An Intro to Hat Terminology: A Fedora Lounge Guide

[Rabbit]

Hi guys,
Every time I think I've got this pegged, something comes up that confuses me. So could someone set the record straight on what exactly a "snap brim" is? Comparisons to "shaped brim" would be much appreciated, along with a quick definition of "flange" and it's various forms. I know it's a big ask, but I think the answer would be quite valuable for this thread.

A snap brim is flanged so that it can be worn with the brim flipped up or with the brim flipped down in front. *
If the hat has a high flange, the brim will have a more pronounced curvature and therefore will snap more prominently. A flat brim all the way around has no snap to it whatsoever.
Shaped brim doesn't mean much. Brim are shaped into whatever form is desired, that's all there is to it.

* Of course the brim can also be worn flipped down all the way around, which was fairly common practice on 1920s fedoras.

 

[Mystic]

Hi Guys,

What would be the correct term for the thin material behind the sweatband? I think it's a barrier to lessen sweat from staining the ribbon and felt.

Maybe there is also common slang terms...or different terms from different hat makers.

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[Art Fawcett]

onionskin

 

[Mystic]

onionskin

Thanks Art

Would Onionskin be a Industry term for that part of a hat or a hat makers slang term?

Do you know if this name was ever used in advertising?

 

[Lynx]

so what is referred to as Bash?

is that the crown treatment?

 

[Art Fawcett]

so what is referred to as Bash?

is that the crown treatment?

Most hatters don't use the term "bash" but rather "crease" and yes, they both refer to the shape of the finished hat.

 

[Art Fawcett]

Thanks Art

Would Onionskin be a Industry term for that part of a hat or a hat makers slang term?

Do you know if this name was ever used in advertising?

It's the only term Ive ever heard Mystic referring to this material. It's almost impossible to find anymore. I'm told Marc Kidder found a source but isn't sharing it. I don't know how true that is. I'm sure that at some point in time the advertising would have been done in Hat Life or other trade magazines.

 

[scooter]

Hey guys, I guess taper is exactly what I thought, but after seeing another explanation quite some time ago, I was confused. I really appreciate the photo demonstration for clarification.

 

[Mystic]

It's the only term Ive ever heard Mystic referring to this material. It's almost impossible to find anymore. I'm told Marc Kidder found a source but isn't sharing it. I don't know how true that is. I'm sure that at some point in time the advertising would have been done in Hat Life or other trade magazines.

Any thoughts on a time frame that this material began to disappear from hats?

 

[Art Fawcett]

My gut tells me late 50's without researching it but could have gone into the 60s with custom hatters.

 

[Mystic]

My gut tells me late 50's without researching it but could have gone into the 60s with custom hatters.

Thanks for the info Art.

Late 50's early 60's sounds like a cost cutting thing by hat makers. Could be a reason why this material disappeared. It was no longer in demand and longer profitable.
But, with air conditioning everywhere and people spending less time outside, maybe the material was no longer as important of a feature in a hat.

Thanks again for you answers.

 

[gear-guy]

Great help

Thanks for the info. New to the lounge but have been wearing hats for a long time and now I now what everyone is talking about.

 

[tonyb]

Thanks for the info Art.

Late 50's early 60's sounds like a cost cutting thing by hat makers. Could be a reason why this material disappeared. It was no longer in demand and longer profitable.
But, with air conditioning everywhere and people spending less time outside, maybe the material was no longer as important of a feature in a hat.

Thanks again for you answers.

Cost-cutting measure? Maybe so, perhaps likely. But even when that onionskin moisture barrier was fairly commonly used, it wasn't always used, or even mostly used. At least not according to my wholly anecdotal, but still fairly extensive, experience with old hats.

 

[Rabbit]

Cost-cutting measure? Maybe so, perhaps likely. But even when that onionskin moisture barrier was fairly commonly used, it wasn't always used, or even mostly used. At least not according to my wholly anecdotal, but still fairly extensive, experience with old hats.

The onionskin, although a nice feature designed to keep the felt from getting sweat stains, had the disadvantage of trapping moisture in between the leather sweat and the onionskin - over time and with heavy usage of the hat.
I think Dinerman once pointed out that many of the ruined sweatbands he had come across were in fact equipped with the onionskin.

 

[suitedcboy]

I wonder if Onionskin really proved to be effective?
The sweat could still wick via attachment stitching. Was it a brylcreem barrier more than a sweat "fix"?

 

[howardeye]

This is a pic of a Dobbs 20 Stingy I have. Could someone tell me what is the white ribbon woven in the sweatband for and what is the little bow on the sweatband for? An explanation of the wind cord that is on the crown and how to use it would be appreciated also! Thank you.

 

[alanfgag]

These are all vestiges of an earlier time in hat construction. The sweatband bow and band snaking through the perfs in the rear of the sweatband might have been a method for adjusting the fit of the hat. But if you look behind the sweat you can see that they are not connected and are there for decorative purposes only. The little bow continues in hats to this day.

The wind trolley on the outside of the hat can be done in different ways. Often it is a cord with a button affixed at the outer end. The button could be put through a lapel buttonhole and the cord used as a tether should the wind take the hat off your head. I've never seen anyone do this, actually, but I assume it might work. A less common version has the button is fixed to the hat and the cord with a loop at the outer end which attaches to a button on your clothing and to the button on the hat when not in use. In either case, the cord is wound around the crown of the hat at the brim when not in use, which in my case, is all the time.

 

[danofarlington]

Another point of terminology that's important to mention--when eBay sellers say "wool," they mean "fur felt." So far I don't know what they call wool.

 

[tridentine]

I asked this question on another thread, but it mght be more appropriate here:
When did Borsalino stop stitching the "serrated edge" on to the front of their sweatbands?

 

[howardeye]

These are all vestiges of an earlier time in hat construction. The sweatband bow and band snaking through the perfs in the rear of the sweatband might have been a method for adjusting the fit of the hat. But if you look behind the sweat you can see that they are not connected and are there for decorative purposes only. The little bow continues in hats to this day.

The wind trolley on the outside of the hat can be done in different ways. Often it is a cord with a button affixed at the outer end. The button could be put through a lapel buttonhole and the cord used as a tether should the wind take the hat off your head. I've never seen anyone do this, actually, but I assume it might work. A less common version has the button is fixed to the hat and the cord with a loop at the outer end which attaches to a button on your clothing and to the button on the hat when not in use. In either case, the cord is wound around the crown of the hat at the brim when not in use, which in my case, is all the time.

Thank you very much and thanks to the guy who mentioned about the wool terminology on ebay. A hat I am interested in says it is wool. I am glad he did. Maybe it will keep other bidders away!