Curtains for the Necktie?

[Lincsong]

This was the title on an opinion piece on Friday, December 21, 2007 Wall Street Journal pg. A18. It notes that Barack Obama goes tie less frequently as does Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmandinejad. Further along the article, it brings up the popular wisdom that John Kennedy killed the hat and that perhaps the tie is destined for a similar fate. So, in the future will tie wearers be subjected to off the wall comments????

 

[Rooster]

It notes that Barack Obama goes tie less frequently as does Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmandinejad.

Well, that's it then. Those are the two men I most pattern my life after, so I'm on my way to the garbage can with all of my ties.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Tielessness seems to be a general trend. That, for men, is the basic meaning of "casual friday" - can the tie for a day. Dressing up is putting on a shirt, but no tie. Same old knee-hugging jeans.

But then, Apparel Arts was bemoaning tielessness as far back as 1932. [huh] Is this just something old fuddy duddies whine about every so often, or is the world really going against ties?

bk

 

[Lincsong]

My company has always had a "no denim policy". The dress code was updated in June of this year. Prior to the update ties were required for salesmen from Labor Day to Memorial Day. Now, ties are optional year round. Hats were optional, now they're "banned", however, the higher ups have made exceptions to newsboys caps and fedora's. :eusa_clap

 

[Lincsong]

Well, that's it then. Those are the two men I most pattern my life after, so I'm on my way to the garbage can with all of my ties.

I'm just quoting the article. lol

 

[vonwotan]

I don't know that I see the total demise of the necktie, magazines and newspapers seem to make these (and opposing) declarations every so often. I can however confirm that there will be one person wearing bowtie or ascot on a regular basis during my lifetime.

 

[Fletch]

Apparel Arts was bemoaning tielessness as far back as 1932.

Where exactly was it acceptable to go tieless in 1932? Besides the Cote d'Azur and Hoovervilles, I mean.

 

[Patrick Murtha]

There's actually been a little bit of a trend back toward "business formal" in some quarters. I believe that suit sales have picked up; I'm not sure about ties. I know a CEO here in Northeast Wisconsin who's pushing his company back toward dress-up, and who turned down his managers' request to go tieless for an offsite gathering. Good for him!

I don't think that ties will entirely disappear, any more than hats have. I bemoan the casual bent of our contemporary society, but it does enable me to stand out.

 

[Quigley Brown]

Should Obama be elected President I'm sure a lobbyist from the Fedora Lounge will strongly advise him to wear a necktie.

 

[dhermann1]

I read the piece yesterday. It's slightly tongue in cheek, but he raises an interesting point. I think all this means is that the tie's role in our imaginations is undergoing a transformation. Think how many men wear ties with shirts that don't quite fit around the neck. I think a lot of men associate ties with that kind of miserable sensation. Two facts remain. First, the tie is a totally artificial odd object to put around your neck. It makes as much actual sense as the game of baseball does, for example. (Whenever I watch baseball, which I LOVE, I constantly hear myself thinking, "This game makes no sense at all!") Same with ties. They make no sense at all. The other fact is that when you wear a tie, you're making a major statement to the world. For me, personally, wearing a tie (mine, of course, are all vintage) makes me stand up straighter, and take myself more seriously. I like what I see when I look in the mirror. That fact isn't going to change for a long time.

 

[Mike in Seattle]

Uh oh...

Uh oh... I'm getting a bad feeling about the effects of that article....

 

[MK]

Actually....

......I wanted to wear a tie that day. When I got dressed that morning wearing my new red sweater vest...I discovered that you could see my tie through the fabric due to the high contrast of the white shirt. I auditioned several ties. All could be seen. I decided I either had to not wear the vest, change to a different shirt or go tieless. I also bought a tan and a green vests as well. I knoe the tan one will be very hard to wear with a tie, but I have hopes for the forest green one.

Lesson learned: Don't buy shear sweaters.....even if they are considered high quality.

 

[jake_fink]

The Wall Street Journal is too conservative...

...A Sutiable Wardrobe sees more than the tie disappearing.

Is This Where It Goes?

 

[Jovan]

My company has always had a "no denim policy". The dress code was updated in June of this year. Prior to the update ties were required for salesmen from Labor Day to Memorial Day. Now, ties are optional year round. Hats were optional, now they're "banned", however, the higher ups have made exceptions to newsboys caps and fedora's. :eusa_clap

Am I the only one who thinks this makes no sense? Common etiquette means you'll never wear the hat indoors at your job anyways. [huh] Glad to see they make an exception though... any business dress code should bar baseball caps at the very least.

MK: A lot of v-neck sweaters seem to be made to layer lightly nowadays. I haven't had that problem yet, but I'll look out the next time I'm sweater shopping.

 

[AdmiralTofu]

I actually really like the tieless look -- if the subject is well put together... MK is a splendid example. To me, it says relaxed, cool, and easygoing, but still caring enough to have some measure of respect for oneself and the folks one deals with.

Now, of course, that doesn't mean I'm applauding the so-called "demise of the necktie" (which I think is a lot of hooey anyway). I for one love my ties, and feel naked without one!

-Tofu

 

[Ecuador Jim]

I recall a job I had that required that ties be worn even though most of the poeple in the office did the majority of their business over the phone.

It was more a statement about professionalism and professional demeanor. The proliferation of business casual and its degradation to anything goes relates directly to behavior.

Why do companies have to launch new campaigns to put their customers first? To paraphrase a recent car campaign, customer service should be a big DUH.

Ah well, I suppose I'm tilting at windmills.

 

[Jovan]

I actually really like the tieless look -- if the subject is well put together... MK is a splendid example. To me, it says relaxed, cool, and easygoing, but still caring enough to have some measure of respect for oneself and the folks one deals with.

Now, of course, that doesn't mean I'm applauding the so-called "demise of the necktie" (which I think is a lot of hooey anyway). I for one love my ties, and feel naked without one!

-Tofu

I tend to agree with you. I feel naked without one sometimes, especially now in winter.

The other problem with many v-necks now is that they tend to have a very shallow "V"... one that is made for leaving the top button of a shirt undone and letting the collar points fall over the sides. I've tried to use a tie with such a one, and it hides about half the collar and a whole lotta tie unless you're wearing a club collar or something else with fairly short points. That said, I agree MK did pretty well. I may have to experiment with red, despite that I prefer muted colours most of the time.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Where exactly was it acceptable to go tieless in 1932? Besides the Cote d'Azur and Hoovervilles, I mean.

It may have been 1933 or '34 but that's beside the point. What they did was take photographs on the streets of NYC, and point out that in the busy street, a significant number of younger men were hatless, tieless, and therefore communists (honestly, i'm not kidding, that allusion is glaring in the article).

bk

 

[Jovan]

Do you have a scan of this article?

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Yes, but i've not got it sorted out yet (Apparel Arts was a folio-sized publication, so - being without an A3 scanner - I had to scan half pages and then put them back together, align, sort out the colour match etc. Very time consuming)

bk