AeroFan_07
I'll Lock Up
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Yes that should work as well. I just find the zipped sleeves snug down a little more. Both better than the buttons...
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First Aero Premier Highwayman leather jacket advice? + interior pockets
- Thread starter redHorse
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What you are planning is somewhat similar to my black Vicenza (Italian) Aero Sheene with olive cotton drill lining. Personally I think there would be too much contrast with red cotton drill lining, but to each his own. My Sheene has antique brass hardware although I would have been equally as happy with nickel. My Sheene has the same zipper on the left chest pocket as that listed on the Aero website which I much prefer over anything else. I would not order a Premier HWM without the chest pocket, although the pocket is pretty much nonfunctional.
I would be hesitant to order sleeves apart ftom the button cuffs with period Corozo buttons that is IMO an exceptionally nice touch.
The only change I might make would be D rings at the bottom rather than the Aero standard, although that is just my personal preference. I think D rings are less likely to come undone, but I could be wrong.
I would order the handwarmer pockets without zippers due to the way the zips abrade my hands when used. My black Vicenza Sheene has no zips on the handwarmer pockets whereas my russet Vicenza Sheene does, and I wish the russet Sheene did not.
Neither of my Sheenes (and Maxwell and Mulligan jackets) have inside pockets. My brown FQHH Teamster is the only Aero that does and is a vertical inside pocket without closure. Should you order an inside pocket, I would be loathe to order it with snap closure that could at some point show through.
Lastly, the reason Alexander Leathers/Simmons Bilt Clothing Company Ltd has similar jackets is something I will not go into other than to say personally I would never own one of their jackets, and I will leave it at that.
I would be hesitant to order sleeves apart ftom the button cuffs with period Corozo buttons that is IMO an exceptionally nice touch.
The only change I might make would be D rings at the bottom rather than the Aero standard, although that is just my personal preference. I think D rings are less likely to come undone, but I could be wrong.
I would order the handwarmer pockets without zippers due to the way the zips abrade my hands when used. My black Vicenza Sheene has no zips on the handwarmer pockets whereas my russet Vicenza Sheene does, and I wish the russet Sheene did not.
Neither of my Sheenes (and Maxwell and Mulligan jackets) have inside pockets. My brown FQHH Teamster is the only Aero that does and is a vertical inside pocket without closure. Should you order an inside pocket, I would be loathe to order it with snap closure that could at some point show through.
Lastly, the reason Alexander Leathers/Simmons Bilt Clothing Company Ltd has similar jackets is something I will not go into other than to say personally I would never own one of their jackets, and I will leave it at that.
Thanks for your thorough post.
The thing is, I just know what whatever I order I will probably love it. These tiny details probably won't make or break the jacket at all.
I'm torn between red or black heavy drill cotton lining. Red is nice: some classic Lewis Leathers have red and it looks awesome. Black you obviously can't do wrong though.
I can't decide if I want the PHWM yoke, the regular Highwayman yoke or no yoke at all.
I think I'll go with the standard Highwayman collar and cuffs though, and no chest pocket. They all look great, but it's different tastes I suppose. I like the jacket to be as minimalist as possible.
Thing is, when I went to see Aero I tried on a cherry Highwayman just to see how bad I would look in it, but I thought it looked amazing. Obviously cherry colour is extremely bold so I was thinking I might get a quite conservative black leather jacket for most days, and when the mood strikes me I would wear the cherry. You have to wear it with some real confidence, though. So I figured the black one would be quite conservative, hence the lack of chest pockets and the regular Highwayman collar, no yoke, etc.
You are correct. Apart from proper fit, everything else is window dressing. A couple of years ago I had the opportunity to visit the Lewis Leathers store in London and fell in love with the Corsair but like you decided the LL patch was a major detraction that ruined an otherwise clean look. While there I thought the red lining was a bit much and would have ordered a LL Corsair (or Dominator) in black horsehide with either olive or black plain (not padded) cotton drill lining. I will say my black Vicenza Sheene has the olive cotton drill lining that offers a nice contrast without being ostentatious, although black cotton drill lining would have been equally as acceptable.
You said you can't decide if you want the PHWM yoke, the regular Highwayman yoke or no yoke at all. Once again we are talking about window dressing, although I much prefer the decorative left chest pocket as I described earlier as IMO more aesthetically pleasing than a front yoke (or no yoke), at least to me. You also said you might go with the standard Highwayman collar cuffs, and no chest pocket, and you like the jacket to be as minimalist as possible. I am also all about a minimalist look too but would keep the collar shown on the website, and definitely keep the button cuffs too. Again, what I’ve said is just my own personal preference.
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Stringmaster
One of the Regulars
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I believe Carrie said they couldn't do the exact HWM collar and this is how it was specified on my order i.e. "modified/less pointy". I like the zips on the pockets but from a practicality standpoint no zips might be preferable--I like the zips for the look and don't need hand warmer pockets that often. Nothing I would really change--maybe shorten the length a little (but that may come up as the jacket breaks in)--I don't love the ball/chain zips on the sleeves as they can dangle--that was actually unexpected as I requested that they not be included, but it came that way and I decided not to stress out about it--adds to the look really. Here's my spec sheet for reference:
I believe Carrie said they couldn't do the exact HWM collar and this is how it was specified on my order i.e. "modified/less pointy". I like the zips on the pockets but from a practicality standpoint no zips might be preferable--I like the zips for the look and don't need hand warmer pockets that often. Nothing I would really change--maybe shorten the length a little (but that may come up as the jacket breaks in)--I don't love the ball/chain zips on the sleeves as they can dangle--that was actually unexpected as I requested that they not be included, but it came that way and I decided not to stress out about it--adds to the look really. Here's my spec sheet for reference:
Looks like a brilliant jacket.
Thanks for going to the effort of showing me that. One more question: What's the difference with the buckles? That's something I probably would have never even thought about.
Stringmaster
One of the Regulars
- Messages
- 248
If you go on the Aero or Thurston Bros websites you can compare the standard Premier HWM buckles to the 59'er (like mine)--the former cinches up and the latter buckles like a belt--I did it for the look.
Cool. Thanks for everything. I'll let you know how the jacket turns out!
The major advantage of your latter buckle is it that it won't come undone, which can be a minor annoyance when it happens.
Thanks for your input. Seems we have kinda similar tastes in jackets, just I don't mind about historical accuracy so much.
I think I've decided what I'll go for (for this black jacket anyway).
A Premier Highwayman with the following alterations:
1. To remove the front chest pocket altogether.
2. To remove the back yoke altogether.
3. Collar of the Highwayman, instead of the Premier Highwayman (or something similar)
4. For the inside pockets to be on both sides and for the opening of the pocket to be horizontal (so I can access it from above, as opposed to sideways if that makes sense). No zip or button on them as they tend to show through more, right?
5. Black heavy duty cotton drill lining.
6. Regular Highwayman cuff and no storm cuff.
That actually seems like a lot of alterations which makes me a bit nervous, but hopefully it'll be a decent jacket. It doesn't seem like it would look totally weird I think?
Stringmaster
One of the Regulars
- Messages
- 248
But I think your alterations are conservative, and there are enough pics of variations on the HWM theme that you can likely find pics of what changes you are considering before you decide. Plus I don't think Aero would tackle something too weird!
Historical accuracy is not all that important to me either but aesthetic balance and functionality are. Of your alterations, the main one I would seriously reconsider would be horizontal pockets and would go with vertical pocket(s) in the leather facing, primarily because I think the vertical pockets would be a stronger design, and the horizontal pockets might possibly place increased stress on the jacket lining. I would definitely process all of your deviations from the standard pattern through Aero before proceeding. I have learned from bitter experience that some of my bright ideas related to reinventing the wheel turned out not for the best for me. Good luck with your selection and be sure to post when you receive your jacket.
Edward
Bartender
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The 59er is very cool. It's an all-out repop of the original Rivetts of Leytonstone on which the regular Highwayman was based, but Americanised (with a boxier, looser fit). Lewis bought Rivetts at some point in the sixties, but continued for many years to produce jackets under Rivett's Highwayman brand. By the late sixties there was very little difference in the two lines. That said, it does seem that as best as I can make out, the shirtcollar, straight zip style jackets were already being made by Rivetts in the late fifties, whereas Lewis seem to have introduced the Corsair and Dominator as we know them in 62. (Lewis abandoned the Highwayman brand for many years; when Derek bought the brand over and they later tried to revive it, they were too late as Aero had already legitimately adopted the mark for the Highwayman jacket as we know it today.)
As to interior pockets.... I've had jacket with one, two and none. I find the best mix is one exterior breast pocket and one interior on the opposite side from the former. My Highwayman is a standard pattern with no interior pockets. I can live with that (the breast pocket as standard is big enough for my phone / wallet - not all breast pockets are, some are more decorative than anything), but an interior is always handy.
I'm making the same journey Redhorse, nice to see another pilgrim on the road! I'm still tossing up between the straight Highwayman and the Premier myself.
I don't have any actual experience with the Aero jackets, still working out my first one, but I have scoured TFL for comments on the same sort of issues you're looking at and there's a wealth of knowledge here!
Re the exterior pocket - I think I'd want something there, either the exterior breast pocket or a front yoke or something. There's going to be a large expanse of plain without at least something to offset it. There are styles like that though, August, Original Hercules etc.
I see that, like me, you're not a fan of bright, dangly zip closures at the front. I'm going for a single ball zip pull. Do you see how the pocket has leather lips that conceal the actual zip? On my other (non-Aero) jacket I can actually tuck the zip closure behind those lips and the lips keep the zip closure out of sight and retained, they stop it from jingling about. I'm hoping my Highwayman will do the same.
Re the interior pockets - I had the same concern re the pocket outline printing through. After reading a massive amount of posts about this, the conclusion I came to is that the printing is often mentioned as a result of trauma over time; rubbing of vehicle seatbelts in particular and other similar repetitive movements over periods of time. Printing also seems to be more of an issue with the tighter fit jackets and less of an issue with the boxier fit Highwayman. I went through a lot of posts that showed photographs of older, well worn, Highwayman jackets; looking for photos of examples with interior pockets. I didn't find any photographs of worn Highwayman jackets with interior pockets that had printed through to the outside.
I found this thread helpful in that regard: http://www.thefedoralounge.com/thre...cket-vs-life-with-many-leather-jackets.80643/
Here in particular seems to be a quite a well worn Highwayman in black steer, internal vertical pocket on display:
No printing through to the outside that I can see:
It's no guarantee, but I reckon if the pocket didn't print through on this jacket, it probably won't on mine. I'd be wary of the snap closure though, I think that would be an opportunity to print through to the exterior; though again, it hasn't on the example jacket above. 15 years of rubbing a car seatbelt on it might change that though.
I'd also reconsider the horizontal internal pockets. The conclusion I've come to from distilling a heap of posts is the vertical pocket openings have a much greater stability, being set in the leather of the jacket themselves (refer example above). As I understand it, the horizontal pockets would be set in the lining and therefore have a risk of dragging the lining, like "bagging" it, if the pocket had too much weight in it, as that weight will be carried by the lining and not the "structure" of the jacket. I don't know if that's really an issue or not; if your wallet is too heavy for the pocket you should be lightening it by buying your next jacket, right?
I don't have any actual experience with the Aero jackets, still working out my first one, but I have scoured TFL for comments on the same sort of issues you're looking at and there's a wealth of knowledge here!
Re the exterior pocket - I think I'd want something there, either the exterior breast pocket or a front yoke or something. There's going to be a large expanse of plain without at least something to offset it. There are styles like that though, August, Original Hercules etc.
I see that, like me, you're not a fan of bright, dangly zip closures at the front. I'm going for a single ball zip pull. Do you see how the pocket has leather lips that conceal the actual zip? On my other (non-Aero) jacket I can actually tuck the zip closure behind those lips and the lips keep the zip closure out of sight and retained, they stop it from jingling about. I'm hoping my Highwayman will do the same.
Re the interior pockets - I had the same concern re the pocket outline printing through. After reading a massive amount of posts about this, the conclusion I came to is that the printing is often mentioned as a result of trauma over time; rubbing of vehicle seatbelts in particular and other similar repetitive movements over periods of time. Printing also seems to be more of an issue with the tighter fit jackets and less of an issue with the boxier fit Highwayman. I went through a lot of posts that showed photographs of older, well worn, Highwayman jackets; looking for photos of examples with interior pockets. I didn't find any photographs of worn Highwayman jackets with interior pockets that had printed through to the outside.
I found this thread helpful in that regard: http://www.thefedoralounge.com/thre...cket-vs-life-with-many-leather-jackets.80643/
Here in particular seems to be a quite a well worn Highwayman in black steer, internal vertical pocket on display:
No printing through to the outside that I can see:
It's no guarantee, but I reckon if the pocket didn't print through on this jacket, it probably won't on mine. I'd be wary of the snap closure though, I think that would be an opportunity to print through to the exterior; though again, it hasn't on the example jacket above. 15 years of rubbing a car seatbelt on it might change that though.
I'd also reconsider the horizontal internal pockets. The conclusion I've come to from distilling a heap of posts is the vertical pocket openings have a much greater stability, being set in the leather of the jacket themselves (refer example above). As I understand it, the horizontal pockets would be set in the lining and therefore have a risk of dragging the lining, like "bagging" it, if the pocket had too much weight in it, as that weight will be carried by the lining and not the "structure" of the jacket. I don't know if that's really an issue or not; if your wallet is too heavy for the pocket you should be lightening it by buying your next jacket, right?
Thanks for your post.
That's a good point about the dangling balls pocket. I think hiding it behind the leather is what Daniel Craig is doing on the earlier picture I sent?
I guess I could try vertical pocket opening, but it just feels weird like it's easier for things to slip out?
He may be, I can't quite see. With my other leather jacket, not an Aero, I felt like Santa's little elf jingling about with seven zippers all going at once every step I took until I discovered tucking the pull tabs in. Once I got it though, no further problem for the next 20 years. I can't see why that wouldn't work on the Aeros, they look like they have the same lips on the pocket. As Handymike suggests, regular pull tabs would be even easier to tuck in one would think.
Re the vertical pockets, I'm told the pocket bag descends from the vertical opening, so it doesn't appear the case that the contents are "right there" by the opening to fall out. I haven't had them from my own experience though. I would think the pocket contents easier to access with a vertical opening; I know on some of my jackets it's quite difficult to achieve the angle necessary to get to the bottom of a deep internal pocket with a horizontal opening.
Right, so I'm going to keep the back yoke of the Premier, no front yoke or chest pockets though. interior pockets I'll just see what Aero say. Thanks for the advice all.
Hopefully it'll turn out similar to the LL Corsair: https://www.lewisleathers.com/productinfo.html?code=jak-60
Only probably an even higher quality leather and no hideous badge on the front, and the back yoke is actually alright.
By the way I've read so many posts about people not going through with sales due to that badge. LL really must have lost a lot of sales from it. Perhaps in different markets, for example Asia, it's less of a big deal? Who knows. Probably worked out for the best as I suspect Aero will be great.
Hopefully it'll turn out similar to the LL Corsair: https://www.lewisleathers.com/productinfo.html?code=jak-60
Only probably an even higher quality leather and no hideous badge on the front, and the back yoke is actually alright.
By the way I've read so many posts about people not going through with sales due to that badge. LL really must have lost a lot of sales from it. Perhaps in different markets, for example Asia, it's less of a big deal? Who knows. Probably worked out for the best as I suspect Aero will be great.
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