Berets, Anyone?

[Daan]

Berets as Investment?

Le Poilu has been a treasure trove for collectors of uniforms (and berets) for over 30 years. The shop is located at 18 rue Emile Duclaux in the south-west of Paris. Apart from their own stock, the shop acts as an intermediary for hard to find objects.
And to prove what an investment a simple beret can be, here two samples of recently sold berets.

Beret of the French Tank Regiment, 1940, sold for 480,00 € (approx. US $ 540.00):

Beret of the 14th BCA (Battalion Chasseurs Alpin), 1937, sold for 280,00 € (approx. US $ 315.00):

Interesting detail: both are Basque berets, with the cabilliou still in place!

 

[GrayEyes]

for those of you who are into historic berets and who have a German bank account*, this might be of interest.

on an online auction website, a person is selling a codeba beret that is nearly identical to the beret worn by west berlin mayor Ernst Reuter. Reuter was mayor of west berlin at the time of the berlin blockade and airlift. he was a stalwart champion of freedom for berliners. He was also a famous beret wearer. in fact, when he was buried, his coffin was covered in the berlin flag and topped by his beret.

here is the beret for sale:
https://www.hood.de/i/codeba-beret-barett-baskenmuetze-schwarz-55-vintage-hist-44024713.htm

here is Reuter's beret, with the label and lining visible (identical to one for sale):


here are photos of the beret atop his coffin:
http://www.protokoll-inland.de/SharedDocs/Bilder/PI/DE/Wandel/Reuter/bild3.jpg?__blob=normal&v=3
http://www.protokoll-inland.de/SharedDocs/Bilder/PI/DE/Wandel/Reuter/bild9.jpg?__blob=normal&v=3


*the seller wants a wire transfer (überweisung) from a german bank account.

 

[leftyguy]

Just got back from a lovely week in Scotland (Loch Maree) & here's a couple of shots of my Auloronesa Casquette "up the hill" so to speak. It got soaking wet but kept my head dry & didn't shrink at all. Marvellous!

 

[RJR]

leftyguy,that casquette has become a favorite of mine as well.

 

[GrayEyes]

It looks great, and that landscape is beautiful, too. Lucky you.

By the way, is the brim on the casquette soft and pliable? Can you roll it up and put it in your pack or pocket?

 

[RJR]

Yes,you can roll it up.

 

[leftyguy]

It looks great, and that landscape is beautiful, too. Lucky you.

By the way, is the brim on the casquette soft and pliable? Can you roll it up and put it in your pack or pocket?

yes you can

 

[GrayEyes]

I was thinking about beret sizes (size in the sense of external diameter, plateau, or vuelo), and I wonder if there was a trend towards larger berets during the 20th century. I'm not talking about among traditional army units that wear military-style berets (e.g., chasseurs alpins) or country folk in the Basque lands, where sizable berets have always been common. I mean among other men who wear berets as fashion. Practical fashion perhaps, but still fashion (the way some men wear Stetsons or Borsalino fedoras).

Below are a series of images, roughly in chronological order. It seems that tight-fitting berets were popular in the 1920s, 1930s, and early 1940s. Larger sizes became more popular after World War II.


















I wonder why. Purely speculating: Did the beret lose popularity as a regular man's hat and become increasingly associated with intellectuals and artists, who then emulated the Basque style or who wanted something a little more outré? (Yes, I know there are exceptions to this seeming trend. Factory workers in Italy and others in eastern Europe still wore small-diameter berets through the 1960s. See below.)




But what do you think? Was there such a trend? And if so, why?

 

[Daan]

I was thinking about beret sizes (size in the sense of external diameter, plateau, or vuelo), and I wonder if there was a trend towards larger berets during the 20th century. I'm not talking about among traditional army units that wear military-style berets (e.g., chasseurs alpins) or country folk in the Basque lands, where sizable berets have always been common. I mean among other men who wear berets as fashion. Practical fashion perhaps, but still fashion (the way some men wear Stetsons or Borsalino fedoras).

Below are a series of images, roughly in chronological order. It seems that tight-fitting berets were popular in the 1920s, 1930s, and early 1940s. Larger sizes became more popular after World War II.

I wonder why. Purely speculating: Did the beret lose popularity as a regular man's hat and become increasingly associated with intellectuals and artists, who then emulated the Basque style or who wanted something a little more outré? (Yes, I know there are exceptions to this seeming trend. Factory workers in Italy and others in eastern Europe still wore small-diameter berets through the 1960s. )

But what do you think? Was there such a trend? And if so, why?

Interesting observations, but I believe the truth is more complicated than just larger plateaus gaining popularity over the years. 'In the beginning', the first users of berets on a large scale (apart from the Pyrenean shepherds), were the militias during the two Carlist Wars (Spain) and the regiment of Chasseurs Alpin later that century. Both wore (and as for the Chasseurs Alpin still wear) large diameter berets.

The first large scale users of small diameter berets, were the members of the British Tank Corps.

When the French 70th Chasseurs Alpins division were training with the British Tank Corps during the First World War, British General Elles considered their distinctive berets and thought these would also make practical headgear for his men. The flexible headdress allowed troops to work in extremely cramped conditions whilst providing some protection to the head. Furthermore, Elles is said to have suggested that the beret is convenient for sleeping in. However, he considered the "Tarte" of the Chasseurs Alpin too sloppy, so the British beret was based largely on the size of the Scottish Tam ‘O Shanter.

During the interbellum, between the two World Wars, berets could be either small or large diameter - often stemming from tradition (Asturians for instance typically wore small plateau berets; Navarans large plateaus); practicality (high mountain shepherds chose large berets that offered good protection from rain, snow and sun; fishermen and sailors chose a small plateau that wouldn't get in the way of ropes or machinery and wouldn't easily be picked up by the wind), whereas the beret wearing middle class chose from personal preference, image and following trends by artists and writers.

French berets especially, after WWII, tend to be small diameters. Just search for vintage berets on sites like Ebay and you'll find many vintage labels in 8.5 to 9.5p. Typically, peoples heads tended to be smaller in size too! The average size I sell through South Pacific Berets is probably 59, whereas in 1950's France the average was 53-55! No rule, but in general one can say that boineros with smaller head sizes tend to wear smaller plateaus and vice versa.

I don't believe that gauchos are a huge role model for many, but they certainly helped making the (very) large diameter berets more popular. Many of my customers buy berets after seeing, or experiencing, wearing berets in South America - typically plato grandes.

These days, based on my sales, I couldn't possibly say large is more popular than small, or v.v. The most common plateau I sell is probably 10p (28cm), right in the middle. Both the Foulards Alpin by Boneteria Auloronesa and the Plato Grandes from Argentina and Uruguay helped gaining popularity for the large plateaus over the last few years.

Meanwhile, in armed forces across the world, there is a definite trend to go smaller and smaller - the French Foreign Legion setting the tone with berets that are so small, they're hard to keep on the head.

 

[RJR]

Interesting observations,Daan.

 

[Daan]

Sad news for the many fans of Argentinian berets, or 'boinas'.

For the last 8 months I have not been able to re-stock any of the boinas Espinosa and Tolosa Tupida and many models/colours have now sold out.

Very sad indeed, as these berets are among the best daily wear berets one can find. I would hate to see these disappear, but fear that the present stock may be the very last.

On the Berets Facebook page, I regularly post updates on numbers still available; most that are, are in the lower single digits only.

Nice from a sales perspective, but really, I find it very sad to see all the "SOLD OUT" notices under the various models.

 

[Trenchfriend]

Wonderful thread!!

I always liked to buy a beret, but today I've done it!

At home, I've tested different ways of wearing it.

1. The simple way, pull over like a classic winter-toque:
-Oh no!! That makes me looking, like I'm going to be a french female! :eeek:

2. The tilt backwards-diagonal-style:
-Doesn't work, too. Looks way freaky.

3. The old-fashion-"artist-way", tilt forwards-diagonal, with a fine little militarian touch (not too much!):
-That's it!! Man, this works!:rockon:

 

[foamy]

Wonderful thread!! snip...
3. The old-fashion-"artist-way", tilt forwards-diagonal, with a fine little militarian touch (not too much!):
-That's it!! Man, this works!:rockon:

Yup. Fun thread and having gone through the same "fitting" process, I've arrived at the same conclusion. Though, I've got a good bit more forehead grip going on. You look great in yours!

The one with the sweat band will leave a mark across my forehead, the bandless one—no worries of that sort. I also increased the diameter with the second one. Style-wise, I'm undecided as to which I like better. I think they need some weather on them so they relax a bit.

 

[Trenchfriend]

Thanks!

 

[Trenchfriend]

By the way:

Leonard Cohen - The Partisan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--bxTVx8L8E

 

[Daan]

Johnny Gallagher, Irish Bluesman

Widely acknowledged as one of the finest guitar players in Ireland & the UK, Johnny Gallagher is first and foremost an explosive live entertainer. He has scorched his way through shows all over Europe and is held in awe by musicians and fans alike in his native Ireland.

His live shows with the powerful Boxtie Band feature a trawl through his own original material interspersed with stunning personal versions of songs from the likes, Lynyrd Skynrd, Hendrix, Peter Green among others.

Though privately quiet and unassuming, Johnny oozes charisma and excitement on stage with that indefinable and much sought after "larger than life" presence. He can change from full on aggressive rock to quieter moments of more tender, introspective music, and in the course of a set he shows his wizardry on both electric and acoustic guitars.

To top it all, Johnny possesses truly unique and expressive voices which showcases his songs with the dynamics to swoop from a scream to a whisper. And always with beret, naturally.
[video=youtube;mKc6-bqN41A]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKc6-bqN41A[/video]

 

[RJR]

It looks good,imo.

 

[Trenchfriend]

First walkaround with beret, today.

-no itching with the felt-edge on forehead
-absolutely no shifting
-nice warming effect, because of the "air-buffer" under the beret, I think
-so lightweight, that I doesn't felt it along the way

 

[GrayEyes]

there seems to be a consensus here that berets without headbands are more comfortable than berets with headbands. and there is sentiment that if one is to wear a headbanded beret, the "garni cuir" model from the manufacture de berets boneteria auloronesa is exquisitely comfortable.

does anyone have opinions of the headbands used by elosegui, laulhère and previously blancq-olibet?

i realize that vinyl and artificial leather have great disadvantages, so i am asking only about the models that have piel auténtica and cuir véritable.

merci.

 

[Daan]

there seems to be a consensus here that berets without headbands are more comfortable than berets with headbands. and there is sentiment that if one is to wear a headbanded beret, the "garni cuir" model from the manufacture de berets boneteria auloronesa is exquisitely comfortable.

does anyone have opinions of the headbands used by elosegui, laulhère and previously blancq-olibet?

i realize that vinyl and artificial leather have great disadvantages, so i am asking only about the models that have piel auténtica and cuir véritable.

merci.

I can only agree with you; the headbands used by Boneteria Auloronesa are completely different from any other beret manufacturer. The bérets garnis cuir have a headband made of the same leather that is used in the most luxurious French cars, providing a very comfortable fit from a supple and soft leather band. This is quite different from the headbands used by Laulhère and Boinas Elósegui (and others), which are rigid and stiff in comparison. There is a good reason for this too; as most berets shrink over time, they need a rigid band to maintain the size of the head-opening. Artisan manufacturer Boneteria Auloronesa found a way to avoid this shrinkage and therefore can fit a much softer leather band. It is one of the great advantages of this beret over others.

There are more differences. Both Laulhère and Boinas Elósegui use a variety of headbands, some more comfortable than others (the higher the price of the beret, the more comfortable/high quality the headband). All Laulhère's headbands are leather (these days), Boinas Elósegui fits leather bands on their higher quality models - vinyl on the Exposición Basica.

The cheaper bands tend to be made of plain leather with a satin lined edge, while the more luxurious bands have a "brake" fitted; the satin string that is sewn on the middle of the entire headband helps prevent the beret lifting of the head in a strong gust of wind, acting as a brake.
Most headbands, vinyl and leather, have poor sweat absorption, which can be unpleasant on warm days or when climbing a hill.
The headbands used by Blancq-Olibet in their last years were notorious for inadequate sizing and, personally, I found the headbands not comfortable at all. The leather is prone to cracking and the stitching is unpleasant against the forehead.

Last, the headbands of military berets (over the edge of the woolen head-opening of the beret) are typically made of goat's or lambs leather, adding comfort and elasticity to the band.
Still, apart from the sized berets made by Boneteria Auloronesa, I believe that headband-less (or "One Size", "Universal" models) are superior in comfort to headbanded berets; they don't crack. don't leave a sweaty imprint on the forehead, are always the right comfortable size (once 'broken in') and are easy to roll up and fit in your pocket.