Contemporary Debate

[quadzero]

I present a mystery to my family, friends, and acquaintances. I have a preference for crisp, pressed dress or sports shirts with appropriate neckties, although I understand that this viewpoint is not widely held. Do you feel uncomfortable when you see someone standing in line at the airport wearing nothing but pajamas? Personally, it makes me uneasy. From graduation ceremonies to weddings and funerals, people often choose to wear blue jeans and pullover polo shirts and consider them acceptable. When they discuss me, they will just roll their eyes and say, "well, we love him anyway." Strangely, I feel the same way about them.

 

[belfastboy]

I present a mystery to my family, friends, and acquaintances. I have a preference for crisp, pressed dress or sports shirts with appropriate neckties, although I understand that this viewpoint is not widely held. Do you feel uncomfortable when you see someone standing in line at the airport wearing nothing but pajamas? Personally, it makes me uneasy. From graduation ceremonies to weddings and funerals, people often choose to wear blue jeans and pullover polo shirts and consider them acceptable. When they discuss me, they will just roll their eyes and say, "well, we love him anyway." Strangely, I feel the same way about them.

I have a 'live and let live' perspective. A choice to wear PJ's is not one I would make but if it works for the wearer...who am I to speak against it. Life has too many other more serious vexations so I am discerning as to what I choose to bother me.

 

[quadzero]

I have a 'live and let live' perspective. A choice to wear PJ's is not one I would make but if it works for the wearer...who am I to speak against it. Life has too many other more serious vexations so I am discerning as to what I choose to bother me.

I will fight for the right to stand in line at the airport in one's underpants... I speak of my own idiosyncrisies. And, since this IS a free country I will espouse my view in this forum just as you have yours.

 

[belfastboy]

I will fight for the right to stand in line at the airport in one's underpants... I speak of my own idiosyncrisies. And, since this IS a free country I will espouse my view in this forum just as you have yours.

Exactly!

 

[_Wayfarer_]

Society across the board has been casualised. In terms of having to wear suiting for employment I am glad I've spent my career in tech. It's clear to me that wearing a suit conveys absolutely no greater capability or integrity on anyone. And that is no complement to tech.

But the great thing about today's men's fashion is that men can be who they want to be. If you like your suiting, you can rock it. It will look out of place in most contexts, but it's your style and that's the only thing that matters. I am a denim, leather motorcycle jacket, and black clothing guy. I will dress up, I know how, but I haven't had to wear a suit for years, and I'm grateful for that. I'm more grateful to be able to wear exactly the style that I love the most, and that I don't have to spend time dressing for anyone else.

 

[quadzero]

Society across the board has been casualised. In terms of having to wear suiting for employment I am glad I've spent my career in tech. It's clear to me that wearing a suit conveys absolutely no greater capability or integrity on anyone. And that is no complement to tech.

But the great thing about today's men's fashion is that men can be who they want to be. If you like your suiting, you can rock it. It will look out of place in most contexts, but it's your style and that's the only thing that matters. I am a denim, leather motorcycle jacket, and black clothing guy. I will dress up, I know how, but I haven't had to wear a suit for years, and I'm grateful for that. I'm more grateful to be able to wear exactly the style that I love the most, and that I don't have to spend time dressing for anyone else.

What you have said makes sense to me. I get it. Some are required to dress for work and they want to dress down and be more "comfortable" when not at work. I get that. But judgementalism goes both ways. I feel I am at my best when I wear a nice pair of trousers and a collared shirt and a tie (not a suit) To each his own, right? I do not make judgments on anyone else, and I expect the same courtesy.

 

[_Wayfarer_]

What you have said makes sense to me. I get it. Some are required to dress for work and they want to dress down and be more "comfortable" when not at work. I get that. But judgementalism goes both ways. I feel I am at my best when I wear a nice pair of trousers and a collared shirt and a tie (not a suit) To each his own, right? I do not make judgments on anyone else, and I expect the same courtesy.

It is to each his own. That's what's beautiful. You do you. I knew a guy who wore a 3-piece to work everyday when I was in a hoodie. I would never have echoed his style but I appreciated it.

Maybe it might be helpful to comment about some language ques in the thread. Some of the words you've said so far might be construed by some as combative. I don't think you meant them that way at all, of course. If you say something like 'but judgementalism goes both ways and I will speak my mind in this forum' and 'I expect the same courtesy' it comes across like you think you are under attack, and that is not the case.

The question I'd ask is whether you feel that other people not agreeing with how you dress is something that makes you defensive? Because you don't need to justify your style choices. And the same is true for everyone else too. We all get to make these choices for ourselves because the old 'rules' about men's clothing no longer exist.

 

[Ernest P Shackleton]

I'm grateful that our culture has grown evermore casual, especially in the professional sector. I know some professions still demand a dress code, but for the many that have loosened the tether on that, GOOD on them. Because at the same time, as others have said, the option to dress up remains for those who prefer it. Instead of a tight box, the range has grown. Sadly, it's the service industry that has held onto uniforms. Making $12/hr and having to wear some form of clown suit seems unjust. The way people behave is a real tell of who and what they are. The way they dress doesn't say a whole lot, and it says less and less all the time. I gotta say, that if I have prejudice, I'm more likely to think, "Man, that person looks high maintenance. Glad I'm not under that yoke."

But my favorite, most comfortable dress looks like I rummaged through a theater costume closet with the lights off. None of it makes sense to anyone but me, and that's something I try afford everyone. I grew up in a time of Teva and Birkenstock sandals all over the place, and I used to have a ridiculously strong reaction to men wearing either type. I still think they're ugly (especially the Tevas), but that's now an "ugly for me" and no longer an "ugly for them."

I see this talk about airplane dress pretty consistently over the years, and I've never been sure why. It's an uncomfortable situation in so many ways (and growing more so all the time), so if you can find a bit of peace in a set of PJs, good for you. Just don't put your feet, bare or socked, on the seat or all over the back of the seats etc.

 

[Cuvier]

My last flight, I wore a nice but inexpensive tweed suit. Brown glen check, light blue shirt and a bowtie, all topped with a brown flatcap. I received a great many compliments.
A young man, I would say 22 or so, very much seemed to enjoy my look and asked quite a few questions. Especially about a self tie bowtie. His girl however had some fashion advice for me. Ditch the suit and just wear something comfortable. She started on this and that. I must have struck a nerve when I interrupted saying, "I don't think someone wearing footy pajamas in public should be giving anyone clothing advice." She got awful quiet and ignored me the rest of the flight.
That said, my best advice is to take care of yourself and let other worry about themselves. That random stranger has nothing to do with me so I got me and they do them.

 

[Havotnicus]

There are some people that seem to find wearing clothes inherently uncomfortable: they must cut the labels out of their clothes because they are so irritating, wool is scratchy, waistbands must be elasticated, denim is heavy and restricting and the idea of a shirt butoned to the neck is anathema. These people will most likely be the ones wearing pyjamas in public, or formless grey jersey sweats (incidentally also prison uniform in the UK). I am the opposite: if clothing fits properly, then there is no discomfort for me. Why should tweed be more uncomfortable than "footy pajamas"? I think there is something more than actual physical comfort at work here. It must be a psychological thing too.

 

[KosstAmojan]

I'm about as libertarian as you can get but I'm also a big proponent of voluntary social cohesion. Having certain standards and social norms maintains cultural norms and reduces the 'otherness' that someone who breaks those norms can bring.

I always wear a coat on a plane but seeing someone with footie pajamas or sagging pants at a minimum tells me, on a very intrinsic level, that these people are not my people, not my culture....they are other and therefore unpredictable thus something to be wary of.

Culture is important. I'm a rural Louisiana Creole working on the east coast and it just so happens the person I was assigned to work with is Creole as well...but from New Orleans who definitely dresses 'hood' . She might as well be an alien to me despite our almost identical ethnic and current financial background.