Can any modern-made clothes really pass for vintage?

[Mr Lilleythorpe]

I've had little luck finding vintage clothing, but actually have quite a good wardrobe of modern clothing compiled, that looks quite passable.

Brook Taverner make excellent hunting wear and especially casual jackets and blazers, in my opinion, that haven't really change since they first began, except slight differences in style.

Of course, a good Harris is dateless.

And Marks and Spencer do a natty range in old-fashioned casual trousers- not so much suits.

I try and get cravates and ties from the period, though. I have two Lloyd Atree and Smith cravates that are utterly useless bits of loose, synthetic material that always come out of place, whereas a fantastic 1950's cravate inherited from my grandmother's sister's husband could go through Hell and back and still stay elegant.

Any thoughts?

 

[Two Types]

Can any modern-made clothes really pass for vintage?

It depends on the level of scrutiny. Some modern clothes can look right (period shape and cut) and be well made etc - but it's the cloths and materials used that don't match vintage ones. The lining on modern suits is so different it is usually immediately obvious. I'm no expert on construction and tailoring, but if you were to put a 1930s Harris Tweed jacket alongside a modern one, the differences would be obvious.

There's a thread on 'Vintage inspired suits' that you can have a look at. One of my suits is in there. It might look right, but you could never fool anyone with a genuine knowledge of vintage clothing. But there are some great companies offering vintage-inspired clothing (I daredn't not say 'reproduction' or I get told off by HBK): look at the Luxire shirts, they are splendid as are the clothes made by Old Town.

But, it depends on the look you are trying to achieve. If you want the traditional English gent look, that is not too difficult to achieve with modern clothes, anything else will be more difficult to achieve. The point to remember is that there are still plenty of vintage clothes out there, it might just take some time to acheive the look you want. In the meantime, study the various threads on the FL, get some tips, mix and match vintage with modern and gradually slide into the look you want.
Good luck

 

[herringbonekid]

TT, it's only my own clothing that i don't like to call reproduction; there are many companies that definitely do just that.

if you're doing a workwear / rugged look then there is a lot of reproduction clothing to choose from with companies like Buzz Rickson and Aero leather (who now also do civvies as well as Militrary) and many others, some of it authentic to a very high degree.

tailoring is harder to get right for companies i think, and they nearly always modernise the look in some way, but a vintage inspired look is certainly attainable.

 

[bburtner@moran]

Good question.

 

[Undertow]

Yes, materials is a big difference. The way a material drapes, the way it feels and looks, makes a huge impact on passing as vintage. My missus only uses patterns from the 1930's and 1940's, but try finding cotton jersey that hasn't been treated, or actual tweed, etc. Linings are also quite different, as already noted. Armholes, button stances...it's a mess.

Don't worry, I have the same problem trying to find modern suits that have some kind of vintage feel.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

It's difficult. Those Japanese companies that do the workwear right ("the authentic to a high degree" makers) are prohibitively expensive.

But to answer the question: I'll go out on a limb and say that on a normal budget (i.e. excluding any kind of bespoke or "high-end" reproducers) it is absolutely impossible to get vintage-correct stuff. But then, who but a few of us around here would really notice? And how many of us would really care?

The second part of my answer: If budget is no concern, it is possible to get modern pieces made for you that will be vintage-perfect. But either you, or the person making the clothes, REALLY need to know what they're doing, down to the darts on the jackets (one of the major issues with modern cut suits), positioning of pleats on the trousers, fabric weight, lining materials etc. etc. etc. Look at some of hbk's posts on construction of collars for an example of how specific it needs to be.

bk

 

[resortes805]

It is also depends on who you are trying to impress. of course, if you are only trying to impress yourself, then consider how high a standard you would like to set.

What might look convincingly vintage to Joe Q. Public, may not "fool" a Marc Chevalier or Baron Kurtz for example.

I do not exclusively wear vintage clothing, and I feel just as comfortable in a 1934 dated three-piece as I do in a pair of Dickies and a rock band t-shirt. However, my wardrobe does tend to break down along the following lines:

The Nutty Vintage Stuff
This is typically the severely dated, rare and obscure things I save for events like art deco festivals or rockabilly weekenders, where I know people will appreciate them. Pink '50s slacks are a good example; or a '40s 'end of the day shirt,' or an ultra-cropped '30s fair isle sweater. I have both reproductions and actual vintage in this category.

Go-to Vintage
This is my bread and butter stuff of high waisted slacks and gab shirts that I wear to school or work. Basically things that look nice, aren't too flashy, but also may require a little care and upkeep now and again considering that they are 60+ years old.

Go-to Repro
My go-to repro stuff is comprised of modern slacks, sweaters, dress shirts, work shirts, and etc. that get mixed in with my vintage wares. They may not be spot on reproductions, but they are good enough to allow me to maintain the general look I am going for, and are easy to care for too.

Emergency Contemporary Clothes
Deep in my closet is a suitcase of contemporary clothing that I may need when a vintage look isn't appropriate. I keep it for emergencies only, and thankfully haven't had to use it yet.

 

[Metatron]

I don't wear much high end stuff, but these are the details I try to achieve:

-Natural fabrics.
-Trousers that fit at least as high as my waist, slightly tapered to baggy, and never skinny.
-Shirts that are made from a cotton that is thick enough to not be see-through, and almost never combined with polyester.
-Sport coats that have a substantial fabric with pleasing colour combinations. and bold tailoring. avoid the 'crisp' look.
-Leather shoes.
-Occasionally use suspenders.
-Try to combine drab colours with bright colours, to avoid the 'beige clad retiree' look.

That way I can achieve a look that is at least 'classic'.


As for where to find certain things on a budget,
Trousers: Look for surplus military trousers that have a civillian cut (i.e dress trousers) in wool/cotton/denim. Because they usually aren't labelled 'rockabilly' 'swing' or whatever, people often ignore them.

Shirts: You can find modern shirts in a substantial fabric and an at least passable vintage design, and if you like vintage workwear, it's all the rage right now in the highstreet. Furthermore, you might find a military pull over shirt (Swedish army) and dye it.

Ties: Can be found quite easily, either modern or vintage, either in charity shops, ebay, or in the classifieds here at the lounge.

For all of the above, check your local charity/vintage shops: You can sometimes find very old stuff underpriced, or 'conservative' things from the 60s-70s with a vintage design.

I almost forgot http://freespace.virgin.net/peter.marrow1/
who make beautiful jumpers that you can have customised for no extra cost... Having one made now, let's see how it turns out.

 

[LoveMyHats2]

I tend to follow what "works" for me when it comes to a vintage look. I have been able to find some real bargains on eBay and vintage shops locally to collect a wealth of my attire, but what I would consider vintage may not be vintage enough for some folks. Most of my suits and sports coats are from the late 1940's through and up to 1960's. I have only a few real vintage shirts, however, to keep something suitable with what I would be wearing, a fresh clean white shirt with a spread collar can pass well for a real vintage when you need it. Most of my ties are "vintage" versace or portofino from the 1960's, I do have a few from the 1930's and 1940's that belonged to my Father whom was a very well dressed Man his entire life. I merely wish I had even a few of the Fedora hats he once owned. Shoes I have started a nice collection of, mostly from the 1950's up through the late 1970's, and a few newer shoes. Braces, those tend to be easier to find, I have one pair that are very old, and they are rather whimsical in nature but very fitting for my attire, as I am always with a Hat on, and these braces are a light pale colored "pink" but have a sewn in pattern of a black top hat, cane, and gloves crossed on them repeatedly, done in heavy black silk stitching, and have the silk leads to leather where they attach to the trousers. Speaking of Trousers, I found the most of my best ones while traveling in Europe many years ago, they have been well kept, most of them Tailored to fit and made of top quality wool. I do augment my line up of pants with modern Zanella brand, always with a pleat and cuff. No question that a wardrobe can run up in price for a Gentleman, but you do pay for what you get and the quality is a longer lifespan for your clothing. Taking care of what you own also adds to it. Hand washing items that you desire to have around for a long time that you can hand wash, will make a drastic difference in life span of those articles of clothing. A "washing machine" and "dryer" will eat clothing as it cleans them and drys them. Some dry cleaning process may do the same, depending upon what you desire to have done. I only dry clean wool and cotton or linen suits or sport coats and trousers, anything else is hand washed and line dried then ironed. I have some silk shirts that are already going on 40 years old and still are in really nice condition simply due to being taken care of with great care, same for silk trousers and silk socks. Sorry I got a bit carried away from the topic, but yes for me I do think some modern made clothing can give you a vintage look, but when you also know what real vintage is, you desire it over modern for your wardrobe. I believe most of us agree, things are just not made as well as they used to be made for the most part, and that is some of the attraction in itself, in my opinion.

 

[Tomasso]

Oxxford (founded 1916) still construct their suits as they did in the Golden Era and their archives hold all their old patterns so they could easily whip you up a vintage style suit. They are also a sister company of the venerable cloth merchant Holland & Sherry (founded 1836) so they could probably find something that would pass for vintage.

 

[LoveMyHats2]

Wow, so very true about those two companies. I know they would (if they would consider pulling out the old patterns to make vintage special order), sure have a nice variety of items to offer a choice for the buyer. I tend to already appreciate Oxxford as that I am familiar with the suits they make, very nice traditional appearance, a quality look to the materials used.

 

[Guttersnipe]

Oxxford (founded 1916) still construct their suits as they did in the Golden Era and their archives hold all their old patterns so they could easily whip you up a vintage style suit. They are also a sister company of the venerable cloth merchant Holland & Sherry (founded 1836) so they could probably find something that would pass for vintage.

Oxxford certainly maintains the traditional techniques, but do they really maintain an archive? I ask because I've actually heard otherwise. For business travel, my go-to versatile coat is an Oxxford Type A blazer. It is ... so ... well ... made. Frankly it's better constructed than the vast majority on my vintage suits. If they could make me a suit made in a vintage cut, I would definitely be interested in that.

 

[Lynx]

Oxxford (founded 1916) still construct their suits as they did in the Golden Era and their archives hold all their old patterns so they could easily whip you up a vintage style suit. They are also a sister company of the venerable cloth merchant Holland & Sherry (founded 1836) so they could probably find something that would pass for vintage.

Indeed Oxxford makes some of the best suits to this day period. Even their new stuff is top notch partly due to the fact that they remain true to the old craft. In the world of men's suits they remain one of the absolute top brands worldwide and they are American made.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Yes, if you're able to go high end Oxxford ($$$$$), you'll be able to get a decent vintage looking cut. Personally, I don't see the appeal of many of their 'Super' fabrics, or the appeal of the cut of their "low" priced ($$$$) stuff. It's like RTW Savile Row stuff - it's just not as good as people make out.

Anything's possible with money.

bk

 

[Lynx]

the biggest thing besides the cut is the suits being fully canvassed which has a lot more work into it by hand and does last, look and drape better than modern cheaper fused suits (which are glued and mass produced). Some may try and say that the fused suits are getting better with gluing and all but the benchmark is still the old craftsman way of doing it and the difference really still very apparent

 

[Mr Lilleythorpe]

Yes, if you're able to go high end Oxxford ($$$$$), you'll be able to get a decent vintage looking cut. Personally, I don't see the appeal of many of their 'Super' fabrics, or the appeal of the cut of their "low" priced ($$$$) stuff. It's like RTW Savile Row stuff - it's just not as good as people make out.

Anything's possible with money.

bk

For that amount, I could stroll into Savile Row and get a suit tailored in a vintage cut. I'm not implying that I actually have that much disposable income, though!

 

[filfoster]

Well, has anyone inquired ('enquired'?) of Oxxford for vintage patterns, since that was suggested?

I note that the ubiquitous Indy Magnoli suits and Matt Deckard offerings have not been discussed in this regard.

 

[Quigley Brown]

I recently found a Brooks Brothers sport coat at the Goodwill probably made in the last few years. It's three-button and has some suprisingly narrow lapels. Laid next to recently found vintage early-60s jacket they are nearly identical...the BB jacket is ventless in the back, though...and I found it to fit the same.

 

[Edward]

Yes, if you're able to go high end Oxxford ($$$$$), you'll be able to get a decent vintage looking cut. Personally, I don't see the appeal of many of their 'Super' fabrics, or the appeal of the cut of their "low" priced ($$$$) stuff. It's like RTW Savile Row stuff - it's just not as good as people make out.

Anything's possible with money.

bk

Agreed. I'm similarly puzzled at the notion of Row RTW stuff and the price premium that can command, but then I suppose it's the same for any "designer" label. Vivienne Westwood had a couple of really nice jackets last year - wide, peak lapels, tailored fit, very mid thirties American to my eye.... eight hundred quid, off the rack. Beautiful, but still couldn't help feeling it was a two hundred quid jacket with a six hundred quid label.... but then I've never been convinced by the idea of wearing a "label" anyhow. Still, I'd rather see Boateng RTW (and, of course, he als o now does MTM) on the Row than Abercrombie and bleedin' Fitch....

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

I am not a bespoke customer so I have to admit that I am going for the look and less for the exquisite handtailoring and whatnot.
Just from the styling most oxxford suits look rather boring. Sorry. It would be interesting to see what they could do from their archives. I doubt any fedora lounge members would ever go that route though.