California Wines

[John in Covina]

Just about anything that Rosenblum makes is great.

 

[John in Covina]

I have not tried it in years, but it was great around 2002.

The Zinfandel style of wine really popped in California. It comes from a grape called Primitivo, from Italy. You can get Primitivo wine here, but it's not made the same way as a good strong California Zinfandel.

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Primitivo is the base grape but Zinds have been made here for over a hundred years and really seems to showcase the terroir here in an exceptionally way. Dry Creek, lodi, Paso Robles, you can get a real sense of location from the wine.

They still stumble across abandoned vineyards with old vines that they clone for one of the Cal universities and Seghisio which is a great maker is involved with saving old vine zinds too.

 

[wldthistle]

Ah, wine... now here's a subject I can get into.

I'm also a fan of zins, and will echo the praise for Ravenswood. Maybe not the most exciting, but you generally can't go wrong, especially with one of their Old Vine Zins. Another good one is 7 Deadly Zins, which is from Lodi.

Recently I organized a California Central Coast wine tasting, and the reds were the favorites: Edna Valley Pinot, Justin Cabernet, and Tablas Creek C?¥tes de Tablas, a Grenache/Mouvedre/Syrah/Counois blend. I believe all of these were around $20 a bottle.

Cheers!

-Greg

 

[Dr Doran]

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Primitivo is the base grape but Zinds have been made here for over a hundred years and really seems to showcase the terroir here in an exceptionally way. Dry Creek, lodi, Paso Robles, you can get a real sense of location from the wine.

They still stumble across abandoned vineyards with old vines that they clone for one of the Cal universities and Seghisio which is a great maker is involved with saving old vine zinds too.

Exactly. I am wondering if Primitivo will enjoy a renaissance. It does seem that the zinfandel works very very well for california soil indeed. The heat? The minerals? I went to the Ravenswood winery in 1999 and had the clearest lesson in terroir of all time. We tasted many Ravenswoods and one had a nasty minty taste (not nice in a Zinfandel, I'm sure you'd agree). We asked the source of this (gross) flavor. It turns out that those grapes were grown next to a eucalyptus grove, the oil from whose trees had seeped into the dirt then up into the grapes. An acquirable taste, perhaps.

The Cal university in question is probably Davis. They offer a viticulture major, I believe [they also have a post-bac in Classics (Greek and Latin) -- how cool would that be, to combine those?].

 

[Girl Friday]

Cakebread makes a really good Chardonnay, a little hard to find. It was several years ago that I was in Napa, and I am really more of a red wine fan, but I seem to recall most of the chards from Napa being really quite good.

 

[blacklagoon]

I remember,during the eighties,european wine makers use to slag off californian wines.the magazines and newspapers were full of journalists,who were suddenly expert wine tasters.It is only recently,about the past 10 years,to my knowledge,that the french wine merchants have begun to accept that californian wines are actually better than french wines.I have seen a couple of t.v programmes were this was discussed,and eventually concluded.t.v wine experts are also beginning to glorify californian wines,where as 10 years ago,they would have followed the media trend of bitching about them all.

 

[Dr Doran]

I remember,during the eighties,european wine makers use to slag off californian wines.the magazines and newspapers were full of journalists,who were suddenly expert wine tasters.It is only recently,about the past 10 years,to my knowledge,that the french wine merchants have begun to accept that californian wines are actually better than french wines.I have seen a couple of t.v programmes were this was discussed,and eventually concluded.t.v wine experts are also beginning to glorify californian wines,where as 10 years ago,they would have followed the media trend of bitching about them all.

I do recall when European winemakers and wine drinkers did, yes, talk a lot of smack about US wines. This was before the current situation (whereby GOOD, not cheapo, California wines are exported to Europe in great numbers) took hold. In the early 1990s I worked in a really cool store that was a combination of health food and gourmet food with an emphasis on local products, of high quality, sustainably grown. Only a very few French wine distributors had any idea of the massive revolution that was about to happen in which American wines were to be considered on a par with French wines. (Certainly the prices are on a par.) The thing to do now, I think, is to drink excellent wines that are from countries that have NOT YET been "discovered" by Robert Parker et alii. These wines will be comparatively inexpensive but very fine. I have had fine Chilean and Argentinan wines for inexpensive prices.

 

[Dr Doran]

I'm also a fan of zins, and will echo the praise for Ravenswood. Maybe not the most exciting, but you generally can't go wrong, especially with one of their Old Vine Zins. Another good one is 7 Deadly Zins, which is from Lodi.

I have had very fine luck with Lodi zins. Most "old vine" zins have been good too. Thank you for the tip for 7 Deadly. I will look for it!

 

[Willys Gal]

Hi all,
I laughed so hard when DutchIndo mentioned "2-Buck Chuck". I am guilty of indulging in that winelol ... It's tasty! I enjoy it. I just recycled an empty bottle of Chuck's Cabernet Sauvignon. Time for a TJ's expedition!

Nothing like a glass of the above mentioned wine with a TJ's Chocolate Lava Cake:eusa_clap


Willys Gal

 

[John in Covina]

I laughed so hard when DutchIndo mentioned "2-Buck Chuck". I am guilty of indulging in that winelol ... It's tasty! I enjoy it.
Willys Gal

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It is sort of an equation to arrive at a value. If i remember right, Trader Joes made an arrangement to get all of the left overs in grape production and had a winery do their thing. Low cost and decent production equals an unbeatable value. Wine is a strange thing when it come to value, the good stuff really tends to cost, but a run to Beverages and More can show you that there are $10 wines as good as or better than a lot of $15-20 wines, and some $20 wines that can beat out a $35-40 wineand so forth. I have been with friends and we have bought some for those uber wines and you taste it and ask was this worth the money.

That is why i am happiest finding really good inexpensive wines.

 

[Haversack]

Doran wrote: "The Cal university in question is probably Davis. They offer a viticulture major, I believe [they also have a post-bac in Classics
(Greek and Latin) -- how cool would that be, to combine those?]."

Now there would be a project. Try to reconstruct Falernian as a drinkable wine. The Viticulture and Enology Department at Davis has been around a long time. They even managed to survive Prohibition. They are also one of the world's repositories for rootstock.

Trader Joe's also has house wines a grade or two higher that Two Buck Chuck. One range, (running around $5 a bottle), all have the word 'Moon' in the label. (Velvet Moon, Purple Moon, usw.) The "Old Moon" Zinfandel is all old vine and is quite drinkable. Especially with something like Santa Maria barbeque. Mind, 2BC is not bad either. Because it is so inexpensive, I find I have a lot less compunction about using it for things like sangria, Gluehwein, and canning pears in merlot.

Haversack.

 

[Story]

Hi all,
I laughed so hard when DutchIndo mentioned "2-Buck Chuck". I am guilty of indulging in that winelol ... It's tasty! I enjoy it. I just recycled an empty bottle of Chuck's Cabernet Sauvignon. Time for a TJ's expedition!
Nothing like a glass of the above mentioned wine with a TJ's Chocolate Lava Cake:eusa_clap
Willys Gal

http://www.wineweb.com/scripts/wineryPg.cfm?w=2011

Try Searidge - I picked up one bottle at a local distributor, liked it enough to try all four and then bought a few cases (10% off, putting the bottle price at [Chef from South Park's dad's voice] TREE FIDDY![/Chef from South Park's dad's voice]

 

[Dr Doran]

************
It is sort of an equation to arrive at a value. If i remember right, Trader Joes made an arrangement to get all of the left overs in grape production and had a winery do their thing. Low cost and decent production equals an unbeatable value. Wine is a strange thing when it come to value, the good stuff really tends to cost, but a run to Beverages and More can show you that there are $10 wines as good as or better than a lot of $15-20 wines, and some $20 wines that can beat out a $35-40 wineand so forth. I have been with friends and we have bought some for those uber wines and you taste it and ask was this worth the money.

That is why i am happiest finding really good inexpensive wines.

I fully agree, my good fellow. My experience has confirmed your statement. And further, the discovery of good inexpensive wines is like finding a great suit or fedora for 20 bucks at Goodwill. It's the thrill of the hunt (although with wines you have to wait until you get home to find out what it's like, whereas in the Goodwill you can put the thing on).

Another thing to check out that is, I think, still cheap is Sardinian wines. I sold some that were quite nice and CHEAP. Best if you aerated them. I cannot be bothered to let a wine breathe for a long time -- I do the quick aeration process which from empirical investigation works just as well.

 

[Dr Doran]

Now there would be a project. Try to reconstruct Falernian as a drinkable wine. The Viticulture and Enology Department at Davis has been around a long time. They even managed to survive Prohibition. They are also one of the world's repositories for rootstock..

Utterly cool. Excellent idea. Falernian, Chian in Horace. Horace Odes 1.18, 3.21, 3.25. Remember that the Greeks mixed their wine with water in a krater and thought drinking it straight was barbaric ... must have been pretty potent stuff.

Then again, if you tried to reconstruct these they might turn out to be the opposite of our tastes. Vinegary.

 

[Lincsong]

Three separate neighbors of my parents make their own wine and brandy in their homes near Oakland.

 

[Dr Doran]

Three separate neighbors of my parents make their own wine and brandy in their homes near Oakland.

Maybe you can bring some to the next small meet or event?

 

[Lincsong]

I'll hit one of them up next time I catch one.

 

[John K Stetson]

Re: Zins - it's tough to go too far wrong with one of the three R's: Ridge, Ravenswood, or Rosenblum. A lot of differences within each winery's portfolio, of course, but that's part of the fun. Sadly, I am out of Ravenswood Dickerson/Old Hill/Beloni and down to my last bottle of Rosenblum Hendry Vineyard, bought as futures at an event at the winery.

Anyone here a member of ZAP ?

 

[Dr Doran]

My Kosher Jewish friends have introduced me to a tasty kosher Zinfandel called Baron Herzog. I think it is from California. Not expensive: perhaps 10 bucks. Worth a look.

I honestly think Ravenswood is not so good anymore, but that's just me talking. I am, once again, a freak for high-alcohol, "big," spicy Zins,* and Ravenswood is not doing that anymore as much as they used to.

Can't go wrong with any old vine Zins from Lodi, California, I must reiterate.

* I am also a freak in general.

 

[univibe88]

Can't go wrong with any old vine Zins from Lodi, California, I must reiterate.

I agree. Amador County is also great. It seems like many of the greatest Zins don't make it far from California.

Most of the stuff I can buy here in Boston is from Sonoma or south coast and is pretty tame, 13%ABV stuff. I can't find the Sierra Foothills, jammy, spicy, 15%+ABV stuff that just knocks your socks off.