FQHH - loosening/stretching?

[rockandrollrabbit]

Hi everyone. I wanted some perspectives from those of you familiar with this hide. I'm close to ordering a Premier fit Bootlegger. I'm after a trimmer fit, and if I can anticipate some stretch and give after the leather breaks in, I will definitely factor that into the sizing, and probably go with a P2P measurement that will start out rather snug.

I recall reading one of the members here stating that initially his FQHH jacket was very snug, but after it loosened up he thought it might even be a little large. My chest measures 45 inches with a deep breath, and I figured I would specify to Holly that I'm after a P2P of 23, whichever size that would work out to being in the Premier fit (44 most likely?).

That would probably be a very close fit, and loosening up would make it just right. If my expectations of stretching and giving room are overblown, I may want a P2P of 24. Can you FQHH owners advise me on what to expect out of this hide with respect to loosening up? As always, much thanks in advance, and I hope everyone had a happy Holiday season.

 

[Psant25]

I feel like for my cxl hh jackets as they break in they do conform, but I do not feel that they really stretch. I feel like after rain and sun just normal wear the loose areas kind of pull in and the shoulders and chest remain about the same. Really subjective. Measurement wise there is no increase in pit to pit or shoulder with wear. I like a looser cut. If I cant layer and move in a jacket it is gone. I am pretty trim/fit but the premier jackets dont work for me.

 

[Monitor]

Hi!

FQHH will soften with wear but it won't stretch. Leather, in general, doesn't stretch. It breaks in more at stress points which might give an illusion that it had stretched but it didn't.
Leather jacket that's too tight will always feel too tight and no amount of wearing is ever going to help.

Edit: Yeah, what @Psant25 says.

 

[Carlos840]

Hi everyone. I wanted some perspectives from those of you familiar with this hide. I'm close to ordering a Premier fit Bootlegger. I'm after a trimmer fit, and if I can anticipate some stretch and give after the leather breaks in, I will definitely factor that into the sizing, and probably go with a P2P measurement that will start out rather snug.

I recall reading one of the members here stating that initially his FQHH jacket was very snug, but after it loosened up he thought it might even be a little large. My chest measures 45 inches with a deep breath, and I figured I would specify to Holly that I'm after a P2P of 23, whichever size that would work out to being in the Premier fit (44 most likely?).

That would probably be a very close fit, and loosening up would make it just right. If my expectations of stretching and giving room are overblown, I may want a P2P of 24. Can you FQHH owners advise me on what to expect out of this hide with respect to loosening up? As always, much thanks in advance, and I hope everyone had a happy Holiday season.

In my experience breaking in many leather jackets including a few CXL one, this is a bad idea.
Leather does not really stretch, it will conform to your body, but you will not get significant stretch like you would with denim for example. When people say loosen up they mean going from card board to soft, not stretching.
I also don't get how you expect to fit in a P2P of 23" with a 45" chest. My chest is 41" inhaled and i usually aim for 22 to 23" pit to pit. Standard chest ease is around 4.5", meaning a 45" chest should have a pit to pit of around 24.5" to 25".
To me fitting a 45" chest into 23" P2P sounds like madness....

 

[zebedee]

If you order it too tight initially, it's not going to relent into a more comfortable fit unless you lose weight.

 

[willyto]

We’ve seen some people here who have streched leather jackets at the waist by getting them wet and slowly wearing it with a towel. I recall seeing that not long ago from someone I can’t remember.


I am actually doing it with my Lewis Leathers universal because it is long and hits my hips, It is working but is slow and it’s not much. Barely noticeable but it is also a very different leather.

Leather does stretch and it happens, you can see it on dress shoes and boots all the time. It’s not something you should rely on before purchasing though. That’s a bad idea.

 

[rockandrollrabbit]

Good feedback. I guess where I was going with this is, with a resting chest measurement if around 43, a 46 jacket chest sounded reasonable, if snug. My Bronco has a P2P of 24, and it's trim, but I could conceive of losing an inch, if I had to. I most definitely wouldn't want to if it led to an uncomfortable jacket I wouldn't want to wear! But you can see below that I've still got breathing room in the this fit.

Granted, this is Vicenza. I'm certain FQHH is far less forgiving.

 

[Guppy]

This is such a difficult question to answer, but the answer is more or less, it depends + who knows.

Some anecdotals:

I've purchased a few new leather jackets that initially I felt were too tight for me to wear, and within just a few hours of wearing them, they had already begun to relax, and over time they now feel extremely comfortable. I wouldn't say that the leather stretched, exactly -- "relaxed" is really the right word for it. As the stiffness gives way, the jacket molds to the form of the wearer, and extra space "magically" appears, because the leather is following the curves of your body much more closely than it could when it was still very stiff. If I had sized up on these, I would have gotten a poor fit. My initial impression was that I was going to need to do a return and have it remade. I'm glad I held off and gave it time. It really wasn't much time. If you're talking about heavy CXL FQHH, it will take more time.

Others report that they get a new jacket and it is so tight that they can't wear it. They sometimes describe that it is uncomfortable or even painful to wear. Could it be that they just didn't give it enough of a chance to break in? Sure. Could it be that it really was too small? Of course. How could I tell, based on reading something filtered through someone else' experience and decision making, whether their situation was like mine, only they took the other fork, or if their situation was similar to mine, but different and they really had a too-small jacket that wouldn't work for them? Or what if a snug, form fitting jacket just wasn't what they were really after?

I expect none of this really gets you any further in deciding what you should do. So what should you do?

You should talk to the experts and rely on them. Whether that's Holly at Aero, or Carrie at Thurston Bros. Take your measurements wearing the bulkiest clothing you'd want to be able to wear under the jacket. Have someone assist you with getting the measurements right, and make sure they're someone who knows what they're doing. Relate those measurements accurately, and describe the fit you're trying to achieve, and they'll tell you what size to start out with. If you can get a fit jacket in that size, do that. And expect it to get better after you've worn it for a bit.

 

[Monitor]

Style of a leather jacket matters just as much.

Bootlegger isn't an A-2.

A-2 has as much shape as a potato bag. There's no drop from chest to waist and what little there is is regulated by the elastic band so it really isn't a good style to base your desired fit on.
Bootlegger, on the other hand is a lot more shapely jacket with tapered silhouette. So that inch that seemed you might lose on an A-2 might end up making the Bootlegger unbearably snug and no amount of wear will ever fix that.

 

[rockandrollrabbit]

This is such a difficult question to answer, but the answer is more or less, it depends + who knows.

Some anecdotals:

I've purchased a few new leather jackets that initially I felt were too tight for me to wear, and within just a few hours of wearing them, they had already begun to relax, and over time they now feel extremely comfortable. I wouldn't say that the leather stretched, exactly -- "relaxed" is really the right word for it. As the stiffness gives way, the jacket molds to the form of the wearer, and extra space "magically" appears, because the leather is following the curves of your body much more closely than it could when it was still very stiff. If I had sized up on these, I would have gotten a poor fit. My initial impression was that I was going to need to do a return and have it remade. I'm glad I held off and gave it time. It really wasn't much time. If you're talking about heavy CXL FQHH, it will take more time.

Others report that they get a new jacket and it is so tight that they can't wear it. They sometimes describe that it is uncomfortable or even painful to wear. Could it be that they just didn't give it enough of a chance to break in? Sure. Could it be that it really was too small? Of course. How could I tell, based on reading something filtered through someone else' experience and decision making, whether their situation was like mine, only they took the other fork, or if their situation was similar to mine, but different and they really had a too-small jacket that wouldn't work for them? Or what if a snug, form fitting jacket just wasn't what they were really after?

I expect none of this really gets you any further in deciding what you should do. So what should you do?

You should talk to the experts and rely on them. Whether that's Holly at Aero, or Carrie at Thurston Bros. Take your measurements wearing the bulkiest clothing you'd want to be able to wear under the jacket. Have someone assist you with getting the measurements right, and make sure they're someone who knows what they're doing. Relate those measurements accurately, and describe the fit you're trying to achieve, and they'll tell you what size to start out with. If you can get a fit jacket in that size, do that. And expect it to get better after you've worn it for a bit.

Your distinction between stretching and relaxing is spot on. That makes perfect sense. The extra room some people perceive after breaking in is the jacket settling, so to speak.

 

[rockandrollrabbit]

Style of a leather jacket matters just as much.

Bootlegger isn't an A-2.

A-2 has as much shape as a potato bag. There's no drop from chest to waist and what little there is is regulated by the elastic band so it really isn't a good style to base your desired fit on.
Bootlegger, on the other hand is a lot more shapely jacket with tapered silhouette. So that inch that seemed you might lose on an A-2 might end up making the Bootlegger unbearably snug and no amount of wear will ever fix that.

I hear you. I will most definitely be giving my measurements to Holly - including stomach and waist - and heeding her advice.

 

[FlatCap99]

Thickness is also going to play a role in the stretch/form of the leather. I can take 3oz CXL leather and easily stretch it, but you are also competing with the fact that the leather is rolled over itself in some areas, stitched, and lined,. So even if you do manage to get a slight stretch on the leather, it will end up being minimal. I would probably only go this route on a jacket that fit 95% perfectly. I did have this issue with a cafe racer I bought. The entire jacket fit perfect, but the splay at the bottom was too small it I couldn't get it to stretch around the top of my hips much like Willyto is trying to work out of his jacket now. I am hoping he has better luck than I did, but mine was also a thick CXL Steer jacket.

One option you may have is ordering a size up and then reducing the side panels (if any) by .5" so you essentially get a jacket that would be in between sizes. I did this with one of my Aero Sevens that I wanted to be able to lightly layer under and ended up with basically, the equivalent of a 41 jacket. To Monitor's point, the style of jacket will depend on whether or not you can do this because not all jackets have panels you can easily make that modification to.

 

[rockandrollrabbit]

Thickness is also going to play a role in the stretch/form of the leather. I can take 3oz CXL leather and easily stretch it, but you are also competing with the fact that the leather is rolled over itself in some areas, stitched, and lined,. So even if you do manage to get a slight stretch on the leather, it will end up being minimal. I would probably only go this route on a jacket that fit 95% perfectly. I did have this issue with a cafe racer I bought. The entire jacket fit perfect, but the splay at the bottom was too small it I couldn't get it to stretch around the top of my hips much like Willyto is trying to work out of his jacket now. I am hoping he has better luck than I did, but mine was also a thick CXL Steer jacket.

One option you may have is ordering a size up and then reducing the side panels (if any) by .5" so you essentially get a jacket that would be in between sizes. I did this with one of my Aero Sevens that I wanted to be able to lightly layer under and ended up with basically, the equivalent of a 41 jacket. To Monitor's point, the style of jacket will depend on whether or not you can do this because not all jackets have panels you can easily make that modification to.

The Bootlegger does though. That's a good option too. I've definitely become enamored of the Premier fit for this jacket. I've got another BL that I sized for layering, which I've posted about. I'm after trimmer for this one. Thanks.

 

[Carlos840]

I have had this jacket for a while, have tried everything i could to stretch the shoulders and chest and nothing has worked:
https://www.thefedoralounge.com/threads/fs-freewheelers-san-mateo-peters-aviator-jacket.97651/

When i bought my fairst pair of Frye engineer i was told by the salesman that i should buy them tight and they would stretch to my foot.

In both cases, i could not get any stretch out of the items and ended up not wearing them, the boots hurt me for weeks and never got comfortable, the jacket i can still not lift my arms in.

IMO leather doesn't stretch, you will bust your lining and your zipper before you stretch anything.

 

[regius]

Seems a common plight here, I was just thinking about stretching while wearing the “correct” size Aero FQHH R66. When you handle a piece of CXL sample, it would stretch very easily, making you think that it’s stretch too easily to maintain any form at all, but, when it’s made into a jacket, the stretching becomes a different story. Each panel is no longer stretched along its grain (actually, perpendicular to its grain), but the whole formation is stretch in a micro-scale, & it’s in any & all direction. Say, the maker positions the undersleeve panel grain-lengthwise, meaning that the grain runs alongside the length of the sleeve, then you’d get very little lengthwise stretch on the sleeves as you bend the elbow, compared to if the sleeve piece is positioned perpendicular (against) to grain. However, because the elbow is a pointed tip, there will be some “against grain” stretch happening at the elbow point. Technically I think the back panel should be cut against grain, this that the grain runs up & down the back, this way, you reach forward (pulling the back sideways), & you can easily get horizontal stretching


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[willyto]

Leather does stretch. Another thing is that leather turned into a jacket wich a bunch of seams and stitching everywhere won’t stretch as easily or any at all because the seams prevent it and I’m sure the type of leather matters a lot.

Sleeves of my Himel goatskin jacket have stretched at the elbows for example. Shoes and boots do stretch too but it obviously needs time and lots of walking.

I couldn’t fit any finger let alone both hands in this jacket and now I can because I did it very very carefully and didn’t zip the Jacket but used the snaps instead. It stretched all around because what I did was soak the whole area including the liner, put a towel around me and close the jacket while I was sleeping. I left it be and wore it normal through the day, then at night did the same but with the towel turned up which meant 2 layers. I don’t think i need to do it again and don’t want to push my luck.

Really I can’t remember the user name but it was a vintage Cafe Racer that was way too tight in the waist/hips and it stretched to the point of fitting very well.

Bear in mind I’m not wearing the appropriate trousers(wide with pleats).

It is barely noticeable in a front shot but believe me, I couldn’t even sit without the bottom pressing my hips hard and now I can sit comfortably and can fit my fingers in it. Excuse the crappy pics.

@Carlos840 can confirm how tapered this jacket is!

Having said all that I do not recommend this to anyone. I just couldn’t accept that the jacket fit me so well(on the slim side, I am able to move my arms freely and hug myself) in the upper body but didn’t at the bottom. Would be a long time until I could order a custom Lewis Leathers or find one that fit me better.

 

[regius]

The Lewis cowhide is one of the most stretchy leather in my opinion, & they certainly positioned the back panel anti-grain (such that the grain runs up & down), when I hold the jacket & let it hang sideways, I can feel the back getting expanded simply by gravity & weight of the rest of the jacket


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[rockandrollrabbit]

These perspectives from experience are exactly what I'm looking for. Thanks guys.

 

[El Marro]

IMO leather doesn't stretch, you will bust your lining and your zipper before you stretch anything.

This is my thought as well. My first Langlitz Columbia was made just a hair too tight for me. I tried to stretch it a bit by wearing a couple vests and a sweater underneath it while doing every upper body stretch I could think of. All to no avail, in the end I sent it back for a remake.
I know you are shooting for a trim fit this time around but I would be careful about erring on the side of too trim here.

 

[navetsea]

if the panel is minimal like one piece back and jacket has no horizontal seam across the torso like yoke or chest pocket, then across the body it probably can stretch a little if the leather is soft from water or oil, you see a 4mm thick veg tanned belt stretched and end up curved following your pants higher back and lower front rise. but if the jacket has multi paneled torso with more stitching all these would give more structure and your jacket wont stretch much. also jacket with button feels like they stretch more maybe because the button is moving more to the edge after you button them and the button neck is stretching gave in over time