Attorneys and Barristers of the Lounge

[martinsantos]

Hello all.

I'm a lawyer here in São Paulo, Brazil. Work only with criminal procedings. I also work with criminal analisys, after 5 years at São Paulo State's prosecuters (but now, of course, writing my relatories to another lawyers. I'm one of very few here to work with this).

 

[Harp]

Welcome Martin.

Ever read Commonwealth of Massachusetts vs Woodward?
The mens of an immature defendant; premeditation's exactitude; deliberate intent;
a trespass judgement non obstente veredicto.
An infant's tragic death and the obstruction of Justice.
Discussed this case yesterday-varied consensus.
And the defendant, I understand, later became a lawyer....

 

[martinsantos]

How can I read this? I'm curious!

Here we do not use the common law, and of course we usually don't have much access about US Court's decisions.

This proceding is a homicide?

It's the only kind of proceding here with jury - and I just love this.

 

[Harp]

How can I read this? I'm curious!

Here we do not use the common law, and of course we usually don't have much access about US Court's decisions.

Woodward dates back to 1997; received considerable publicity
beyond legal cite, and can be readily found through Lexis or
Google search of Massachusetts Reports (427 Mass.659 5/16/98).
W still controversial and unsettling for many reasons; find this case
particularly disturbing; especially JNOV.

 

[Harp]

Supreme Court of The State of Illinois
Walter P. Maksym et al, v. The Board of Election Commissioners
:icon_smil

Rahm Emanuel and the race for Mayor of Chicago
Justice for $ale.[angel]

 

[martinsantos]

I have two appeals in my front. From different procedings, different prosecuters and... Just the same text. Two extense, boring and exacly the same 59-page appeals.

This is usual in your countries too? And you think this imoral? Can the enourmous amount of work led to this industrial line in criminal procedings?

 

[Harp]

I have two appeals in my front... Two extense, boring and exacly the same 59-page appeals.

This is usual in your countries too?

Yes.
"Lawyers spend a great deal of time shoveling smoke."
Oliver Wendell Holmes :mmph::ballchain:

 

[martinsantos]

:eusa_clap

Great Holmes.

I wonder what he would say if lived in a world of Crtl+C and Crtl+V...

(OK, some texts are repetitive - but can't see this in criminal procedings).

Yes.
"Lawyers spend a great deal of time shoveling smoke."
Oliver Wendell Holmes :mmph::ballchain:

 

[Harp]

Holmes would advise, "Carve every word before you let it fall."

 

[Dodo]

I'm a lawyer in Italy, close to Rome. Nice to meet you, fellows

 

[Adcurium]

Welcome, Dodo. Member of the Rhose Island, USA bar.

 

[C-dot]

Bump!

When I last posted here I was a student, with aspirations of criminal law. Now I'm a practising paralegal... In civil lit lol

Love to catch up with the old crowd, and meet the new faces!

 

[Harp]

When I last posted here I was a student, with aspirations of criminal law. Now I'm a practising paralegal... In civil lit lol

"Quae enim disciplina..tam ornata atque...tam aurea ut ius civile?"

What discipline can match the civil law for its expression and sheer quality?

Lorenzo Valla

welcome back

 

[ChiTownScion]

Welcome to the Lawyers in Lids Room Atticus. Wasn't brother Finch a defence lawyer??

I've been doing a bit of reading on the sad case of Alton Logan from Chicago over recent months - a wrongful conviction case that saw an innocent guy put away for 26 years till recently. It wasn't the prosecutors fault - or the defence either. Just lots of people trapped in a system that wouldn't even allow the truth to be told. The case is worth a read. It challenges all of us in law to lift the bar.

Now...how about some pics of those fedoras??

Crikey!! Wading through the old threads and I find a reference to one of the cases handled in my division by my friend and colleague, Harold Winston. We worked together in the Office of the Cook County Public Defender. The Alton Logan case was one of his more memorable victories. Two of the other principals in the case, Dale Coventry and Jamie Kunz, are also respected colleagues.

I served in that office for over 30 years, and finally retired. Tried cases for 20 years, and spent roughly the last ten doing mainly post conviction cases. I now have a small general practice to keep me active: it keeps me in one or two Brooks Brothers suits a year and perhaps an Art Fawcett fedora. Doubt that I'll ever stop practicing altogether: "lawyer" is not just what I do, it's who I am.

 

[Atticus Finch]

Well. I've been talking about it for years, and now its here. I am eligible for retirement at the end of this month. So, sometime in the near future I'll probably switch sides of the courtroom and try my hand at low-level defense work. I've always heard that you can't practice law part time. But I'm gonna try!

AF

 

[Harp]

I served in that office for over 30 years, and finally retired. Tried cases for 20 years, and spent roughly the last ten doing mainly post conviction cases. I now have a small general practice to keep me active:....

pro bono jack leg stuff?

 

[ChiTownScion]

pro bono jack leg stuff?

Mainly divorce, custody, support, and other post decree domestic matters to date. I never bill for all of the hours that I actually put in so, yeah, I suppose that it can play out as "pro bono" on some level. I've learned the hard way to always charge something for my work, even if it isn't full rate: people don't seem to appreciate freebies.

 

[ChiTownScion]

Well. I've been talking about it for years, and now its here. I am eligible for retirement at the end of this month. So, sometime in the near future I'll probably switch sides of the courtroom and try my hand at low-level defense work. I've always heard that you can't practice law part time. But I'm gonna try!

AF

Best decision that I've ever made was taking retirement. Between CLE seminars, professional responsibility insurance and bar association fees, I don't net a lot practicing PT, but I'm having a lot more fun with the law than ever. The pressure to bill for every micro-minute is not part of the equation, and you're really in a great position to go that extra mile for a client without costing them too much.

 

[Atticus Finch]

...people don't seem to appreciate freebies.

This has been my experience, also.

I have always much preferred dealing with retained attorneys. When a client pays a lawyer five or ten grand to handle a case, they tend to follow their lawyer's advice...even when that advice is to plead guilty to some reasonable offer. On the other hand, defendants seldom listen to their court-appointed attorney. They often insist on a trial and end up serving twice the time that they were offered at the front end of the case.

AF

 

[ChiTownScion]

I've actually won cases for clients whose thanks at the end were pretty superficial. As if they were, of course, entitled to prevail and my role was that of a mere incidental.