Brim edging question.

[ManofKent]

That's beautiful work, Steve.

 

[TheDane]

That's beautiful work, Steve.

:arated: Is that a Borsalino? I think, they did a very similar treatment

 

[mayserwegener]

Richard, Thanks!

Ole, It's a Mayser Spezial. You are correct about Borsalino having a similar treatment. I also have a Hückel Weilheim with a similar binding. Here is what the Mayser Spezial looks like from a distance.

Echter Borsalino with similar treatment.

Hückel Weilheim Chevreau with similar treatment.

 

[ManofKent]

They're a beautiful trio Steve.

 

[fedoracentric]

I have seen Stetsons with that brim treatment too.

 

[mayserwegener]

Do you have examples? I am talking about the brim binding (see closeup a few posts back).

 

[fedoracentric]

I saw this edge in a recent ebay listing. I think one of the guys here bought it.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Vintage-Stetson-The-Fray-1920s-Era-Blue-Fedora-Hat-/331085593724

 

[mayserwegener]

That looks like stitching on the brim edge. The ones I posted have brim binding and you can't see the stitching on the top side (looped).

 

[TheDane]

I saw this edge in a recent ebay listing. I think one of the guys here bought it.

That's a very different treatment to my eyes.

Ole, It's a Mayser Spezial. You are correct about Borsalino having a similar treatment.

Yup, that's exactly the Borsa-brim I meant. I like the Mayser better, though. I really like the one row of short stitches and two rows of long stitches

 

[barrowjh]

Mayerswegener, the grey homberg in the foreground has a treatment similar (maybe exactly the same) to the brim binding you are discussing. The binding is stitched on one side and the fabric pulled over the stitches and around to the other side of the brim where the stitching is visible for the other side. In this case it produces what appears to be a beaded edge, because you cannot see the remainder of the binding (wide side plus visible stitches) because they are hidden within the pencil-curl. The lining indicates it is a 'Willard' hat, and the best guess made here so far is that there was a hatter located in the old Willard hotel in Washington, D. C. So, the curled edge on this homberg looks like it is raw except for the beading, until you actually have the hat in your hand and take a good look at the other side (top side that is curled into the pencil curl). We do not see that very often, and I agree it adds another level of 'special' that makes a hat stand apart from more common edge treatments.

 

[TheDane]

Mayerswegener, the grey homberg in the foreground has a treatment similar (maybe exactly the same) to the brim binding you are discussing.

Could you upload a picture, where the brim treatment is visible, please? I don't quite get the explanation

 

[DJH]

Hmm, I'd not thought about this before, but I don't remember ever seeing this hidden stitching bound brim on a Stetson or other US made hat - not to suggest examples don't exist of course.

The only hat with that treatment I personally have is a Borsalino.

 

[TheDane]

The only hat with that treatment I personally have is a Borsalino.

Exactly, and that is a true beauty, David! Should it ever be in need of a vacation, I would be happy to offer a warm home with lots of playmates. A week or two would be no problem at all - and you can always tell the old Italian, that I actually make a pretty nice espresso lol

 

[barrowjh]

thedane asked for pictures, so I scrambled just now to try that out, difficult to get good pictures of the 'other' side in incandescent lighting. here goes -


here is a close-up of the how the brim looks to someone standing next to you - notice the binding meets the felt with just a tiny shadow line. The grosgain has been pulled back over itself to hide the stitches.


Here is the 'other' side, normally hidden within the pencil curl:

You can see it is stitched normally, like any brim binding. You can hide the stitches on only one side. Maybe I should not call this a pencil-curled brim, as it is really closer to being a full kettle curl with the sides curled up, and the special bound brim treatment. Maybe some hatter will call me out here and correctly identify this.

 

[barrowjh]

Since I have the hat out of the box, I will say more about it - it has an oilskin-lined tip and the oilskin moisture barrier, so I am thinking 1940s - mid 50s at the least. "The Williard Shop" (please excuse my previous mispelling) Stoneleigh Court Washington DC is the markings, clearly two i's in Williard. I guess it is unusual also in that the stitching on the 'other' side - the stitching we can see if we look inside the kettle curl - that stitching does not go through the felt, not visible on the outside, so this is an example of some very sensitive sewing machine techniques that are not common. Definitely a high-end hat.

 

[mayserwegener]

Yes this appears to be the same. Now that I think about it I am pretty sure Cavanagh did this too with some of their Homburgs.

 

[fedoracentric]

1950 Stetson De Luxe.

A thin 1/4 inch ribbon binding with two rows of stitching.

 

[jlee562]

Yes this appears to be the same. Now that I think about it I am pretty sure Cavanagh did this too with some of their Homburgs.

My Cavanagh Homburg has the same style binding as barrowjh's hat above.

 

[TheDane]

Both brims are actually different from Steve's and the Borsa. John's is sewn, so the "inside" stitches are not visible on the outside - and yet they seem made with a machine(?) Indeed very nice!

The Stetson is quite a bit different from the rest. It's a pretty ordinary machine stitching, that is also seen on other brands - sometimes with two and sometimes with three visible stitchings on the other side. In this particular version it looks like the two inner stitchings were sewn on a double-needle machine. Hard to tell from the pic, though.

I have an Adam with the same kind of treatment - with two visible stitchings on the underside:



It's a simpler and cheaper treatment than the ones sported on Steve's and David's hats. I don't think I have seen any American hats with treatments quite like them.

John's is almost a "reversed" standard homburg binding. Except for the visible stitching, that ususally goes all through the brim (visible on both sides) if machine-sewn. Other traditional homburgs sport a handsewn binding without visible stitches on any of the sides - like the bindings you see on bowlers.

 

[Brad Bowers]

Yes this appears to be the same. Now that I think about it I am pretty sure Cavanagh did this too with some of their Homburgs.

Yep, I have several Cavanagh Homburgs like this.

Brad