Bill Kelso Harleys Cafe Racer

[Damon141]

So I’ve looked and looked everywhere and can not find one picture of this jacket in the wild. Only the site images. I emailed them a couple weeks ago but I know how these makers can be about emailing so I’m not holding my breath to hear back from them.

Considering all of the J100 repros out there, this is sort of a breath of fresh air for a vintage cafe racer and seeing Marc’s original has definitely sparked interest. Besides that the build quality from the pictures look amazing, far cleaner stitching than the Schotts I’ve been used to or the Lewis I am in the process of.

I know if I ever picked one of these I would ask them not to give it the vintage treatment, I can do that myself over time.

PS: I’ve heard all the controversies and I’m not looking to rehash that. Obviously there are laws governing what portion of a product has to be made in the EU to be labeled as such.

 

[navetsea]

aren't they made in greece? or at least a company from Greece address

 

[Peacoat]

The location of Bill Kelso is discussed in this thread:

Bill Kelso

Hi, just looking for some opinions on this maker. I’m not overly knowledgeable ( as you’ve probably already worked out ) on these things but I have heard of them and don’t remember hearing anything bad . Any help would be much appreciated. I’ve seen a jacket I’m very tempted in.

www.thefedoralounge.com

 

[Damon141]

Their prices are pretty high but their Buco models look in pictures just as good as Real McCoys and the Durable looks just as good as the Toys McCoys version and you get custom sizing. This way it might actually fit and won’t be on eBay or the classifieds like so many people have.
The wingman looks like an awesome halfbelt.

I

 

[Blackadder]

Their prices are pretty high but their Buco models look in pictures just as good as Real McCoys and the Durable looks just as good as the Toys McCoys version and you get custom sizing. This way it might actually fit and won’t be on eBay or the classifieds like so many people have.
The wingman looks like an awesome halfbelt.

I

Quality aside. I think the fit goes further. A "custom" BK would if done correctly fit your body but the pattern is not tweaked like the Japanese brands. Japanese brands usually have narrow armholes and straight sleeves that is closer to a Lewis Leather pattern.
BK on the other hand copied the original American brands which has larger armhole and sleeves that open wide and taper to the wrist. The original HD Sportster is the classic example with wide armhole. You can see from Marc's photo that the HD's upper arm has quite a lot of extra room. The RM Buco on the other hand would fit your upper arm with little room. I think that is one of the reasons why some people are attracted to the Japanese brands.
Incidentally, I have been asked by a fellow lounger and BK loyal customer to measure the armhole and arm width of my RC so BK can make him a custom jacket with a Japanese "fit".
Even Schott has its own "slim" up version of their Perfectos. So I think BK and TM Durable would "fit" or rather look very different even if they have the same length and chest.
Without saying one is better than the other, neither is in fact perfect substitute for the other.

 

[navetsea]

some examples here in the past shows BK cuff were quite wide not sealing, is some type of LW also not tapering on the cuff maybe a deliberate design to wear the glove/ gauntlet inside the sleeve?

 

[Blackadder]

some examples here in the past shows BK cuff were quite wide not sealing, is some type of LW also not tapering on the cuff maybe a deliberate design to wear the glove/ gauntlet inside the sleeve?

I think that is the problem we see often. I have seen that with Aero and LW. When they are asked to shorten the sleeves, they just straight up cut it without adjusting the proportion or drop i.e. using the same sleeves pattern and you end up with a wider cuff. So unless your arm is at least as long as their standard pattern, you would likely end up with a wide cuff.

 

[Hide'n'seek]

I think that is the problem we see often. I have seen that with Aero and LW. When they are asked to shorten the sleeves, they just straight up cut it without adjusting the proportion or drop i.e. using the same sleeves pattern and you end up with a wider cuff. So unless your arm is at least as long as their standard pattern, you would likely end up with a wide cuff.

Can't speak for Lost Worlds but at Aero this simply isn't the case. When sleeves or body are adjusted the original cuff / hem width are kept as per original. The cuff width on a jacket that is standard or has had 2" removed is the same width.

 

[JMax]

My LW seal very well at the cuff. A few like Vanson. Just one I wish sealed more but it isn’t horrible.

 

[Damon141]

Quality aside. I think the fit goes further. A "custom" BK would if done correctly fit your body but the pattern is not tweaked like the Japanese brands. Japanese brands usually have narrow armholes and straight sleeves that is closer to a Lewis Leather pattern.
BK on the other hand copied the original American brands which has larger armhole and sleeves that open wide and taper to the wrist. The original HD Sportster is the classic example with wide armhole. You can see from Marc's photo that the HD's upper arm has quite a lot of extra room. The RM Buco on the other hand would fit your upper arm with little room. I think that is one of the reasons why some people are attracted to the Japanese brands.
Incidentally, I have been asked by a fellow lounger and BK loyal customer to measure the armhole and arm width of my RC so BK can make him a custom jacket with a Japanese "fit".
Even Schott has its own "slim" up version of their Perfectos. So I think BK and TM Durable would "fit" or rather look very different even if they have the same length and chest.
Without saying one is better than the other, neither is in fact perfect substitute for the other.

From reading there are two camps on this and most here swear nothing fits better than the original ones.
Plus due to leather’s unforgiving nature, you literally have to have the exact formula perfect for a Real McCoys Or Toys McCoys Repro to fit, 1st you have to be pretty thin (low body mass or muscular mass) then you you have to fit the chest and shoulders but if you are short then the sleeves are going to look silly and wrinkled up your arm, too short and it’s halfway up the wrist. And the Buco and durable have very wide shoulders in the larger sizes and just one look at pictures over a size 40 and they pretty much hang over every person’s shoulders.
Plus the larger sizes tend to have a wide hem, very little taper so the whole high arm hole thing doesn’t match their concept of the Japanese build because if you are lean with wide shoulders and broad chest then usually you would have a narrow waist.

I’m the end all we can do is judge by the members that take the time to actually take pictures and post them but I have a hunch than most people that buy off the rack jackets don’t fit them perfectly and either don’t realize that the sleeves are 3” too long or the waist looks like a trash bag.
Or they just resell them.

Look at suits, it’s just part of the process with off the rack that you have it altered before bringing it home. In a perfect world any of these companies would have 3 lengths on each model, short, regular, and long.

 

[lopo]

aren't they made in greece? or at least a company from Greece address

Hi,
Bill Kelso jackets are made in the old Real McCoy's New Zealand factory in Christchurch. See the screenshot.
Enter in browser: dnb.com, then appears: dun&bradstreet, in their search field enter:
THE REAL MCCOY'S NEW ZEALAND LIMITED.
There you find the link to the Bill Kelso website

 

[Canuck Panda]

So is Andy Falzone an alter ego of Masahide Ishizuka?

All the drama from the locked BK thread has actually pushed me (out of curiosity) to buy a BK jacket. So far things seems legit. Emails with "Andy" about my order has been similar to my experience with other brands, professional. Will post when I get the jacket.

Unsolved mysteries...

 

[dannyk]

So is Andy Falzone an alter ego of Masahide Ishizuka?

All the drama from the locked BK thread has actually pushed me (out of curiosity) to buy a BK jacket. So far things seems legit. Emails with "Andy" about my order has been similar to my experience with other brands, professional. Will post when I get the jacket.

Unsolved mysteries...

BK should be just fine these days. I haven’t heard or seen a huge Andy blow up in years. As long as someone knows the history and are cool with it; I would think your order should be good. What are ya looking at? I’ve always been curious about the quality of their product range. Only a few been bought around here.

 

[Blackadder]

Well, I guess I am wrong about Aero. Guess problem lies with my fd's skinny arm and narrow wrist. Aero did slimmed down the sleeves for him after he sent his custom jacket back. Great customer service.

 

[Canuck Panda]

BK should be just fine these days. I haven’t heard or seen a huge Andy blow up in years. As long as someone knows the history and are cool with it; I would think your order should be good. What are ya looking at? I’ve always been curious about the quality of their product range. Only a few been bought around here.

Peter's Aviator from their archive line.

 

[Blackadder]

BK should be just fine these days. I haven’t heard or seen a huge Andy blow up in years. As long as someone knows the history and are cool with it; I would think your order should be good. What are ya looking at? I’ve always been curious about the quality of their product range. Only a few been bought around here.

It wasn't just his temper. There were a few other things
e.g.
The rather significant price increase and the inadequate explanation for the increase;
After he convinced prospective buyer of the very best quality of the Victory HH, he had trouble with the supply of it and had to switch to the Liberty HH

 

[handymike]

I’m very curious to read about your jacket when it’s done. The only member I know with experience with the archives is @regius.

 

[Marc mndt]

The Real Mccoys new Zealand x Harley Davidson :

Bill kelso wildboy:

I see similarities

 

[Canuck Panda]

So did I just bought a jacket, made by Frodo, who works for a Ninja boss, who has moved to live in Mount Olympus?

All (bad) jokes aside. I was never interested in RMC brand before, for the obvious $$$ reasons. But now I am...

I want to fly Zero Battle in Japanese sky, "I have seen the Zero Fighter II who went home with enthusiasm of the owner

There are currently only four aircraft that can fly in the world, three of which are owned by overseas individuals and museums. In such a circumstance, it is said that Zero Fighter Type II which finally came true with the enthusiasm of the only Japanese owner, "I want to fly a zero game in the...

gigazine.net

"Meanwhile, the current owner Masahide Ishizuka is a flight jacket maker "The fewCEO of. Mr. Ishizuka who is also a writer of air magazine, in 2004 encountered a different set of zero warfare different from this aircraft and wrote an article saying "If it can make it possible to make it fly and go home"."

But what's the connection to the name Bill Kelso? Who was a baseball player. There is another leather jacket brand, Satchel Paige, who also named after an old baseball player...

Regardless, If BK is Masahide Ishizuka then he has WWII plane... a WWII plane...

When I did my digging, BK Greece address was a rental warehouse address. Like a storage warehouse but for/with offices. So I knew it wasn't made in Greece. For the material used I ruled out China and Pakistan (but not 100%). But none of this matters now if the guy actually has an old war bird... This mystery just got a lot more interesting.

 

[Aloysius]

So I’ve looked and looked everywhere and can not find one picture of this jacket in the wild. Only the site images. I emailed them a couple weeks ago but I know how these makers can be about emailing so I’m not holding my breath to hear back from them.

Considering all of the J100 repros out there, this is sort of a breath of fresh air for a vintage cafe racer and seeing Marc’s original has definitely sparked interest. Besides that the build quality from the pictures look amazing, far cleaner stitching than the Schotts I’ve been used to or the Lewis I am in the process of.

I know if I ever picked one of these I would ask them not to give it the vintage treatment, I can do that myself over time.

PS: I’ve heard all the controversies and I’m not looking to rehash that. Obviously there are laws governing what portion of a product has to be made in the EU to be labeled as such.

Is this one of the jackets BK has actually made, or one of the selection of vintage jacket photos that they will 'make' on request?

I'm not knocking or praising BK either way, just think this should be clarified because it could affect what you get.

The Real Mccoys new Zealand x Harley Davidson :

View attachment 424480 View attachment 424486

Bill kelso wildboy:

View attachment 424484 View attachment 424483
I see similarities

I do, too… but this theory raises more questions than answers.

If Bill Kelso is the continuation of the original RMC/The Few factory, why don't they publicize that instead of this whole Greece story? Nothing wrong with Greece, but I have very little interest in the nu-RMC yet I (and perhaps others) would happily line up to buy a jacket from the NZ operation. It would be more prestigious, I would think.