Buying jackets on Japanese auction sites

[Rgcards]

Jon, if you don't mind my asking, How much was the jacket originally , such that you were charged 256 in customs? And second , what did dhl do to reduce the customs? Thanks in advance

 

[sweetfights]

Paypaal has sent tenso 株式会社 (tenso,inc.) notice the received merchandise that wasn't as described.
f the seller doesn’t respond to you, we'll automatically escalate the case to a claim for review on January 28, 2021. When a case is escalated to a claim, PayPal will review and decide the outcome, usually within 30 days.

This all sucks. You need a full and complete refund. Total BS!

 

[jonbuilder]

Jon, if you don't mind my asking, How much was the jacket originally , such that you were charged 256 in customs? And second , what did dhl do to reduce the customs? Thanks in advance

I do not know the answer I just complained to DHL that I should not be paying any customs fees for a US-made item returning to US. DHL agreed but responded with the low fee and said it was because the seller file that the item originated in Japan. DHL contacted US customs and the fee reduction resuled.

 

[jonbuilder]

Actually 裂 means crack or tear, so yes the translation is off. If you google translate しわ裂, you get wrinkle crack. Looking at the photos, I don't think it is simply hidden with a fold, it is possible that the long journey in an unsuitable packing has made it worse. May be the seller has glued it but it is now cracked wide open.
For those of you who is thinking of buying from Japan, please keep in mind that sellers on Yahoo Auction JP usually do not accept return not to mention the fact that your proxy service will not take responsibility unless it is them who damaged the item. It would be nearly impossible to return the item base on an error in the product description, not even when the seller listed the wrong size. So ask for actual measurements or have the seller take a photo of the size tag to make sure. When in doubt about the size and/or condition, don't buy. I know it is difficult to understand but that is the custom. No return should read buyers beware and absolutely no return.

Upon review, the way I see the transaction and my refund are I purchased the jacket from tenso 株式会社 (tenso,inc.) I based my purchase on his web site https://buyee.jp/mercari/item/m43513644147 I did not buy from a yahoo auction japan seller. The seller I did purchase from copied his description and the pictures from the Yahoo site. Because I went through pyapal (and I would not have purchased except for the fact tenso accepted payment through payapl) paypal rule applies. tenso is responsible for the condition of the jacket he sold me and the presentation he used. Any Yahoo auction transaction is between tenso and the yahoo seller, I am not involved

 

[jonbuilder]

This all sucks. You need a full and complete refund. Total BS!

I do anticipate getting a full refund of the purchase price of $1,422. The shipping did go through the seller tenso but I would have to start a separate complaint do not think it is worth the effort I would not know how to base the complaint seeing tenso did ship. I will need to file with US customs to get my $77 back something Elles that tenso fail at by miss representing where the jacket originated.

 

[sweetfights]

I do anticipate getting a full refund of the purchase price of $1,422. The shipping did go through the seller tenso but I would have to start a separate complaint do not think it is worth the effort I would not know how to base the complaint seeing tenso did ship. I will need to file with US customs to get my $77 back something less hat tenso fail at by miss representing where the jacket originated.

Good luck. I hope the remedy is speedy.

 

[jonbuilder]

Needless to say, I will be very hesitant to purchase another vintage jacket through tenso AKA buyee

 

[Blackadder]

Upon review, the way I see the transaction and my refund are I purchased the jacket from tenso 株式会社 (tenso,inc.) I based my purchase on his web site https://buyee.jp/mercari/item/m43513644147 I did not buy from a yahoo auction japan seller. The seller I did purchase from copied his description and the pictures from the Yahoo site. Because I went through pyapal (and I would not have purchased except for the fact tenso accepted payment through payapl) paypal rule applies. tenso is responsible for the condition of the jacket he sold me and the presentation he used. Any Yahoo auction transaction is between tenso and the yahoo seller, I am not involved

Well I can't say if your perception is right or wrong but there is a Terms of Service to which you have to agree when you applied for membership at Tenso. I suppose that would be their defence to your claim.

 

[jonbuilder]

Well I can't say if your perception is right or wrong but there is a Terms of Service to which you have to agree when you applied for membership at Tenso. I suppose that would be their defence to your claim.

That Terms of Service would apply if tenso was only performing a service and if the agreement was consistent with US law, but paypal seems to be acting as if tenso is selling me goods and their protection plan applies. So paypal will protect me and perhaps tenso can attempt to sue paypal but I am sure tenso signed an agreement with paypal and paypal has the muscle..

 

[Blackadder]

That Terms of Service would apply if tenso was only performing a service and if the agreement was consistent with US law, but paypal seems to be acting as if tenso is selling me goods and their protection plan applies. So paypal will protect me and perhaps tenso can attempt to sue paypal but I am sure tenso signed an agreement with paypal and paypal has the muscle..

Yes, that would be what paypal has to do in order to refund you because your payment is to Tenso and not the actual seller. So Paypal has to find a way to get around the terms of service but if a proxy service is held accountable as seller then the whole industry will have to charge a much higher premium (service fee) for taking on the risk. Personally, I have switched to another proxy service a long time ago but I would hate to see a substantial raise in service fee. I would be hesitate to say Tenso is the actual seller because of the minimum charges and profits they are making now compared to say those resellers on ebay and what Buyee used to charge back a few years ago, a 10% service surcharge on the purchase price.

 

[Mich486]

My understanding of proxies is that you don’t buy anything from them but rather they buy on your behalf and what they offer you is the service of buying from a website that wouldn’t otherwise ship outside of Japan. I’m not sure they could be held responsible for items not as described etc.

 

[jonbuilder]

@ Terry Here is a link to the form for a US custom refund ://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/forms-formulaires/b2g-eng.html
That is for Canada here is US link for form CBP3311 https://help.cbp.gov/s/article/Article-375?language=en_US

 

[jonbuilder]

My understanding of proxies is that you don’t buy anything from them but rather they buy on your behalf and what they offer you is the service of buying from a website that wouldn’t otherwise ship outside of Japan. I’m not sure they could be held responsible for items not as described etc.

I am not sure what will ultimately happen. The reason I started this thread was to bring light to the process that I am unfamiliar with. I will forward what paypal decides to do. So far tenso has not replied to paypal nor did he reply to my request to correct the custom documents. Paypal has their buyer protection plan reputation to protect and if paypal decides that tenso corrected $1,422 from me for goods, and those good are flawed, Paypal will refind my payment regardless of what I or others here think, and if tenso does not respond, paypal decides with what I have submitted.
Tenso did supply an invoice for goods?

 

[Mich486]

I wish you luck Jon and I hope you get your money back all I’m saying is that one needs to be careful as to not think that when using a proxy is like making a purchase on eBay. As you say though, PayPal will ultimately make their decision.

 

[Rgcards]

Good luck jon. My hesitation in buying things off japanese websites is the vulnerability involved in translation. If the seller disclosed something, but the translation was off it would be very awkward. I think it you're buying from a store on a Japanrse site that is probably a little less likely but I don't know. I bought a jacket off buyer that was " a little dirty". I have no idea what that meant. It ended up just looking like it was in good used condition, but in all honesty it could have been begrimed beyond belief and I wouldn't have know. Your case sounds like deliberate deception though. Good luck

 

[tmitchell59]

I have been using buyee on yahoo auction Japan like many here. I went there in search of Vintage Leather Jackets and have not been disappointed with the offerings. The cost, including all fees and shipping through DHL, is no more than I would have paid through ebay.

I have used Buyee for all my purchases and DHL shipping.

Here are my Lessons Learned:

Don't combine shipping unless you "ask them". It may cost you more as it did me.

Buyee marks everything as made in Japan. Understand there is no duty for American made items re-entering the US. You will not notice this until you exceed $800 declared value at which time you will assessed fees.

On my last purchase I exceeded and was assessed fees. I had never been assessed Customs Duties on prior purchases. I assumed they incorrectly filled out the form. Both items are labeled US. Buyee always puts Japan no matter what.

They refer you to their terms, which basically says they are not responsible for much.

I assume that all of the proxy services have the same language, and operating procedures.

 

[Blackadder]

My understanding of proxies is that you don’t buy anything from them but rather they buy on your behalf and what they offer you is the service of buying from a website that wouldn’t otherwise ship outside of Japan. I’m not sure they could be held responsible for items not as described etc.

Not only that. The sites linked to Buyee/Tenso like Rakuten, Yahoo Auction JP, Mecari are only marketplaces. Even if you can access those sites directly without needing a proxy, you are still taking risks. It is like ebay. It is only because paypal is so buyers friendly that many people risk buying on ebay.
I am glad Jon paid through paypal which actually gives him a chance to recoup any losses. I am also worried that proxy service may decide not to accept paypal in the future because of exposure to risk posed by those dishonest sellers. In any case, I don't think Tenso is the culprit here. It is easy for people to look at these proxy service as agents but IMO the responsibility placed on them is disproportionate to what they make and they themselves are not protected because paypal is not the usual choice of payment on those marketplaces. It is not like Tenso etc are charging the rate/commission of a broker or personal shopper. What they are charging is just a few hundred yens plus a share of the shipping fee. Afterall, the marketplaces themselves like ebay are not exposed to such risk despite them getting a share of the purchase price.

 

[jonbuilder]

Not only that. The sites linked to Buyee/Tenso like Rakuten, Yahoo Auction JP, Mecari are only marketplaces. Even if you can access those sites directly without needing a proxy, you are still taking risks. It is like ebay. It is only because paypal is so buyers friendly that many people risk buying on ebay.
I am glad Jon paid through paypal which actually gives him a chance to recoup any losses. I am also worried that proxy service may decide not to accept paypal in the future because of exposure to risk posed by those dishonest sellers. In any case, I don't think Tenso is the culprit here. It is easy for people to look at these proxy service as agents but IMO the responsibility placed on them is disproportionate to what they make and they themselves are not protected because paypal is not the usual choice of payment on those marketplaces. It is not like Tenso etc are charging the rate/commission of a broker or personal shopper. What they are charging is just a few hundred yens plus a share of the shipping fee. Afterall, the marketplaces themselves like ebay are not exposed to such risk despite them getting a share of the purchase price.

I generally agree with you, but I believe Tenso should take the trouble to examine what he is handling and shipping, fill the custom papers based on where the item was made, and do a quick hands-on examination to verify the item is consistent with the advertisement he presents on his website. Tenso takes the original seller's information and reformate and translates it onto his sale site. Maybe Tenso calculates the number of bad products payment forfeitures are not worth the time and trouble.

 

[Cyber Lip]

Buyee sucks. I had an issue with a purchase once that would have just taken a simple quick message to the seller to rectify, but they refused to do that. They couldn't be bothered to use the smallest amount of basic customer service. Screw them

 

[Cyber Lip]

imo it's not enough that the seller mentions a rip in the description, but hides it in the photos. At the very least it should have been made to be visible in the full shot of the front of the jacket, and ideally they really should have included an additional photo of the rip. So I'd say F buyee AND the seller. Pursue getting your $$ back and let those jokers fight it out later amongst themselves