Antongiavanni Article on Super Wool

[Dagwood]

I couldn't decide whether to put this new thread in News or Suits. I ultimately decided on News since the article by Nicholas Antongiavanni doesn't really address the "vintage" style.

Anyways, a really interesting read from Antongiavanni called "The Controversy Over Super Wool." Here is the link: (http://www.american.com/archive/2007/may-june-magazine-contents/the-controversy-over-super-wool)

Antongiavanni notes, in part: "Successful marketing has convinced too many men that the Super number is a measure not only of great wool but also of great tailoring. Both of these conclusions are untrue. In addition, the Supers fixation may have served to undermine the very industry it was hyped to support. There are signs—small signs—that the clothing industry may be waking up to the danger posed by the Super monster it has created. But other signs suggest it may be too late."

He also notes: "Other men have learned from hard experience that the Supers are irritatingly prone to become shiny or to wear through. Still others wonder why their $4,000 suits are rippling and wrinkling, and they look with envy on harder-wearing stuff that lies smoothly on the body."

I hope you find the article as interesting as I did.

 

[Jay]

Strangely, it appears that people do care about how their suits look, and perhaps the garment and related articles will have a complete renaissance after all. I was under the impression that the suit, since being unchanged from the 50s or so onwards, was a sure sign that it was on it's way out and ready to fall into irrelevance.

 

[scotrace]

This is a great article. Baron Kurtz: be sure to take the link.

"Rubinacci is dealing with a rarefied level of customer, one who always wants “the best” and often enters the store bent on buying the highest Super number at hand. Still, for those who know better, or who can be educated, Rubinacci will bring out special heavyweight hopsacks woven the old-fashioned way in England, exclusively for his firm. The most discerning and favored customers are walked across the Via Filangeri to a warehouse where vintage cloth—some pieces from as far back as the 1930s—is stored. These are about as far from the Supers as you can get. Some customers treat the room like a shrine. Others don’t get the appeal. “Not everyone understands,” Rubinacci shrugs."

 

[Orgetorix]

The Controversy Over Super Wool

The Controversy Over Super Wool

an article on suiting fabrics by our own Manton.

 

[Flitcraft]

“Not everyone understands,” Rubinacci shrugs."

Amen, Signor Rubinacci, Amen!

 

[Marc Chevalier]

... a warehouse where vintage cloth—some pieces from as far back as the 1930s—is stored. ... Some customers treat the room like a shrine.

But moths want to treat it like a restaurant.

.

 

[Shaul-Ike Cohen]

But moths want to treat it like a restaurant.

Look, dear, a 1936 two-thread. Excellent vintage, and well stored. Mariano, we'll have two of those! (Munch, munch...)

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Moths seem to l-o-o-v-e old, fine wool.

.

 

[iammatt]

This is a great article. Baron Kurtz: be sure to take the link.

"Rubinacci is dealing with a rarefied level of customer, one who always wants “the best” and often enters the store bent on buying the highest Super number at hand. Still, for those who know better, or who can be educated, Rubinacci will bring out special heavyweight hopsacks woven the old-fashioned way in England, exclusively for his firm. The most discerning and favored customers are walked across the Via Filangeri to a warehouse where vintage cloth—some pieces from as far back as the 1930s—is stored. These are about as far from the Supers as you can get. Some customers treat the room like a shrine. Others don’t get the appeal. “Not everyone understands,” Rubinacci shrugs."

The stock in there is really quite amazing. Much of what is left is sportcoat length, but some is very interesting. There are some excellent suitings dating back more to the 50s, 60s and 70s that are also wonderful.

 

[Orgetorix]

[grump]

I still say this should be in the Suits forum, where I started my thread.

[/grump]

 

[scotrace]

OK, agreed (moved).

 

[Matt Deckard]

Repeated from my post on AA

"Other men have learned from hard experience that the Supers are irritatingly prone to become shiny or to wear through. Still others wonder why their $4,000 suits are rippling and wrinkling, and they look with envy on harder-wearing stuff that lies smoothly on the body."

You don't have to wonder why... the wool is just inferior and doesn't wear well. Wrinkles faster, wears through and takes a shine in a short time -- inferior.

Thank you Manton. Well written. Thank goodness people are starting to shine the light on the myth of super wools being super wearing. I'm lucky in having the vintage wears I have and some fabric that is waiting to be made into just the right suit.

Silk should be silk and wool should be rough.

Good job!

Churchilll -- Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
__________________

 

[Feraud]

Silk should be silk and wool should be rough.

These are words worth repeating.
It boggles the mind to think that people want no differentiation between fabrics. Should all fabrics feel "luxurious, soft as silk"?
Imagine all food tasting the same or everyone looking alike.
In a generation or two of these superfine fabrics, will anyone remember what wool, silk, or linen feels like? Men's wardrobe choices have been dumbed down enough.
Give us variety! Keep those silky soft fabrics for the babies bottoms and give me the option of a heavyweight wool.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Speaking of luxury....
I'm just really glad that the word is spreading that the, "finer the wool the higher the quality", is a misguiding statement.
http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=14718

 

[happyfilmluvguy]

Is there anyone who makes fabric that is as thick if not close to vintage cloth?

 

[Matt Deckard]

Yes... i have some modern cavalry twills that are pretty good, though when it comes to the old mill finished materials they all tend to be much softer and fater wearing than the vintage. According the the Row tailor with which i spoke, he uses vintage fabric because they don't make it that way anymore.

 

[Jovan]

I truly must know who this tailor is!

 

[Matt Deckard]

One of the ones I spoke with worked for Maurice Sedwell... He and Keith Levett from Henry poole. Kieth particularly is trying to keep around some of the old tailoring techniques on the row like body fit.

 

[cookie]

My experience of super fine woold

I have a coupla Italian suits in super 40s Tasmanian merino and they have to be ironed after use every time whereas traditional wool creases fall out after hanging:rage: .

 

[Jovan]

You mean 140s?

Interestingly enough, my experience with 140s was slightly better. The wrinkles would fall out pretty easily with some steam. I still hope I can find some decent 100s or lower at 10 oz.