Brag about your blends!

[Spatterdash]

How-do, gang.

Let me begin this with the caveat that I and many others are well aware of the devotion to pure beaver here in the Lounge. 100% pure beaver, new or vintage, is the preferred choice among discriminating hatters and hattees for a reason, a number of reasons. Beaver has a well-earned reputation and I have no desire to dispute it's place as one of the finest felts made by man.
Nutria may come slightly before or slightly after beaver in the minds of the fedora fanatic, as it also has a storied history and offers extraordinary qualities for hatmaking.

How-some-ever...

This thread is dedicated to blends and the appreciation of a well-mixed felt. Like beaver and nutria, blends also have a grand history and have served our species well in the past. With the right finishing and preparation, they can still make for an astonishing hat.
Blends are commonly an afterthought in the Lounge, and so may not be seen by a newcomer as a viable option, which isn't true.

So come in here and brag about your blends, be they rabbit+beaver, beaver+nutria, all three, a little mink mixture or a chimera felt like we've never seen. What's the blend and how's that hat holding up? Where'd you get it and would you get more?
It's blend boasting time, brought to you by my grandfather's old custom blend, a tan stingybrim with a wide black ribbon made of beaver and rabbit wrought in 1959, courtesy of Peter Bros., my first real hat... no taper yet.

 

[Spellflower]

Good points, Spatterdash! When I first came to the Lounge, I read so much about "pure" beaver that I started to think that blends were inferior, as with Scotch. This misguided logic actually caused me to pass up one of Aaron's 50/50 Baileys in favor of an Akubra Fedora because I thought it was better to have a "pure" wild hare hat. :eusa_doh: I still cry about that sometimes, but I hope this thread will teach other newbies that while hats and Scotch are both enjoyed by refined gentlemen, that's where their similarities end.

One problem, however, is that it's very difficult to know the composition of vintage felts. Can we assume that any vintage hat that isn't a very high end model is a blend? Or are there older models that didn't make a big deal about being pure beaver?

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

Or are there older models that didn't make a big deal about being pure beaver?

That's an interesting question you raise, and a notion that I've harbored for some time. It comforts me to think that more of my hats are pure beaver because the really oldies my not indicate what at that time was considered obvious or standard. But I too wonder...

Now, on the "blend" business; I may not seem like a novice to those who see me with a different fine hat on every day for a month at a time, but as with many narrow and deep subjects there are always things to learn.

You see, none of my felt hats (Stetson, Dobbs, Beaver Brand, Borsalino, Champ, Resistol...of the 30s, 40s and some 50s) have any reference to anything other than "Beaver" if they even have that.

So, my question is: How would one know what kind of blend they may or may not have?

Gene

 

[Art Fawcett]

Gents, with all due respect, I believe that the gold standard for hats IS pure beaver and following that logic, everything else IS inferior.
That said, there is room for discussion on blends and there always was and always will be blends that are done for various reasons that offer various results. Beaver blends, nutria, mink, seal, ALL have slightly different feels and qualities but to be totally honest, most (even hatters) won't be able to tell the differences just by touch. The most dramatic "feel" differences are between rabbit ( staple) and beaver ( pure) and seal ( pure). The feel of seal & beaver are so close I can't tell the difference between them, but both are "night & day" when compared to staple.
So, much of the "blend" deal is about promotion and an effort to distinquish different brands from others. In short, mostly marketing IMHO

 

[Art Fawcett]

Gene, it's my belief that virtually all vintage hats are rabbit. If there was a blend of any kind you can bet that they would be touting that fact. I can't recall any Stetson ( or any brand) with beaver content that DIDN'T tout beaver content if it had it in the hat. So, I wouldn't bet on the content unless it was stated somewhere on the liner or leather of the hat.

 

[Brad Bowers]

My 2 cents...

Regarding vintage hats only:

Pure beaver was rather rare back in the Golden Era and commanded higher prices then, as it does now. In all of my hat research, everything I've run across regarding felt composition says that majority of hats were made entirely with hare/rabbit, though higher-end hats would have beaver added to them. My guess is that any hat sweatband that says "Beaver" is a blend, and not 100% beaver.

Brad

 

[Brad Bowers]

Gene, it's my belief that virtually all vintage hats are rabbit. If there was a blend of any kind you can bet that they would be touting that fact. I can't recall any Stetson ( or any brand) with beaver content that DIDN'T tout beaver content if it had it in the hat. So, I wouldn't bet on the content unless it was stated somewhere on the liner or leather of the hat.

Art, you beat me to it! I took too long to type.lol

Brad

 

[Spatterdash]

Surely we can have one thread where we can say, "ya know, I got a neat old blend that I wore through a blizzard once...'

Right?

Brad, my question would be percentages of beaver and/or rabbit in those higher end vintage hats, but I gotta hunch that's likely gonna remain a mystery for most older brands.

 

[Spellflower]

So if vintage hats are almost all pure rabbit, why do so many people here say they are as good or better than modern pure beaver? Having never even touched a hat that I knew to have ANY beaver, I'm not saying it ain't so, just asking.

 

[Spatterdash]

I've read comments about an aging process they used to use, something that's no longer practical, that led to rabbit being a much higher quality felt than today's staple...

(glances at Art and Brad)

Is that valid or is it bogus, guys? [huh]

 

[feltfan]

Art,

See how I'm not posting any opinions here?

 

[Brad Bowers]

So if vintage hats are almost all pure rabbit, why do so many people here say they are as good or better than modern pure beaver? Having never even touched a hat that I knew to have ANY beaver, I'm not saying it ain't so, just asking.

I don't think they are better than modern beaver. They ARE better than modern rabbit/hare bodies, and I think a lot of that was due to the mercuric nitrate used in the felting process. Modern rabbit bodies don't seem to felt as tightly and just cannot finish off as well as vintage. However, I don't think that explains all of it, as mercuric nitrate was outlawed here in the U.S. on Dec. 1, 1941, but hats made later than that still have a nice felt. Perhaps it's just a technique or something that's been lost along the way.

As Art said above, the edge still goes to modern 100% beaver.

We are off topic from talking about blends, aren't we?

Brad

 

[Art Fawcett]

So if vintage hats are almost all pure rabbit, why do so many people here say they are as good or better than modern pure beaver?

Please note Spellflower, hatters are not the ones saying this, consumers are. It then becomes opinion (even mine) and you know what they say about opinions.

Thanks Feltfan, I'm noticing

I don't think they are better than modern beaver. They ARE better than modern rabbit/hare bodies, and I think a lot of that was due to the mercuric nitrate used in the felting process. Modern rabbit bodies don't seem to felt as tightly and just cannot finish off as well as vintage. However, I don't think that explains all of it, as mercuric nitrate was outlawed here in the U.S. on Dec. 1, 1941, but hats made later than that still have a nice felt

Agreed Brad, but I would add the theory that comes from our friend Steve Delk that felt continues the felting process during it's wearing and just with atmospheric conditions BUT, it reaches it's maximum felting at some point in time and becomes 'dead". So, in short, to really examine apples & apples, the modern felts would need to age the same amount of time to then judge dead felt to dead felt.

Is that valid or is it bogus, guys?

beats me but it makes for heated discussions...lol

 

[Brad Bowers]

I've read comments about an aging process they used to use, something that's no longer practical, that led to rabbit being a much higher quality felt than today's staple...

(glances at Art and Brad)

Is that valid or is it bogus, guys? [huh]

Are you talking about letting the hat bodies sit quietly in a darkened warehouse for three years before they are turned into finished hats?

I've not run across a single fact to support that this was done back in the day, and it certainly makes no economic sense whatsoever. It's not like these things are bourbons.

If there's another process to which you're referring, then I haven't heard of it.

Brad

 

[Brad Bowers]

Agreed Brad, but I would add the theory that comes from our friend Steve Delk that felt continues the felting process during it's wearing and just with atmospheric conditions BUT, it reaches it's maximum felting at some point in time and becomes 'dead". So, in short, to really examine apples & apples, the modern felts would need to age the same amount of time to then judge dead felt to dead felt.

I'd forgot about that. Let's meet back here in 30 years and compare the two felts!lol

Brad

 

[Spellflower]

I think it's valid to compare a modern beaver with a vintage rabbit- they're both options we have here and now. Maybe Art's creations will have a longer life than hats made in the 40's, and maybe they will be remarkably better in 50 years than any hat that exists today, but by then most of us will either be dead or too old to stand out in the rain.

As for the topic, Spatterdash, I'm afraid it's going to be difficult to discuss anything but Beaver Brand and Camptown, and a handful of others, since those are the only brands I'm aware of that we can really be sure are blends.

 

[Spatterdash]

Are you talking about letting the hat bodies sit quietly in a darkened warehouse for three years before they are turned into finished hats?

I've not run across a single fact to support this, and it certainly makes no economic sense whatsoever. It's not like these things are bourbons.

If there's another process to which you're referring, then I haven't heard of it.

Brad

That was exactly the description I found, but it was a slightly heated warehouse, very hush-hush on the temps and locales. It was one of those things that make you slow down and wonder. This sensation is quickly followed by a chilling realization - you don't know enough about this almost occultic craft of hatmaking to even guess if it's plausible or not.

It's a terrible sensation for a hat fan. Makes you want a hug, maybe some Oreos and milk...

Thanks, Brad.

Spellflower, yeah, unless some people have older hats that they know are blends. Optimos are sometimes requested as a blend, and I thought early Adventurebilts were available as blends at one point.

 

[Brad Bowers]

This sensation is quickly followed by a chilling realization - you don't know enough about this almost occultic craft of hatmaking to even guess if it's plausible or not.

I won't even dare tell you the sacrificial ritual performed over every Cavanagh Edge...

There is a blend available to custom hatters around the country, but it's a western-weight felt, and so it's usually only found in western hats.

Brad

 

[tonyb]

So, are those old Stetsons marked 3X Beaver Quality on their sweatbands and liner tops (such the handful of '50s vintage ones in my collection) have much if any beaver content?

Just that it says "beaver" doesn't say one whole heck of a lot, no? I mean, Beaver Brand hats don't necessarily have any beaver content whatsoever, the name notwithstanding. And they certainly make explicit that their $395 offering is 100 percent beaver.

 

[Art Fawcett]

must be my cynical day..

Tony, I've often wondered the same thing. In discussing such things with my felter I discovered there are western hatters that offer "mink" in their hats (which by the way isn't a good fur to use as it adds nothing to the strength) by throwing in a "pinch" of mink into a body. Now, the question is, does this really mean anything or is it marketing? My suspicion is that "Beaver Quality" has to do with the finishing, rather than the content. If it really has to do with the "blend", is it more than just a pinch? If my memory serves right, Stetson only claimed "pure" beaver in their hats marked "Clear Beaver" but I could be wrong and would rely on better historians than myself.