eBay's Most Paranoid Vendor

[jamespowers]

I believe that paranoia is not strong enough to describe that Ebay seller. All comments have been good about those folks who abuse the system, because it is true, but the Seller's remarks are from a person who abuses her customers. Several years ago there was a very, very, very high female in the state government ( did I say high? ) who returned a beautiful hat she had purchased. She returned it two days after the kentucky Derby, an event in which a well dressed lady must wear a hat. The problem was the front page of the Louisville, Ky. newspaper had two pictures of her wearing that hat at the Derby! A minor faux paus needless to say. Tell the seller to read this thread and that 500 people are waiting for your refund! John

If that were the case, and I were the seller, I would have it advertised as her hat for sale at a premium the day after I got it back---picture included.

 

[MisterGrey]

Got a few more messages when I got back from night classes:

HI AGAIN , I HAVE READ THE FORUM BUT IM NOT A MEMBER YET , IT SEEMS THAT THE CUSTOMERS ON THE FORUM WOULD LOVE MY RESPONSES , SO PLEASE LET THEM KNOW , I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THE FORUM MEMBERS WHO SAY JUST RETURN THE ITEM IN PERFECT CONDITION . THEY ARE CORRECT . THAT IS ALL THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE . I HAVE NO ISSUE REFUNDING A PERFECT RETURN . FOR THE OTHER MEMEBERS WHO DO NOT AGREE . AND THEY SAY BE CAREFUL TAKE NOTES AND TELL THEM THE OUTCOME , THAT OK WITH ME TOO . I LIKE PERSONAL OPINIONS , THEY HELP ME TO IMPROVE MY STORE . BUT PLEASE REMEMBER AN OPINION CAN BE JUST AN OPINION , MY STORE REALLY TRULY IS REAALY A GREAT PLACE TO FIND A NICE FEDORA OR FUR FELT AT A GREAT PRICE AND THATS 100% FACT . SO FORUM CUSTOMERS COME CHECK OUT THE FUR FELT FEDORA HATS ON EBAY . ATLEAST TAKE A LOOK . MAYBE MAKE A BEST OFFER . AND SEE HOW MUCH MY STORE CAN HELP ALL THE CUSTOMERS ON THE FORUM

OK , A PERFECT HAT RETURN IS NO BIG DEAL . EASY TO REFUND .
I JUST WANT THE FORUM TO SEE A LITTLE MORE FROM THE OUTCOME , THEY ARE REALLY ENJOYING YOUR POSTS . SO PLEASE GIVE EM THE REST OF THE STORY AS IT GOES WITH THE RETURN .
I REALLY WANT THE FORUM TO BE INFORMED ABOUT MY STORE .I THINK THEY WOULD LIKE MY STORE A LOT. YOU DO KNOW THAT WAS AN EXTREMELY GOOD PRICE . SO LET THE GOOD FOLKS KNOW THE GOOD PART OF YUR STORY . THE INCREDIBLE PRICE , THE FAST SHIPPING, THE IMMEDIATE EMAIL RESPONSES . MOST CUSTOMER REALLY VALUE THOSE DETAILS , SO LETS LET THEM ALL KNOW . YOU ARE GOING TO RETURN A PERFECT ITEM AND RECIEVE A REFUND AS STATED IN THE AUCTION YOU WON . .

To be fair to the sller, the price was good ($40 NWOT) and all of my e-mails, pre-and-post auction, were answered within a matter of hours (sometimes within the half-hour). I won the auction Thursday night, and the hat was in my hands yesterday afternoon, with the postage sticker bearing the exact price I paid for S&H, to the penny. But for Scala's inaccurate measurements of its own hats, and my need to return it, this would have been a pretty good transaction. I even initially gave the seller positive feedback based upon the merits of the speed, price, and lack of physical flaws in the hat (minus brim bend and the tag rip) upon arrival.

 

[Nik Taylor]

You do not need to play this game...........

eBay hosts the dispute resolution process when buyers claim to a seller that their item was not received or the item they received is different from what was described in the listing. The on-eBay resolution process is the primary avenue for settling disputed eBay transactions and is designed to:

*

Help buyers and sellers resolve disputes in fewer steps, and provide buyers with a more familiar ecommerce resolution experience.
*

Offer an option to contact eBay if buyers and sellers can't reach resolution themselves. We'll take a more active role in ensuring transaction problems are resolved.

There is a good faith dispute between you and the seller regarding the item. A good faith dispute can include cases such as:

​

You received an item that was not as described in the item description.

GOOD LUCK..

 

[Jabos]

MisterGray, it sounds like the seller is backpeddling a bit now, knowing he is being watched. He would never have known you posted on FL about this unless he is a regular "FL lurker", right? If he has such a great store, I welcome him to join FL and promote his store. It appears to have been a good transaction with the seller and not his fault that the sizing wasn't right. It just sounds like he needs to take a business communications class at the local junior college. I wish you both well.

 

[MisterGrey]

If he has such a great store, I welcome him to join FL and promote his store. It appears to have been a good transaction with the seller and not his fault that the sizing wasn't right. It just sounds like he needs to take a business communications class at the local junior college.

That's the bummer in all of this. Up until I told him I wanted to return the hat, the transaction was golden, and if he hadn't have responded the way he did, or if the hat had fit and I hadn't needed to return it, I'd be on here praising him right now.

 

[Kreissaege]

Thats exactly how a case can develop on ebay. It sos easy to push each other further and further.
Having myself sold lots of stuff I know why I stopped it on ebay in the last years. Any individual, private seller is no longer of any importance for this company. Only the large professionell ones count.
Seller and buyer are no longer dealing on equal terms and anyone who got burned once (on either side) is likely to do his best not to experience it again.
(That said, I always added strong disclaimers to my auctions, like "this used item is not new, so if you expect it to be, dont bid" or "I am not in front of the PC 24/7, so if you are likely to ask where your item is, just two days after paying, dont bother to bid".
This, and very accurate descriptions and good pictures, worked fine.
Any buyer, wanting to return the item, had to pay the postage and would get a refund. If he returned it in the same shape he got it, of course.)
I hope this will turn out to everyones satisfaction

 

[Feraud]

That's the bummer in all of this. Up until I told him I wanted to return the hat, the transaction was golden, and if he hadn't have responded the way he did, or if the hat had fit and I hadn't needed to return it, I'd be on here praising him right now.

Why would you not praise him right now? Because he used all caps? Or because he had been burned before and wanted to stress how the hat must returned in unused condition?

Return the hat and give the seller a chance to stand by his selling conditions and provide the refund.

This is a lot of back and forth over a Scala..

 

[BanjoMerlin]

You do not need to play this game...........

Quote:
eBay hosts the dispute resolution process when buyers claim to a seller that their item was not received or the item they received is different from what was described in the listing. The on-eBay resolution process is the primary avenue for settling disputed eBay transactions and is designed to:

*

Help buyers and sellers resolve disputes in fewer steps, and provide buyers with a more familiar ecommerce resolution experience.
*

Offer an option to contact eBay if buyers and sellers can't reach resolution themselves. We'll take a more active role in ensuring transaction problems are resolved.

There is a good faith dispute between you and the seller regarding the item. A good faith dispute can include cases such as:

You received an item that was not as described in the item description.


GOOD LUCK..

This is where the kangaroo court comes in. The seller has done nothing wrong, nothing at all.

The hat was exactly what the seller said it was - Scala size XL. The buyer never asked the seller if the hat would fit him, he got his information from a third party.

What is so wrong with the seller wanting the hat back in re-sellable condition? Is that so unreasonable?

 

[Mobile Vulgus]

Problem

"What is so wrong with the seller wanting the hat back in re-sellable condition? Is that so unreasonable?"

There is nothing wrong with that. There WAS, however, something QUITE wrong with the seller's attitude and his lack of customer relations at the outset.

The seller started off with an overly suspicious attitude making assumptions of someone he'd never done business with and did not know. He immediately used language that told the customer that the customer was a thief, a liar, or a troublemaker. Further he set himself up to refuse to take the hat back by using accusatory language. It was all clear in the context of that first message.

The truth is, all the fault here is on the seller and his amateurish handling of the initial email.

So, I have a counter "what is wrong" question. And here it is...

What is so wrong with a seller holding his tongue and waiting until a dissatisfied customer actually returns the hat before the seller starts accusing people of things?

 

[Feraud]

"What is so wrong with the seller wanting the hat back in re-sellable condition? Is that so unreasonable?"

There is nothing wrong with that. There WAS, however, something QUITE wrong with the seller's attitude and his lack of customer relations at the outset.

The seller started off with an overly suspicious attitude making assumptions of someone he'd never done business with and did not know. He immediately used language that told the customer that the customer was a thief, a liar, or a troublemaker. Further he set himself up to refuse to take the hat back by using accusatory language. It was all clear in the context of that first message.

The truth is, all the fault here is on the seller and his amateurish handling of the initial email.

So, I have a counter "what is wrong" question. And here it is...

What is so wrong with a seller holding his tongue and waiting until a dissatisfied customer actually returns the hat before the seller starts accusing people of things?

The only thing wrong was a matter of perspective and how you read into the seller's comments. The seller was willing to give a refund. He empasized his conditions in caps. Where is the egregious fault in that?

To be fair both parties can be viewed (again depending on your perspective) as handling the issue in a manner that might step on the other guy's toes..

I think at this point the drama is a non-issue.

 

[Nik Taylor]

This is where the kangaroo court comes in.

Interesting, yet, erroneous analysis ... ....Indeed, we are not talking

...lol lol lol

What I quoted is the agreement that both buyer and seller subscribe to as set forth by eBay. That is not dispositive of the issue at hand, rather it is simply a means by which this dispute can be resolved in a fashion that speaks to the rights and responsibilities of both parties. In other words he has the right of a qualified third party analysis which would act as the governing authority regarding this matter.

 

[theinterchange]

"What is so wrong with the seller wanting the hat back in re-sellable condition? Is that so unreasonable?"

There is nothing wrong with that. There WAS, however, something QUITE wrong with the seller's attitude and his lack of customer relations at the outset.

The seller started off with an overly suspicious attitude making assumptions of someone he'd never done business with and did not know. He immediately used language that told the customer that the customer was a thief, a liar, or a troublemaker. Further he set himself up to refuse to take the hat back by using accusatory language. It was all clear in the context of that first message.

The truth is, all the fault here is on the seller and his amateurish handling of the initial email.

So, I have a counter "what is wrong" question. And here it is...

What is so wrong with a seller holding his tongue and waiting until a dissatisfied customer actually returns the hat before the seller starts accusing people of things?

I don't get why people would think that the sellers initial "reactionary" email wasn't out of line. [huh] The paranoia of "perfect" hats is laughable at best, but is beside the point of disparaging remarks about the buyer's town... Also, if this was supposedly the same address, why wasn't that mentioned in the initial email and not in a subsequent communication? That smells of adding on informational fuel to their setup fire.

The seller's choice to answer in all caps is more unfortunate than out of line, I've had many positive eBay communications with sellers/buyers who use all caps.

Having said all this, I can heartily say that this incident has been blown entirely out of proportion on both sides. But, I must add that if a seller is this paranoid of being "burned", they should find another line of work as eBay is all about risk on either side of the bargaining table.

This has been entertaining, and I wish the best for both parties involved.

Randy

 

[Mobile Vulgus]

But, I must add that if a seller is this paranoid of being "burned", they should find another line of work as eBay is all about risk on either side of the bargaining table.

I sure echo that!

 

[MisterGrey]

Why would you not praise him right now? Because he used all caps? Or because he had been burned before and wanted to stress how the hat must returned in unused condition?

Return the hat and give the seller a chance to stand by his selling conditions and provide the refund.

This is a lot of back and forth over a Scala..

Because of how reactionary his initial e-mail was and the level of accusatory paranoia attached. As theinterchange points out, the seller didn't claim that I was living at the same address as someone else who burned him until later; initially, it was the same town, and then, suddenly, I'm living in the same house as this individual. It smacks of face saving, especially after I brought up that I know the previous tenant's name, which the seller refused to mention.

Like I said in my messages, all he had to do was write back with, "OKAY BUT YOU MUST REALIZE THE HAT MUST BE IN THE SAME CONDITION YOU RECEIVED IT IN, NO SWEAT STAINS ETC"

Just because a buyer wants to make a return on a product where returns are offered should not mean they immediately become a suspect in a conspiracy with other hat shops out to ruin his eBay store. No "real" business would (or should) treat customers that way, and if someone is enterprising enough to set up his or her own e-business, he or she should at least attempt to maintain a similar level of professionalism-- one that doesn't involve making allegations about a buyer who, to that point, shouldn't have raised any kind of red flags.

I can't, in good conscience, recommend a seller who has this type of reaction to what I would think is a not terribly uncommon or difficult to resolve situation. It's not the strangest thing in the world for an item of clothing with a size on it to be somewhat inaccurate or off a bit; what kind of endorsement would it be if I recommended this fellow and another lounger purchased from him and found himself in the same boat, simply trying to return an improperly fitting hat and having accusations lobbed at him?

 

[Rick Blaine]

I can't, in good conscience, recommend a seller who has this type of reaction ...what kind of endorsement would it be if I recommended this fellow and another lounger purchased from him and found himself in the same boat...

You'd likely feel regret, remorse & guilt.

:kick: OK- maybe not quite THAT remorseful -I'm just sayin' is all...

 

[Feraud]

Putting all our hurt feelings aside the seller has not yet declined to give you a refund!! :eusa_doh:
Why are you ready to not recommend him to others based on an incomplete return transaction? Because his apparent tone or lacking grammatical skills hurt your feelings? Get over it. Real world business transactions can be a lot more hard and rude than this.

We are all seriously blowing this thing out of proportion. :eusa_doh: lol

 

[MisterGrey]

It has nothing to do with hurt feelings. I'm not hurt-- mostly confused.

Imagine if you went into a brick and mortar men's clothing store, bought a shirt labeled medium. The checkout is smooth and the owner is courteous. When you get home you find that the shirt does not fit. Upon returning to the store and asking to return it, the owner goes off on a rant, accuses you of trying to scam him, alleges that you are involved in a conspiracy with other clothing stores to ruin his reputation, and (for the sake of this argument) upon seeing your vehicle in the parking lot, says that he is suspicious because someone with the same make and model of car once returned damaged merchandise.

Now, even if you did get a full refund, would you really recommend other people to this store, and praise them for a speedy checkout? Or would you tell your friends about the experience in much the same way I'm doing here?

 

[Not-Bogart13]

What about the seller's feedback? Have you read it? There may clues in there as to how returns tends to work out. People who get burned on eBay tend to be very expressive.

Even if a seller has a 99% positive rating, I always read feedback (how much is proportionate to the price of what I want). Reading between the lines has probably saved me some trouble. I've used ebay about as long as I've been on the Lounge, and I've only been burned twice, on fairly inexpensive stuff.

 

[Feraud]

Now, even if you did get a full refund, would you really recommend other people to this store, and praise them for a speedy checkout? Or would you tell your friends about the experience in much the same way I'm doing here?

Let's wait until you either get the refund or not.

 

[scottyrocks]

The seller may very well give a refund.

The problem is in his presentation. I would not condemn him in advance. He hasnt actually done anything wrong as of yet. But the way he comes across, he doesnt inspire and trust or confidence that he will do the right thing. In the real world, business people have to do that or they dont often survive. The internet has changed all that because there always seems to be an endless supply of people to keep even the most dishonest sellers in business because people dont read reviews, or do read them and just dont care.

Its not just what you say; its also how you say it.