construction is generally of such quality that it is still superior to many existing garments.

 

[dr greg]

Down south

I think it's interesting you would find this in a library, were you in the UK or stateside at the time?

No, it was here, in Sydney actually, they have a pretty amazing library there, I can't remember if it was in the Mitchell section or not.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/sacharules/2564701784/

 

[bobalooba]

As a frock coat aficianado may I offer my two cents.

(I assure you in person I am not as obnoxious nor as pretentious as I appear )

.

I wouldn't say obnoxious or pretentious, you look refined and dapper

 

[Dr H]

Frock Coat Patterns

About 30 years ago I decided I wanted one, and consulted a tailor, he had no patterns so I hunted up this one at the library and photocopied it, but I think something happened like my father had a heart attack and I had to move home in a hurry or something like that so it just fell off the radar, and it's been sitting in my files ever since......it took a fair bit of digging to find it lemme tall ya.

Interesting thread. I have a dozens of patterns to share if anybody wants anything in particular. During the 1990s, I had the good fortune to buy a series of volumes from my tailor who was about to retire (he had been in business for many years and his father had preceeded him). These are 'The Tailor and Cutter Academy Systems of Cutting' (WDF Vincent published by Williamson pre-war, probably ca. 1900-1910 based on the designs therein) and three volumes of the 'The Modern Tailor Outfitter and Clothier'' published by Caxton (post war, probably late 1940s).
Ian

 

[metropd]

I wouldn't say obnoxious or pretentious, you look refined and dapper

I agree.

 

[bobalooba]

Interesting thread. I have a dozens of patterns to share if anybody wants anything in particular. During the 1990s, I had the good fortune to buy a series of volumes from my tailor who was about to retire (he had been in business for many years and his father had preceeded him). These are 'The Tailor and Cutter Academy Systems of Cutting' (WDF Vincent published by Williamson pre-war, probably ca. 1900-1910 based on the designs therein) and three volumes of the 'The Modern Tailor Outfitter and Clothier'' published by Caxton (post war, probably late 1940s).
Ian

I know which pattern I want to use but if it isn't too much trouble could you share any single breasted patterns from that era?

I wanna see if what I'm using matches up.

 

[David V]

Everything you ever wanted to know (and probable more) about formal day wear (which includes the frock coat)

http://www.cutterandtailor.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=47

http://www.cutterandtailor.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=96

 

[bobalooba]

I know which pattern I want to use but if it isn't too much trouble could you share any single breasted patterns from that era?

I wanna see if what I'm using matches up.

also, I was planning to use a wool/gabardine blend. Is this heavier or lighter than the fabrics used in the olden days?

 

[bobalooba]

also, I was planning to use a wool/gabardine blend. Is this heavier or lighter than the fabrics used in the olden days?

anybody know?

 

[MisterCairo]

Does it come with the sheep dog, the 20s Stetson, and the LSD?

The sheep dog is "Martha", Paul's dog and inspiration for the White Album song "Martha my Dear".

She died in 1980, a ripe old age of about 14 as I recall.

Can't say what happened to their stash of LSD.....