Formal Wear Primer

[Rathdown]

Shades of Gilbert & Sullivan

With regards to host vs guest it's entirely down to the individual. In the UK the wearing of foreign state formal wear is encouraged and if there is a difference in custom/tradition then it is never frowned upon if you conform the highest of formality for that country. Personally, if I was the guest at a state banquet abroad, I would conform to the custom practiced by the host country.

Why? Would you feel somehow inadequate if your MBE wasn't hanging from a triangular ribbon at a state banquet in Berlin? Is there something so inherently bad about having been decorated by your country that you wish to hide that fact from foreigners? Bad form to do that, especially in the UK where the wearing of foreign orders, decorations, or medals, requires the approval of Her Majesty; should an American show up for a dinner at the Palace with his medals mounted "court style" he would give the impression (until he spoke) that he was British, and wearing foreign medals. This would result in an equerry taking the individual aside and asking him to remove them in the presence of Her Majesty. Once it was ascertained that the person wearing the medals was not a British subject, the matter would be dropped, along with a hint that, perhaps, if invited back, it might be more appropriate to wear the medals in some other manner.

Medals should be worn according the custom of one's country... unless one wishes to convey the impression that they are the sort of person Gilbert and Sullivan were thinking of when they had the Lord High Executioner sing,

"...the idiot who praises, with enthusiastic tone, all centuries but this and every country but his own..."

 

[Phileas Fogg]

Well, here is some more information on how to wear the riband, unfortunately it is on German but coming from a German website (http://ordensmuseum.de/bundesverdienstorden/stufen/stufe-groskreuz/)on the German Order or Merit there was not much choice.

Trageweise im Original

Herren tragen das Schulterband von der rechten Schulter zur linken Hüfte. Der Stern wird an der linken unteren Brustseite befestigt. Das Schulterband wird zum Frack getragen. Bei anderer Kleidung wird der Stern ohne Schulterband getragen. Herren tragen das Schulterband bei Anwesenheit des Bundespräsidenten über, sonst unter der Weste.

The underlined sentence means that gentlemen do wear the riband over the waistcoat if the Federal President (and Master of the Order) is there, otherwise under the waistcoat.
Yours,

Phileas Fogg

 

[Rathdown]

Dear Mr Huang and Rathdown,

regarding orders each one has its specific rules and national "rules" are very broad and more like customs. Even British orders follow different rules, the riband of the Garter and the riband of Saint Michael and George are worn differently (the first from left to right thes econd from right to left).

As to the source of my statement highlighted in bold face (riband over or under the waistcoat) there is more than one. One is a book on how to wear decorations at the Papal Court, another are the regulations for members of the House of Savoy Orders, also I have been told that the regulations for the Order of Merit of the Italian Republic are the same. As far as I know the Order of Malta (Sovereign Military Order of Malta) follows the same custom. Still, as in most cases regulations are not strictly enforced some knights do not follow the regulations and wear their decorations as it suits them.
Let me check if I can find something on English and post it here.
Yours,

Phileas Fogg

My Dear Fogg,

Perhaps you could supply the name of the book you have referenced concerning the wearing of decorations at the Papal Court? Likewise, as one who holds a decoration from the House of Savoy, I should be grateful if you could inform me of the specific regulation to which you refer? It seems to be missing from my copy of the regulations for the Order of Saints Maurice and Lazarus, nor can I find it in Antonio Spada's tome on the Savoy orders.

Most cordially,
Rathdown, Cav. Uff. SSM&L

PS: No need to bother yourself trying to find something on the English regulations for the wearing of Orders, Decorations, and Medals, as I am confident that Mr. Huang is as familiar with these as am I. == R.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

Dear Rathdown,

for now, from the "Code de la légion d'honneur et de la médaille militaire" (official French government website)

Article R67
En costume de soirée, habit civil ou militaire, l'écharpe de grand'croix se porte sur le gilet dans les cérémonies où le Président de la République, grand maître de l'ordre, est présent. Dans les autres cas, l'écharpe se porte sous le gilet d'habit.

Again, the riband (scarf here) of grand cross is worn over the waistcoat if the President of the French Republic, Grand Master of the Order, is in attendance. In (all) other cases the scarf is worn under the waistcoat.
We see, again, that the riband is worn under the waistcoat if the Grand Master is not in attendance.

As for the Savoy Order I will check and let you know (I may be mistaken as I did not double check before writing, but do please check the following books), for the Italian books there actually two very good books by Mr. Fabio Cassani Pironti, Ordini in ordine and Vestire gli Onori, both state the same thing.
Yours,

Phileas Fogg (Knight OSSML etc etc)

 

[Cobden]

Looking through a few of the books I possess that specifically concern Court Dress, Wearing of Orders, etc. by members of HM Diplomatic and Consular Services, it's fairly clear that the British custom's are expected to be adhered to. Considering that diplomats and consuls are probably the only notable contingent of Britons likely to be present at a foreign court (and, at the time of the publication, the only contingent of Britons overseas likely to be members of orders of chivalry), it does rather seem that the British expected they're own manner of dress to be the form worn abroad

 

[Rathdown]

Dear Rathdown,

for now, from the "Code de la légion d'honneur et de la médaille militaire" (official French government website)

Article R67
En costume de soirée, habit civil ou militaire, l'écharpe de grand'croix se porte sur le gilet dans les cérémonies où le Président de la République, grand maître de l'ordre, est présent. Dans les autres cas, l'écharpe se porte sous le gilet d'habit.

Again, the riband (scarf here) of grand cross is worn over the waistcoat if the President of the French Republic, Grand Master of the Order, is in attendance. In (all) other cases the scarf is worn under the waistcoat.
We see, again, that the riband is worn under the waistcoat if the Grand Master is not in attendance.

As for the Savoy Order I will check and let you know (I may be mistaken as I did not double check before writing, but do please check the following books), for the Italian books there actually two very good books by Mr. Fabio Cassani Pironti, Ordini in ordine and Vestire gli Onori, both state the same thing.
Yours,

Phileas Fogg (Knight OSSML etc etc)

My Dear Mr. Fogg,

Thank you for the reference. I will have to ask my bookseller in Palermo to find me copies of Pironti's books.

Most cordially,

Rathdown

 

[Rathdown]

Looking through a few of the books I possess that specifically concern Court Dress, Wearing of Orders, etc. by members of HM Diplomatic and Consular Services, it's fairly clear that the British custom's are expected to be adhered to. Considering that diplomats and consuls are probably the only notable contingent of Britons likely to be present at a foreign court (and, at the time of the publication, the only contingent of Britons overseas likely to be members of orders of chivalry), it does rather seem that the British expected they're own manner of dress to be the form worn abroad

Dear Mr. Cobden,

You have raised one or two excellent points which, perhaps, should be amplified for the sake of disambiguity. As I understand it members of HM Diplomatic Service and Armed Forces are required to conform at all times, and in all places, to the regulations set forth for the wearing of orders, decorations, and medals (per The Queen's Orders of Chivalry by Sir Ivan de la Bere). All Commonwealth nations (where HM is Head of State) also conform to these regulations; those States formerly part of the Empire, whether a member of the Commonwealth or not, where HM is not the Head of State, conform to the British Standard either by statute or customary usage.

British subjects, when wearing orders, decorations, and medals, in the presence of HM (or HMs representative, or in the presence of a member of the royal family) are required to conform to the same rules as the diplomatic corps or military services. Foreign orders, decorations, and medals, may only be accepted by British subjects with the permission of HM and may only be worn in the presence of HM with her permission. Because foreign orders are in the nature of "honorary orders", the recipient conforms to the regulations of the granting authority when visiting that country, or when attending a function at their embassy, or when attending a function where that country's head-of-state is present in an official capacity. At all other times those with unrestricted permission to wear a foreign order do so by wearing the foreign order on their miniature medal bar in order of precedence after all British and Commonwealth orders, decorations, and medals.

Foreign nationals, resident in the United Kingdom, require no permission to wear their orders, decorations, or medals, on any and all appropriate occasions. However, should they become British subjects, then the British rules would apply.

Yours, most cordially,
Rathdown

 

[Phileas Fogg]

Dear Mr Rathdown,

you are most welcome. I may add that "Vestire gli onori" has wonderful colour plates with 1:1 reproductions (drawings) of the contemporary Italian orders, all the former Italian orders currently authorized as dynastic orders by the Italian government (therefore most of the Savoy ones are missing bur both OSSA and OSSML are there) and the orders of the Holy See (including Holy Sepulchre), SMOM and San Marino.
It also has very detailed instructions on how to wear orders and decorations on almost any type of dress and uniform (including the uniforms of the Papal Swiss Guard!).
Yours,

Phileas Fogg

 

[BinkieBaumont]

[video=youtube;V96-kvbZwQk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V96-kvbZwQk[/video]

 

[Dr Kilroy]

Hello,

as long as I know, if you are wearing galosh boots with cloth tops, your socks should match the tops. Is that right?

If you are wearing spats, should socks also match them?

Thank you and best regards, Dr

 

[Charlie Huang]

I don't think it really matters as you won't be able to see the socks. But if you really wish to be anal about it then yes, they should match the cloth or be black or grey to match the trousers.

 

[MisterGrey]

Must the decorations worn with formal attire be of a military nature?

Not that I can foresee getting the chance to dress formally in the near future, but I am the recipient of some civilian service awards stemming from work I did with my city's police department. In the event I ever get to don formal attire, would it be appropriate to wear these? If so, what would be the proper way?

 

[Charlie Huang]

It depends on the nature of the decorations and the occasion as well as location (i.e. country). There's a difference between national and local awards and some might say local awards are not really 'decorations'.

 

[MisterGrey]

It depends on the nature of the decorations and the occasion as well as location (i.e. country). There's a difference between national and local awards and some might say local awards are not really 'decorations'.

Oh-- the award is a national award, it was simply given for work that I did with the local department. Specifically, I've received three Presidential Service Awards for over 500 hours of work I did with the department helping to organize and execute a new auction program and a donation program to give unclaimed bicycles from the evidence room to programs supporting at-risk youth. In addition to the paper award you also get a little medal. They've been sitting in a box ever since, and I was just wondering if there might ever come a chance to actually wear them.

 

[Rathdown]

Must the decorations worn with formal attire be of a military nature?

Not that I can foresee getting the chance to dress formally in the near future, but I am the recipient of some civilian service awards stemming from work I did with my city's police department. In the event I ever get to don formal attire, would it be appropriate to wear these? If so, what would be the proper way?

Congratulations on having received official recognition for your work in the community.

There is no requirement that awards worn with civilian attire need to be military in nature.

The awards that you have received are in the nature of a lapel pin, and as such the highest of the three awards (gold) may be worn on the left lapel of your dinner jacket. Only one lapel pin (gold) should be worn with black tie, and it should go where the button hole is, or where the button hole would be if your jacket is lacking same. The same conventions apply to day wear, with only the highest award (gold) being worn in the lapel.

Lapel pins are not worn when also wearing either miniature or full size medals.

Again, my congratulations on your well deserved award.

With my best regards,

Rathdown

 

[Rathdown]

Orders, Decorations, and Medals: a brief glossary of terms

Collectively orders, decorations, and medals are often referred to as "medals". Hopefully this will provide a bit of understanding to those interested in the subject.

ORDERS These are, for the most part, awards made to recognize the achievements of exceptionally meritorious individuals. Often, but not always, they are in the nature of knighthoods. Examples would be the British Order of St. Michael and St. George, the Order of Canada, and the French Legion d'Honeur.

DECORATIONS These are, for the most part, awards made for outstanding acts of bravery. The US Medal of Honor, the British Victoria Cross, and the German Iron Cross, are examples of this type of award.

MEDALS These are, for the most part, widely awarded to members of the military for either having taken part in a military action or campaign, or to recognize those who have achieved a level of proficiency in their military career. The WWI Victory Medal (issued by France, Belgium, and the United States in 1918) and the US Good Conduct Medal are examples of military medals.

Governments also issue non-military medals, and these have the same status as military medals, and are worn in the same manner. Likewise, many civic and private organizations issue medals and, generally speaking, these may be worn on those occasions when the wearing of medals would be socially appropriate.

Since no two countries follow identical protocols when it comes to the wearing of Orders, Decorations, or Medals by their citizens, it is advisable to check with local laws/customs before wearing "medals" to any official function.

 

[DocMustang]

I wish more folks would pay attention to the "one lapel pin" rule. I once saw a man with about 25 lapel pins on one lapel and about 10 on the other. One pin for every civic or fraternal organization to which he belonged. All these were pinned to a blue polyester blazer. It was hideous.

 

[Rathdown]

Yes, blue polyester blazers are hideous. In fact, polyester blazers in general are hideous. Sadly, multiple pins do not help. The wearing of more than one lapel pin should be avoided with the same grim determination that one would apply to the avoidance of wearing a polyester blazer in the first place.

 

[DocMustang]

Interestingly enough, that was not the most grevious outfit I saw that evening. The worst was a gentleman wearing powder blue polyester pants a grey flannel jacket with elbow patches, and a well worn poly-cotton pleated front shirt with a miniscule wing collar with a clip on red bow-tie. He was wearing brown loafers with a red canvas belt. Said flannel jacket was festooned with about 10 lapel pins. I tried desparately to find an eye wash station to relieve me of the discomfort of having beheld such a monstrous outfit. Then pity took over as I realized that the gentleman was either color blind or a widower, as no man's wife would permit her husband to depart the house in such disarray.

 

[avedwards]

Colour blindness is no excuse for getting formalwear wrong as it contains no colour (with the exception of buttonhole flowers and some decorations).