BMW R-71/R-75

[Ed Bass]

Anyone know of a reliable source for one of these WWII vintage motorcycles? I am looking for a relatively complete bike, but not a fully restored one. I'd prefer to do the restoration myself.

 

[Story]

Have you investigated the Chinese/Soviet/East German - made copies?

 

[Ed Bass]

Yes I have. And after a lengthy investigation I've decided to try and locate an original BMW. Although the Chinese CJ750 looks like a good copy, it is just built from inferior materials and is unreliable at best. The Soviet built Ural is only marginally better than the Chinese version. Both were supposed to be reverse engineered copies of the original BMW but due to the poorer quality craftsmanship and inferior alloys neither one came close to measuring up to the original.
The originals seem to be in garages and fields all over Europe. I'll go that route if I can't find one closer to home.
Best, Toots

 

[griffer]

I like the Zundap!

Curious to see what this thread uncovers.

 

[Ed Bass]

Curious to see what this thread uncovers.

So am I....lol

Best, Toots

 

[Sonoma Jack]

Finding a complete unrestored military bike will be tough, but finding one with the sidecar and sidecar mount will be extreeeeeemly difficult. You might want to try asking around on the various military paraphernalia and collectibles forums. Be prepared--you'll likely pay a steep price for a mostly complete and correct survivor.

 

[dhermann1]

If you took an extended vacation and drove along the northern fringe of the Sahara for a few hundred miles, you'd probably find all the various pieces you need in an excellent state of preservation. You could probably find motorcycles, trucks, tanks, etc. etc., both German and British, and even Italian.

 

[Diamondback]

But how much would putting together such an expedition cost upfront? And what would be the expected recovery from sale of other recovered vehicles? We'll just nevermind that those battlefields are graveyards also...

I'd expect a lot to have to be pieced together from multiple wrecks, too--which may reduce value to some collectors. Sounds like an interesting adventure, though...

 

[dhermann1]

Not to mention the none too friendly attitudes of most of the denizens of that part of the world. It seemed like a fun idea tho.

 

[Diamondback]

Not to mention the none too friendly attitudes of most of the denizens of that part of the world. It seemed like a fun idea tho.

So, we do the Al Capone thing taken to its logical and morally correct conclusion: "A kind word and a gun, and the knowledge of how and when to use each, will get you farther than either alone." (Bold is my adjustment for Capone's small-time worldview.)

Libya'd get dicey, but in southern/western Egypt, and maybe in Tunisia, such an expedition might have a chance... provided you were sufficiently skilled in building goodwill with the locals. Pack lots of extra supplies to barter with...

 

[Micawber]

I seem to recall seeing these come up for sale in the military vehicle collector scene every now and again, not often though. A scan of the various club and collector boards etc could provide leads.

One or two friends who served in the desert during and after the war would sometimes mention how that they witnessed large pits being excavated in which would be dumped large quantities of Axis vehicles, wreckage and hardware.

 

[Speedster]

These might be able to assist you: http://www.blitzbikes.com/index.htm

They are selling Chang Jiangs in the US but are also dealing in original BMW and Z?ºndapp bikes.

And a few others:
http://www.wehrmachtsgespann.de/
http://www.beemergarage.com/R75only.html

 

[RondoHatton]

Seem to recall a Chinese side valve boxer twin sidecar at a Hollywood Motorcycles shop where an older (/2? /5?) BMW motor was swapped in - reverse engineered is right, the gearbox on the replica gave it four speeds BACKWARDS. Don't recall if it was ever sorted out - I think it may still be there 10 years later parked in the boneyard.
How I used to lust after an R69 with a cobra handled Steib hack...

 

[griffer]

that blitzbike site looks a heck of a lot better thant the Russian site i was looking at. I love the Zundap, of course, but the civi R35 looks like sex on two wheels!

I wonder if they would sell the stuff to refit a Ural to resemble the BMW?

I have actually heard good things about the new state side Urals. My sister has military Ural with side car. She hates the finicky idle, and it stalled on her a lot at first, but she and her husband have been enjoying it.

(Side note: My brother in law flies to work from Vancouver, WA to Hillsboro, OR. Last I heard, he kept the Ural at the hangar for his commute to the office.)

 

[Ed Bass]

Speedster,
Thanks for the links. I was already familiar with two of those but the third is a great help.
Still looking, if anyone else can provide a lead I'd appreciate it.
Best, Toots

 

[fishmeok]

I own a Chang Jiang (pronounced "chung jung") that I built up from milkcrates and added a BMW 90/6 motor. There are several reputable guys in China right now who will build an excellent 6V side-valve flathead M1 with a sidecar for around 5K- to your specs, in your color, and with good parts. I don't think you could even hope to find an R75 or KS750 in any condition for less than 8 grand. Fully restored bikes are going for 20K on up. The current Russian Ural is a completey different bike than what was being offered 5 years ago. Reliable and fun. The days of getting an old Soviet graymarket domestic production POS are long gone.
My bike:
www.changjiangunlimited.com/Mark.htm
Everything you ever wanted to know about Changs:
www.changjiangunlimited.com

Cheers
Mark

 

[Ed Bass]

Thanks for the info and links Mark.
Best, Toots

 

[renor27]

you are looking @ a lot of money

As some one who has built a few R75s i can say that you are going to spend over $25,000 for one that has been rebuilt.
If you can find a R75 with its sidecar not running expect to pay 10 grand and up. R71 are a bit cheeper.
The BMW motor parts can be fund the R75 has a very complex trany and there are very few NOS parts. If you need any thing most of the times you will have to build then your self.
The CJ750 can be mocked up to look so much like the R71 and a lot of guys are doing that. Could also put a later BMW motor say a mid 1960's R50/2 motor in it. Thats my next project.
Why are you going for a war bike I know they are cool but you will have more fun with a BMW/2. War bikes are slow too and /2's you can enjoy on tours with.
David

 

[Ed Bass]

Hello David,
I've collected many vintage autos, owned many motorcycles and I'm no stranger to the restoration process. I'd prefer an original BMW over the copy bikes for all the obvious reasons. Although the inexpensive copies are interesting that is not really what I'm looking for. At $25k a restored original sounds like a bargain to me. Compare to some of the current Harley Davidsons and you'll see what I mean.
Best, Toots

 

[Sonoma Jack]

As a past BMW GS owner, I would encourage everybody to try a boxer at least once. That said, I think this would be a heck of a lot of fun:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wid6HDCStQs