Antarctic Clothing & Equipment

[greyhound68]

This is a fantastic thread. I really appreciate you all putting this stuff up. It sure did help with the knowledge of this area. Great job.

 

[Dudleydoright]

it certainly is evolving nicely !
There's more to some of us VLJers than flight jackets !!
Dudleydoright aka jacket_head aka Dave

 

[Fletch]

Thanks to all those who opined on Ventile.

It's hard to know where to draw the line sometimes between experience, legend, and marketing. We believe in the scientific and the new over here; we also have worse weather than you could ever imagine.

 

[Dudleydoright]

Hi, gentile has a high reputation in the UK. However, over here it is really undeserved as our climate is more wet than cold and dry so our fondness is more nostalgic than sensible. It WAS the best thing available before goretex. But to be honest goretex wins hands down for cold, wet & windy conditions. I'm happy to still use ventile because I like the idea of an Eco-friendly cotton and accept the drawbacks/compromises.

I have lived in Calgary, Alberta for six years and as a surveyor by profession and outdoor nut (the reason I moved there in the first place) and know all about cold weather and used ventile with great success. But I acknowledge that once you're below freezing any tight-weave cotton or poly cotton will do the job. Ventile wins where the temperature and precipitation vary from frozen to wet. ventile does get quite stiff when wet and even more so if it then freezes but does the job nicely.

I also happen to like the anorak design which is now seen as old fashioned and impractical - much as am I !!

Hope this personal opinion is of help.

Dave

 

[Creeping Past]

gentile

Arf.

And sorry for arfing.

 

[BellyTank]

Not a Kosher Anorak.

B
T

 

[gfirob]

Ventile (or Gentile to some)

It's interesting that Ventile really never seems to have caught on here in the states (where there are actually quite a lot of Gentiles too).

From what I can read about it in the UK, it seems as if some pretty nice jackets are still made from it, but they are not cheap. I guess it would be quieter than a lot of synthetics and just nicer to wear. Is it lighter than waxed cotton (like a Barbour Thornproof)?

Certainly if it's cold enough that wet is not going to be an issue, I guess it would probably be a good choice.

Rob

 

[Dudleydoright]

It's interesting that Ventile really never seems to have caught on here in the states (where there are actually quite a lot of Gentiles too).

From what I can read about it in the UK, it seems as if some pretty nice jackets are still made from it, but they are not cheap. I guess it would be quieter than a lot of synthetics and just nicer to wear. Is it lighter than waxed cotton (like a Barbour Thornproof)?

Certainly if it's cold enough that wet is not going to be an issue, I guess it would probably be a good choice.

Rob

Enough with the crucifying me for fat fingers already my boy !!

Rob, ventile is much quieter and drapes better than goretex et al.
There are several makers for ventile clothing in the UK. I know of none myself elsewhere in the world. The maker of the yellow anorak in one of the photos above is about to have another production run (of which i have an order in for one suit) but those anoraks are a lightweight tight-weave and waxy type of canvas. I have asked if they could do me an anorak in ventile if I supply it and they have said that they would

Some light weight, single layer garments are just meant to be used as a light windproof layer with showerproof capabilities and then there are double layer ventile jackets for seriously wet weather but I find that they are too heavy and too stiff compared to goretex for those conditions. Perhaps for hunters ? Although if it's that wet I'd still rather go with goretex under one of my old issue combat smocks.

A single layer ventile jacket is lighter than a wax cotton one as apart from the Barbour Durham, they need a lining to stop you getting wax all over your clothing. They also don't breathe anywhere near as well as ventile.

Hope that that helps ?

Dave

 

[H.Johnson]

Dave,

Do you know about the Dutch Army Goretex and Pertex fleece removeable drop-liner? If not, they are intended to button into the Parka, but can be worn as a 'stand-alone' waterproof/fairly warm inner layer or add buttons to the outer garment to allow it to button in.

They go for less than a tenner in surplus shops or SASS in Lancaster do them for about twice as much!

In lightweight mode I have had success wearing an Arctis Stowaway windshirt under a single layer Ventile(R) smock.

May I add that there are different grades and weights of Ventile(R)? Choosing the right grade for use to which the garment will be put is important and not all makers seem to do this...

<SNIP> Although if it's that wet I'd still rather go with goretex under one of my old issue combat smocks.
<SNIP>
Dave

 

[Dudleydoright]

'H',
Yep. I'm aware of teh pertex and other synthetic stuff that's out there and did use it for many years but I prefer merino wool next to the skin and a couple of think 100% wool jumpers for layering. They are more versatile and pack down WAY smaller than fleece/fibre pile etc. I just prefer natural materials.

And yes, I'm aware of the different weights of ventile as mentioned in my post above. Perhaps some other aren't .....? I've had them all over the years but prefer the heavyweight stuff myself as I only use it as an outer layer.

Horses for courses and I'm not trying to preach that my way is the best - just giving my opinion on what works for me and giving evidence as to why that is in an effort to show that I'm not someone who has only used it in the narrow weather confines of the UK.

Cheers,
Dave

 

[BellyTank]

...May I add that there are different grades and weights of Ventile(R)? Choosing the right grade for use to which the garment will be put is important and not all makers seem to do this...

Mr.Johnson-

which "grade" of Ventile(R) would you recommend for a simple Anorak,
for general use as a windproof layer?
And whom would you recommend as a supplier?


B
T

 

[pipvh]

And if this is a thread hijack please ignore, but how practical are the Royal Navy Ventile smocks as hiking gear? I understand they have a second layer of non-Ventile cotton which might be removeable, which would bring the weight down, but are they worth bothering with?

 

[Dudleydoright]

Since this thread is being hijacked and should be about Antarctica, I'm starting a thread on ventile ....................

Dave

 

[BellyTank]

Ahem- yes, sorry me.
This is how a dialogue develops, hopefully but of course,
it needs to be in the right place.


B
T

 

[Dudleydoright]

BT,
Several of us must share that guilt / burden. Myself included

This 'Antarctica' thread started out of a request from the 'Brad Pitt Anorak' thread and the new 'ventile' one from this.

Personally I think it's a good thing !

Now let's leave this thread for Antarctic clothing as I have several more items I want to photograph and publish on here. Has anyone else ?????

Dave

 

[pipvh]

Oh, brilliant. Thanks, Dave, and sorry for the derailment.

 

[gfirob]

Ventile toss to Antarctica

Actually, I think the Ventile conversation is quite interesting and it makes me wonder why it is so little known here. I think Willy's (?) in Alaska uses this fabric and Ibex in Vermont uses wool rather than any of the plastic fleece, but overall synthetic fabrics seem to rule the market here.

Thinking of this, I went and looked at a number of Frank Hurley's (photographer for Shackleton's 1914-1917 expedition) just to look at the clothing they were wearing. Its very interesting. First of all, there seems to be a lot of variety. Pea coats, fur, wool, big leather boots and some kind of harness that seems to have no other purpose than to hold on the huge fur mittens they wore. Maybe Dave knows more about these.

The final photographs of the men on Elephant Island show how everyone (and there clothes) are mostly just black and greasy from all that time in a hut heated only by burning seal blubber.

Anyway, I think I'll try to upload some of these pictures if I can. No gortex there...

Rob

 

[BellyTank]

Harness for pulling a sled?

B
T

 

[Dudleydoright]

The harness to which you refer was made of lampwick and was indeed made to secure the mitts to the body so you didn't lose them or put them down where they might get blown away. The mitts were too big to put into a pocket. This method is still used today as can be seen in some of the photos I posted earlier in this thread.

Sledge hauling harnesses fitted around the waist BTW.

I'll post photos when I'm back at a comp'.

Cheers
Dave

 

[The Good]

Actually, I think the Ventile conversation is quite interesting and it makes me wonder why it is so little known here. I think Willy's (?) in Alaska uses this fabric and Ibex in Vermont uses wool rather than any of the plastic fleece, but overall synthetic fabrics seem to rule the market here.

Thinking of this, I went and looked at a number of Frank Hurley's (photographer for Shackleton's 1914-1917 expedition) just to look at the clothing they were wearing. Its very interesting. First of all, there seems to be a lot of variety. Pea coats, fur, wool, big leather boots and some kind of harness that seems to have no other purpose than to hold on the huge fur mittens they wore. Maybe Dave knows more about these.

The final photographs of the men on Elephant Island show how everyone (and there clothes) are mostly just black and greasy from all that time in a hut heated only by burning seal blubber.

Anyway, I think I'll try to upload some of these pictures if I can. No gortex there...

Rob

Your post reminds me of a question I've been meaning to ask. Do any modern travelers and scientists to Antarctica still wear clothing of these types listed above? From my knowledge, it seems that near-everyone wears bright-colored synthetic anoraks/parkas. I was just curious if some still went forth wearing wool, leather, or fur clothing as the old-time explorers used to. Are those materials even allowed to be used in Antarctica nowadays, out of concern to safety?